under_believer

Joined

• started 118 topics
• posted 1,767 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by under_believer

• 
  25

  3 Million year old pre-human found

  by monkeyshine in

  1. social
  2. current

  i don't know if anyone has posted this yet but...just in case.. .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  Sorry monkeyshine, the only reason I nitpicked is that there are many evolution deniers on this board and it's important to get the facts straight so as to give them less to criticize. Humans did not exist 3 million years ago, but it was long after we'd split off onto a different branch than chimpanzees and gorillas.
• 
  8

  accept their judgment of others. shunning

  by Ade in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  when one disasociates or is disfellowshipped surely the acceptance of the majority to shun from the view of the minority is of a sinful nature.

  this dawned on me today when walking home with the kids from school a member of the kingdom hall drove past us and waved ( at the kids - not making eye contact with me ) in fact i saw two members who did the same.

  the question that arose in my mind as i strolled home was this, these people are basing their apparent belief i am an apostate on an announcement made from the platform at the kingdom hall, this statement was obviously made by an elder etc.therefore they have all become judges against me without a case - for only the elders know of the conversation i had with them on the day i da'd.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  Flash, the question I have for you is: How did the Jews treat men of the nations and tax collectors? Jesus (the Bible's perfect example) seems to have given us a lead. How did he treat Matthew (a tax collector?) How did he treat the Samaritan woman (a woman of the nations?)
  For that matter, how did the Jews at large treat foreigners?
  
  Just something to think about. I'm not convinced that the words you quote dictate shunning.
• 
  25

  3 Million year old pre-human found

  by monkeyshine in

  1. social
  2. current

  i don't know if anyone has posted this yet but...just in case.. .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  Not really a human skeleton, though. The article calls it a pre-human.
• 
  13

  How Many Elders Does it Take to Screw in a Light Bulb?

  by Tutle in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the answer is zero!

  jehovah will do it for them at a specific year and month, then they shall receive "new light"!

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  Depends on how many elders can FIT in the lightbulb. Go head, think about it. :)
• 
  36

  The Faithful and Discreet Slave is posting on JWD

  by under_believer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  see for yourself.

  how do we know that he's the faithful and discreet slave?

  same way we know that the governing body represents the faithful and discreet slave: because he says so.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  We apparently are working on different definitions of the words "whining" and "bitching."
  
  I'm liking Finally-Free's suggestion more by the minute.
• 
  18

  Hospital ordered to give Jehovah's Witness transfusion

  by Gilberto in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  http://www.eveningecho.ie/news/bstory.asp?j=83890466&p=8389x768&n=83890846.

  hospital ordered to give jehovah's witness transfusion.

  21/09/2006 - 5:28:29 pm.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  Re: her adultness, I believe the deciding factor here was the life of her newborn child. I doubt this would have happened had she just been some random lady who wanted to bleed to death.
• 
  36

  The Faithful and Discreet Slave is posting on JWD

  by under_believer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  see for yourself.

  how do we know that he's the faithful and discreet slave?

  same way we know that the governing body represents the faithful and discreet slave: because he says so.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  > It would be nice if you offered to contribute to Simon the amount of money necessary to effect the modification to his website you desire, instead of expecting him to pay for your wishes.
  
  It would be nice if you didn't freak out if someone made an innocent suggestion. As far as donations go, show me the PayPal button.
• 
  5

  Would someone please post that new tract already?

  by WingCommander in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i want to read about how doomed i am according to the jw's.

  i also want to be ready at the door with questions, contradicting scriptures, and anything else i can think of when they show up to give me one.

  if they show up!

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  /sigh they really lose a lot of clarity with their one-size-fits-all approach to writing. They want to write a tract once and have it translated into 250 languages, but how bizzare does this statement sound to anyone in the Western world:
  
  "A widely respected religious figure, Jesus Christ..."
  
  Let's see, what else do we have here... How about the list of charges they mount against False Religion:
  
  * Meddles in War and Politics: The Society is guilty on both charges, observe the way they acted towards the Nazis before the WW2 broke out. And besides, saying you're no part of the world because you don't engage in politics, but then taking so many cases to the Supreme Court of many lands to affect the laws there is kind of splitting hairs, wouldn't you agree?
  
  * Spreads False Doctrine: It's easy to prove that the Society has spread false doctrine on many occasions in their history. The law of averages suggests that they are currently spreading false doctrine too. Do they get an exemption from this rule?
  
  * Tolerates Immoral Sex: Witnesses may disfellowship gays, lesbians, and people who have sex out of wedlock, but only when they catch them. The fact that they termed it "tolerates" is telling. They know they can't say that Witnesses are cleaner than non-Witnesses, they can only say that they don't "tolerate" sexual uncleanness. The truth is that "Jehovah's Clean People" are no cleaner than "worldly" people. And the Society has a history of tolerating the most immoral kind of sex of all, pedophilia, with their application of an ancient "two witnesses" rule, a rule that is almost impossible to satisfy in pedophilia cases. This means that pedophiles are routinely effectively sheltered and parents with small children are not notified that pedophiles are present, since the pedophiles are "Biblically" innocent.
  
  Then the tract breaks into typical subjective, theoretical interpretation of Revelation (i.e. the "harlot" is false religion, the "beast" is the world political system, etc...) None of this is objectively proveable, it's just a guess. And you will note that this tract doesn't identify the Beast as the United Nations anymore. Possibly this is because the United Nations is a debating society without any actual political power, and the application of the Beast of Revelation to it never made sense in the first place.
  
  Then what do we have? Ah the qualifications for True Religion. If you read these qualifications you will notice that they are vague, slippery beasts that could apply to almost anyone. To prove that they fit these qualifications, they quote a "worldly" book, Holocaust Politics, saying that if more people had been Witnesses, there never would have been a holocaust. (!!!)
  
  Interestingly for a tract that is supposed to prove that the end of False Religion is near, this tract establishes no reasons for urgency, no explanations why this destruction is nearer now than it was the last time this exact same tract was published in 1973/1974.
  
  Nice try, Society, but no cigar. Buh-bye.
• 
  2

  Scott Berkun essay: How To Detect BS

  by under_believer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in this excellent essay, software developer scott berkun details many good bs detection techniques.

  the essay has a business- and development-related focus, but many of the tips are general and useful in breaking down claims from anyone, including religious claims.

  here's one telling excerpt: .

  1. 
  2. 
• 

  under_believer

  In this excellent essay, software developer Scott Berkun details many good BS detection techniques. The essay has a business- and development-related focus, but many of the tips are general and useful in breaking down claims from anyone, including religious claims. Here's one telling excerpt:
  
  ***********
  "Our dynamic flow capacity matrix has unprecedented downtime resistance protocols."
  
  If you don't understand what the hell this means, err on your own side. Don't assume you're missing something: assume they are. They're either hiding something, communicating poorly, or don't themselves understand what they're talking about. BS deflating responses include:
  
  * I refuse to accept this proposal until I, or someone I trust, fully understands it.
  * Explain this in simpler terms I can understand (repeat if necessary).
  * Break this into pieces you can verify, prove, compare, or demonstrate for me.
  * Are you trying to say "our network server has a backup power supply?" If so, can you speak plainly next time?
  ***********
• 
  12

  Do the Governing Body members go out in field service?

  by Woofer in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  don't know why i just thought of that.

  do they go or are the "exempt" from going from door to door?.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  under_believer

  The story was that for some of these uber old GB guys who are basically just drooling vegetables, but are still clinging to life, they just get wheeled out onto the sidewalk in their wheelchairs. Someone sets a couple of magazines on their chest, and they go to sleep. They count time for it. Some people have referred to it as "wheelchair witnessing."