detective

Joined

• started 50 topics
• posted 1,004 times   see topics posted on
• send a message

Posts by detective

• 
  7

  Exit Counseling: Your experiences?

  by detective in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  since the topic came up on another thread, let's give it a go of it's own.

  what experiences have you had with exit counselling?

  have you tried to counsel others?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Hi,
  since the topic came up on another thread, let's give it a go of it's own. What experiences have you had with exit counselling? Have you tried to counsel others? Any success? What have you tried? What worked/failed?
• 
  8

  help with ngo!!!

  by mindfield in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi everyone!

  well, im a newbie here, so ill make this short!

  ive showed my mom the ngo status the watchtower shared with the un for 10 years now... of course, shes now denying it was a bad decision... she says the un is bad as a whole, but joining in as an ngo is okay since its not directly with the un... any tips?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Well, in defense of all those who may have shot themselves in the foot I'd like to offer my experience. I have read both books by Steve Hassan, numerous articles on cult thought, tons of history and research on the organization and additional biblical companions/guides. That, combined with visiting site after site on the organization. I had been actively dropping subtle hints to get my friends wheels turning but did so in such a way that my friend didn't even notice. Finally, I knew I was getting the heave-ho for creating "dissonance", not for anything I doing, mind you, but just for the fact that I exist outside the realm of the organization. So I knew I had only one last chance left. Was it how I wanted it to be? Did it go exactly as I planned? Nope. All I can do is hope that my words had some effect. Sowing those seeds, if you will. I guess I'll see how that turns out in the end.
  I guess my point is that every situation is different. If you jump the gun here or there, all is not necessarily lost. Or, you could do everything perfectly and have it backfire. No guarantees. I think you're right to encourage people to be careful and not rush into exit counselling, but let's not decimate someone who cared enough to try to get the ball rolling. They'll be kicking themselves if it really screwed things up, so we don't need to add to it. This isn't a situation most people are prepared for- this getting someone out of a cult! Maybe we should start a thread devoted to tips on exit-counselling. I'd offer to start it myself but after my recent foray into it, I'd rather let someone who can absolutely say they were successful start such a thread. Unfortunately, for the moment, I have no idea of my "success rate". Aw heck, maybe I'll start the thread and people can give some insights...
• 
  9

  annointed, part of this world, war, signs - HELP!

  by concerned fiance in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi, in a continued effort to educate my fiance and open his eyes, i am trying to understand how to refute certain things he has said and get proof of some of the issues that i have read on various threads here over the past week.

  please, please, can people answer back on how i should respond.... 1. in franz's book, he doesn't come out and say that he was one of the annointed, but yet he accepted a position as a member of the gb (my fiance spoke to franz last week and asked him a question regarding being annointed, to which franz answered "well, i had the a heavenly hope that i was annointed.." well, that threw my fiance off and now he doubts whether franz ever truly believed he was annointed.

  i have told him that noone can ever prove if they were annointed, but he says that the annointed "just know, they have that feeling and know without a doubt that they will be in heaven with god and jesus.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Concerned,
  Try the United Nations thing. Have the website and phone number ready. It is so significant. Read the UN/NGO thread. It's big news. And it's a real eye-opener!
• 
  43

  Fallout Over The WT-UN Contraversey

  by Ranchette in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  yes, fallout has already begun (literally)over the wt-un contraversey!.

  a long time jw friend of ours told my husband today that he has already disassociated himself from the organization after seeing the proof of wt's immoral affair with the beast.. this was the last straw for him.. i wonder how many others this info is going to effect this way?.

  we will see.. ranchette

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  I've posted this on another thread but I'll tell it again. My JW friend was fairly unphased by the news that the watchtower was riding the back of the beast. He chaulked it up to "lying is okay if it furthers the preaching work". He may not get the implications of it all. Some rank and file members might not really be able to understand the significance of the U.N. finding! In reality, I had slapped him with a variety of things he didn't know about his own religion so I'm sure he was reeling over the "new light" he had received already and couldn't get a grasp on magnitude of all the information. It seems like it's a losing battle what with the terrorist attacks and his overwhelming fear be capitalized on by the organization. The only hope I have is that I planted a seed of thought that will grow at some point. On the up side, the witnesses are gossiping about the U.N. banning all religion so I know that he won't be able to hear the talk of the United Nations without having a little something nagging at the back of his mind.
• 
  4

  A picture of heaven on earth.....

  by Stealth in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.pagesbyjustme.com/lake82.html .

  be sure to turn your speakers up as you enjoy.

  if you scoll down you will see the reflection of gods glory as the word "watchtower" sparkels in the hudson bay.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  It's not idoltry. Repeat after me, it's not idoltry. It's not idoltry. Really, it's not idoltry. Keep repeating this phrase until you believe it.
• 
  8

  Onslow family loses JW daughter in attack .

  by nicolaou in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  friday, september 28, 2001 .

  onslow family loses daughter in attack.

  jacksonville high grad worked on 102nd floor of world trade center .

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Yes, it's so sad that the clergy only offered bottled water and not oodles of scriptures. Shame on them for putting their religious agendas on the backburner and just helping out fellow human beings. On a side note, I wonder why the witnesses didn't mention the death toll God will inflict at Armageddon. Isn't that considered comforting enough? Oh yes, anything to further the preaching work. Anything at all...
• 
  12

  I need your advice

  by cecil in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i need your advice: i have written a letter to my branch office regarding my problems with the 607-chronology 60+ pages with short references about the issue, that i have collected through the past 9-10 years.

  at the end of my letter i asked 14 questions 7 questions regarding the biblical evidence against the 607 bce-chronology and 7 questions regarding the historical and astronomical evidence against it.. the letter i received as an answer did not contain anything that could qualify as an answer or even an attempt to answer my questions.

  i called the branch office by phone and talked to the brother who had written the answer.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Mailmum,
  Cutting and pasting responses greatly reduces your witnessing time. It would be better if you could address each thread individually. This will maiximize the time that you can count.
  Remember, you're not just cheating yourself out of valuable time, you're cheating Jehovah. Isn't love for Jah worth more than the quick fix cut and paste?
• 
  80

  Nov. 8 Awake - Wife Beaters-Sick

  by MrMoe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i will let you all hang who ever the heck wrote this crap.

  november 8, 2001 awake page 9: some battered women may need to seek assistance from the authorities.

  at times, a point of crisis-such as intervention of the police-can cause an abusive man to see the seriousness of the action.. page 12: should the battered wife leave her husband?

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Risk Indicators (page 7 November 8, 2001 AWAKE

  1. The man has previous involvement with domestic violence

  ~~Would this be something he mentions during the group outings or should he wait until they are on a chaperoned date before mentioning this?

  2. He is out of work.

  ~~And, if he grew up in the trooth he's under-educated. That doesn't bode well for hasty re-employment.
  3. He uses illegal drugs at least once a year

  ~~Week long drug binges every year and a half don't qualify as a risk indicator. But does he smoke???

  4. When he lived at home, he saw his father hit his mother.

  5. The couple are not married, they cohabit.

  ~~Don't shack up. What do you expect but beatings when you act like a whore? Luckily, to avoid injury you can just wave that magical piece of paper otherwise known as a marriage license. Yup, that'll save you.

  6. If employed, he has a low-paying job.
  7. He did not graduate from high-school.

  ~~People who are discouraged from going to college don't usually don't earn the big bucks. Even better when they drop out of high school to put Jehovah ahead of worldly pursuits.

  9. One or both use violence toward children in the home.

  ~~Does emotional abuse count as violence?

  10. Income is below poverty level.

  ~~Pioneering doesn't put food on the table.

  11. The man and woman are from different cultural background

  ~~misogyny and bigotry! What will they think of next?
• 
  2

  'Fess up! Who's messing with the Great Crowd?

  by detective in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  naughty, naughty.

  it's not like some witnesses come to ex-jw boards and start trouble!

  from greatcrowd:.

  1. 
  2. 
• 

  detective

  Naughty, naughty. It's not like some witnesses come to ex-jw boards and start trouble! Well... nevermind.

  From Greatcrowd:

  Please do not open any e-mail from unknown senders. SOMEONE named Baitzer is blitzing our e-mails at GC. Use your common sense and do not debate with False Religion. That is not the purpose of Greatcrowd.
  Just delete any incoming mail from unknown persons. These e-mail addys here at Greatcrowd are for Members Only. Anyone infringing on these rights are rude and arrogant.

  Thank you, Admin. Greatcrowd.com, Meekasu

  Hi Meeka...
  I got one from this Robin person, but didn't open it except to see where she had the audacity to refer to herself as one of "us"...sent her an email back and asked her to desist from sending email to me since they would be immediately deleted... and to read Acts 5:39...then I deleted it! Such a pity, someone has nothing better to do than try and poison persons of true faith with apsotate garbage! Philia love to all you true servants of Jehovah! Thanks for the heads up, sis!
  _________________
  What do you think? Is it okay to infiltrate their boards to "witness" to them? Opinions?
• 
  501

  UNITED NATIONS , NGO's and WTBS

  by MacHislopp in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  following the link given by kent,.

  i have several observation to make:.

  (from the link : http://www.un.org/moreinfo/ngolink/brochure.htm).

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  detective

  Hawk,
  I was surprised that my friend seemed unmoved by what I said about the united nations. I guess I probably threw him for a lopp in lots of ways because I gave him a mini-intervention with lots of information. I talked about things he knew nothing about- organ transplants, shunning policies, Malawi and Mexico, old prophets returning. I really stressed the United Nations issue. I asked him why he thought it was okay but I think he was still reeling from the new insights I offered him. He's definitely using the "it's okay to lie to further preaching work" but perhaps he didn't really get the implications. All I can do is hope that somehow, some way, he'll get the larger picture. I did slip once when I asked him if it wasn't a bit sleazy to smear other religions for the exact same thing his religion is doing but he just kept talking about how it's okay to lie...
  Funny thing is, he mentioned tax avoidance. I guess it's okay to lie and cheat for "truth".
  Please, please, please...please let him figure this out! My best friend is gone. Please let me keep believing it was worth it.
  This U.N. thing is huge. Tell me he's smart enough to figure it out! I figure the U.N. has to be coming up in conversation now. Let him piece it together. I'm so sad.