Posts by PrimateDave

42

Why be obedient to god?

by nicolaou in

if a creator god is real and he is the source of life well then i would certainly acknowledge that and give him thanks for my existence and for the universe i live in.

but obedience?.

my mum and dad gave me life, ensured my education, looked after my health and wellbeing, loved me, taught me the value of kindness and friendships and so much more.

"But God actually demands obedience, he even threatens death to those who disobey." - Nicolaou

Hierarchical control methods. How else can you force ignorant, superstitious people to obey priesthoods who cannot show the face of their god(s) except through the use of idols, magic tricks, and made up stories (holy scriptures?). Government and religion unified to enforce human law as coming from "god(s)". They say, "God made this law. You may only sacrifice in an approved location. Failure to comply will result in death."

These control methods have been very effective in appropriating the energies of the masses to the benefit of a relatively few humans. Only in the past century or two have governments been able to effectively maintain control without appealing to their "divine right".

Put in perspective, no one alive today is obedient to god(s), just man made control structures designed to control through fear, desire, and attachment.

Dave (who hopes his scattered thoughts on the matter make some sense)

6

The word 'Bethel', how appropriate

by *jeremiah* in

sorry if this has been discussed before.. also i haven't done a ton of research but was recently curious about the name bethel after by little bro asked me about it.. wts claims it means "house of god".

however, just from a few quick searches it has several meanings and connotations.

many are pagan in nature.

PrimateDave

I don't know about the Wikipedia, but the word Beth-El does mean "House [of] God". The point is that it doesn't say which god. To understand my point better read this excerpt from Is It God's Word? by Joseph Wheless, from chapter 9, "The Pagan God - And Gods - Of Israel":

THE HEBREWS WERE HEATHENS

That the Hebrews had the same God and gods as the peoples around them, and were thus pagan idolaters or "heathen," their own Scriptures declare many times. Up to the reputed times of Moses this fact is indisputable, on the face of the record. Until the traditional "giving of the law" to Moses on Sinai, there is not the slightest hint in the Hebrew Scriptures, covering a space of 2500 years, that the El or Yahveh of the patriarchs was different from any other El, or had or claimed any different cult or form of worship. He never made any such intimation in all his reputed appearances and talks with men, from Adam to Abraham, and from Abraham to Moses.

That the patriarchs down to the time of Moses were ordinary idolatrous heathen is perfectly apparent from the inspired texts. As we have noted, Father Abraham was of Ur of the Chaldees, "the land of his nativity" (Gen. xi, 28); and presumably from the silence of the record had never heard of Yahveh until the God appeared to him at Haran and told him to emigrate to Canaan (Gen. xii, 1), though he had already voluntarily done so (Gen. xi, 31). The Chaldeans were Syrians, certainly not "peculiar" votaries of the God Yahveh, but ordinary idol-worshipping heathens, as naturally were also the ancestors and family of Abram, and all their fellow Syrians, as they are expressly called. Laban, the father-in-law of Isaac, is called "Laban the Syrian" (Gen. xxxi, 20, 24), and he and his family worshipped teraphim (Gen. xxxi, 30-35). Laban was "son of Bethuel the Syrian" (Gen. xxviii, 5); the name Bethu-el shows that "El" was a common Syrian or Chaldean god, who continued as God of the three patriarchs. Abram's grandson Jacob is called "a Syrian about to die" (Deut. xxvi, 5) when he migrated to Egypt, 250 years after Abraham. It was therefore seventy Syrians who went into Egypt, speaking the Chaldean tongue, and becoming in 430 years good pagan Egyptians. After Jacob and his family of seventy migrated to Egypt, he and all his people continued regularly to worship "the gods which your fathers served on the other side of the flood [i.e., in Syria or Chaldea], and in Egypt" (Josh. xxiv, 14). After 430 years in Egypt, worshipping the ancient local gods, Moses had never even heard of the El-Yahveh: when he first met the strange God, at the burning bush, Moses had to ask: "What is thy name?" (Ex. iii, 13)

(http://www.infidels.org/library/historical/joseph_wheless/is_it_gods_word/)

Dave

14

Is God a mind reader? Do angels have privacy of thought?

by The Dragon in

what would it be like if god was among us?

would our privacy be gone?

it would be like a mindreader among us?

PrimateDave

I don't know "God". I haven't met any "angels". So, I don't know. The Sky god Yahweh (YHWH) doesn't seem to be capable of reading minds from what I can tell by reading the Tanakh (O.T.).

__________________________ "Meditation is a step in that direction. You seem to be a thinker. Wanna try?" - Satanus

Meditation for Dummies which is a very nice book.

I've been using the basic technique of following my breath to start with.

Meditation has been proven in scientific studies to improve mental and physical health.

Dave

36

Jehovah is like a dead beat dad

by MsMcDucket in

the kids don't know what he looks like or what he's like at all.

other men step in and run the family and you get treated like a stepchild or abused.

you want your real dad to come and get you; he's supposed to be so good; but he never comes.

PrimateDave

"He has given us a home which we are destroying, he provides more food than we can eat except man's greed prevents the distribution of it. He has promised us something far greater but we must wait on Him. He has given us life and didn't have to. He has given us color, taste, senses and much more. Just because we don't recieve somthing as soon as we want, as spoiled children we shouldn't say that he isn't there. If anyone is a parent who reads this post or replys, do you give to your children as soon as they requests something, I can only imagine a spoiled child pulling on the skirt, give me, give me, give me until they get it. I sure hope not. To me He is a loving Father and has been there and will be there in the future, I am willing to wait." - abr
_____________________________________________________

Perhaps Vishnu should get the credit for giving us a home and food and everything. According to the Wikipedia: "The Vishnu Sahasranama[1] describes Vishnu as the All-Pervading essence of all beings, the master of and beyond the past, present and future, the creator and destroyer of all existences, one who supports, sustains and governs the Universe and originates and develops all elements within."

All hail Vishnu the Supreme Being and a God of the Hindu religion that is older than Judaism and Christianity! Jehovah is a usurper, a Yahweh-come-lately, a lover of burnt flesh and blood, and a coveter of foreskins.

Dave

20

Your answer to a JW's question "What is an alternative?"

by ukescott in

a jw that i engaged in a series of debate finally posed this question.

i can see that he is running out of his "canned" answers and he wants to defend his organization desperately or he doesn't want to admit that he is dead wrong.

so he uses this faulty logic to depend his belief system.

PrimateDave

Answer: The way I see it, you (talking to the JW) have this choice - you stay a Witness and you will one day die, bitter and disappointed, in "this old world," hoping that their might be a resurrection, or you leave and take hold of your life for what it is, a precious gift you may never have again.

Dave

25

How Have You Changed Since Leaving The Witnesses?

by minimus in

jw
friends

are you very different now??

?

PrimateDave

My hair is definitely longer and way over the ears now. I haven't shaved for a week. And I'm going to a Christmas party Sunday night. I feel good!

Dave

19

The.....2nd Coming....of Jesus.....WHEN?

by Terry in

concerning the 2nd coming of christ i'll say this.. nobody understood the first coming.

what makes you think those people knew anything at all about a 2nd coming?

if any part of the bible messege wasn't garbled it's clear the apostles and 1st century christians who should have/might have been privvy to information of this nature didn't know squat!

PrimateDave

"Christians are waiting for Jesus Pt.2"

"I'm here to chew bubble-gum and kick ass...
and I'm all out of bubble-gum."

Dave (of the not-waiting-for-Jesus class)

33

Could satan be the good guy?

by LtCmd.Lore in

well i'm an atheist, so now i can feel free to think whatever i want without getting struck by lightning.

but i've been playing with this idea for quite a while:.

is satan just looking out for the poor little humans?

PrimateDave

"Remmember the LIFE-GIVER. Who is that?"

Current knowledge points to a natural process described by Homo sapiens as Evolution. Whether non human consciousness(es) or intelligence(s) have had anything to do with the matter is unknown. The deity Yahweh Elohim (aka "God", "Jehovah", YHWH) found in certain ancient preserved texts commonly compiled as "The Bible" does not exhibit the necessary intelligence to be called a "Life Giver" in my opinion. For all I know, said deity could be a usurper himself, a Yahweh-come-lately if you will. Considering the blatant internal inconsistencies of the source documents compiled as "The Bible" (Is It God's Word? by Joseph Wheless, Biblical Nonsense by Dr. Jason Long), it is difficult to accept the extra-textual reality of the deity Yahweh-as-described. To take it one step further, it is pure circular logic to insist that "God" made man just because it says so in the book "He" wrote (or had written through "inspiration").

It is my understanding that the original poster was asking a hypothetical question, playing the devil's advocate if you will. He didn't imply that he actually believe that "God", "Satan", "Adam", and "Eve" ever existed. Frankly, the Talking Snake is never referred to in the Old Testament texts as being "Satan". That belief is a product of theological evolution.

Dave

33

Could satan be the good guy?

by LtCmd.Lore in

well i'm an atheist, so now i can feel free to think whatever i want without getting struck by lightning.

but i've been playing with this idea for quite a while:.

is satan just looking out for the poor little humans?

PrimateDave

It should be noted that "God" never told Adam that he would live forever unless he ate of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and bad. That is a bit of Watchtower "logic" that we have been told that the account in Genesis 3 implies. So, by that line of reasoning, "God's" threat to kill them on the day of their eating it can still be seen as a lie. Additionally, Satan never promised everlasting life; just that they wouldn't die in that day like "God" had said.

Dave

33

Could satan be the good guy?

by LtCmd.Lore in

well i'm an atheist, so now i can feel free to think whatever i want without getting struck by lightning.

but i've been playing with this idea for quite a while:.

is satan just looking out for the poor little humans?

PrimateDave

Satan works for a law firm in New York City.

Dave