Posts by Vinny

146

Last Post

by Core88 in

jw
friends

i have a family a son and a girl friend out of wedlock that's why i am disfellowshiped.

i hate my "lie" life.

and now is the time.

Vinny

We have an empty spare room on the island of Kauai. We also have frequent flyer miles we can give you to get you here.

Just taking a little break away to clear your mind can do wonders.

vinny

146

Last Post

by Core88 in

jw
friends

i have a family a son and a girl friend out of wedlock that's why i am disfellowshiped.

i hate my "lie" life.

and now is the time.

Vinny

Remember Core, no matter what's going on and no matter what's happening in your life, there is always a way out.

Let us help you.

We definitely can if you let us.

23

"There's nothing else out there"

by yaddayadda in

jw
friends

a friend of mine is returning to the meetings.

his reason is "there's nothing else out there" (meaning out in the world).

if i had a dollar for every time i've heard a jw say this.

That's one PATHETIC photo.

Many former JW's have some difficulty readjusting to life outside of the JW's. Losing many friends and family can make it seem just like your friend said, "there is nothing else out there". You go from a tight-nit group of people spending enormous amounts of time together, to often being outright alone and starting over from nothing. But the fact is this is how it is with many OTHER large organizations as well, when somebody finally leaves altogether it can be lonely. Professional athletes and even the local softball-bowling-soccer etc leagues offer a camaraderie that is not easy to replace. Politicians, Peace Corps members even restaurant or construction workers often experience something similar when leaving such closer knit ties that they have developed. Kids leaving high school or college too. People often need companionship and some kind of social life to replace what has been lost. This is a normal human reaction when leaving any organization of people like this. But it definitely does not mean that because somebody misses the JW brotherhood, that this is some "sign from God" the JW's are the one sole truth on earth. Although I can see how some may think it is because this is what they hear from being a JW over and over. It's just a matter of perspective.

The fact that the JW's caution against any association that is not a strong JW only makes it more difficult for the person leaving the JW's and starting over. You are at times literally starting from scratch. Not a fun thing to do. And which is also why places like this are so active and meaningful for EX-JW's. It helps make the transition out much easier to handle.

Though having to stomach photos like posted above by nvrgnbk can make you question being here at all...

: )

24

Why isn' the name "Jehovah" used?

by MichaelM in

is it because many believe that jesus christ / god / holy spirit are all one being, and after jesus christ was born they stopped using god's name and put all focus on jesus?

.

Vinny

Most modern scholars believe that "Jehovah" is an ERRONEOUS English transcription of God's Hebrew name, resulting from combining the anglicized consonants of God's name, Jhvh, with the modified version of the vowels of the word adonai, "Lord", which scholars believe the Masoretes had placed above and below the consonants of God's name, to indicate to the Jewish reader that he was to substitute ’adônây for the proper name in reading the scriptures."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yahweh

Yahweh and Jehovah are two different English transcriptions of ???? [ i.e. the Tetragrammaton ], which is accepted by both Jews and Christians as being God's preserved Hebrew name. It should be noted, however, that ???? is a non-vocalized form of God's Hebrew name.
Yahweh is believed [by modern scholars] to be the likely original pronunciation of ????.
Under the heading "????" [i.e. the Tetragrammaton],
the editors of the Brown-Driver-Briggs Lexicon write:

"i.e. ??????? n.pr.dei Yahweh, the proper name of the God of Israel."[1]

Jehovah is an English transcription of the Biblical Hebrew name ??????? based on the Masoretic Text.
Under this same heading "????" [i.e. the Tetragrammaton],
the Brown-Driver-Briggs lexicon also writes that: ??????? occurs 6518 times in the Masoretic Text.

I personally have no problem with others using it. I have heard the name Jehovah and even used it many times as well. Where JW's and I may differ however, is that I cannot see the see objection to other educated ones choosing NOT to use the divine name for the very simple reason that that, we cannot be certain what that name is. I would personally hold back from judging such ones adversely or place any negative labels on their relationship with God. (Not that you have done this by the way...

Jesus' name is different. They did have vowels in Greek. It's simply which language do you speak, in which decides how that name is used. With Jehovah, nobody knows for certain. This is a very reasonable reason, in my opinion, that some choose not to use it, or instead replace it with a very respectful and appropriate titles such as were used by Christ Himself.

Rules from a group of men that have been flat out WRONG too many times to just give them some kind of free pass today.

But keep asking questions. Because once you check in as a JW, by going under the water, you cannot check out without significant consequences.

Happy trails,

Vinny

25

Well now I'm just angry

by lola28 in

jw
friends

i just read blondies wt review and it made me angry.

how can the society continue to place more importance on pioneering than getting an education or getting a good job?

why do these men insist on making young ones (and even older members) feel bad for wanting to have a secure future, what the hell is wrong with not wanting to live in a tent?

Vinny

"Meanwhile the elders who pushed me to do more had great jobs, fancy new trucks, every toy they wanted and could never go out in service because they were too tired."

84

Any Circuit or District Overseers That Made An Impression On You?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i used to enjoy do paul illingsworth's talks.

he thought he was a greek scholar.. anyone that you liked (or didn't)?.

Vinny

I liked Antrim Smith. He was my fav CO actually. Never saw things like you just mentioned. But it would not surprise me too much. I did not care too much for Ken Karass, Bill Parks or Jim Roberts. Paul Ellingworth was a gifted speaker. Had nice Italian boots every time I saw him. You never got bored when he was up. Hawaiian C.O.'s ALL were weak and bland. I also thought Goff was a strong DO. He died just a couple years ago here in Hawaii during an assembly rehearsal.

114

Leolaia's Scenic Travel Photos

by Leolaia in

jw
friends

well, i thought i'd start a fluff thread for once, so i'm posting here some of my favorite photos from my many trips over the years.

i hope you enjoy them and they inspire you to take awesome pictures on your own travels (or even your own backyard).

[edited to add...let's hope this formatting helps...jgnat].

Vinny

Nice shots here. Enjoyed the tour around the globe. Since your camera broke down, you should make a point to get at least a 10 megapixel camera with interchangable lenses. A Nikon D200 or D80 for example. This way, you always have the capability of publishing your work. Also, you should start using a tripod whenever possible. By using a tripod you can stop down to gain better depth of field, slow the shutter for better creativity and take multiple exposures of an image at different densities. It will make you a better photographer. Though freelancing is a little easier to have fun with. Do you have Photoshop CS2? Good stuff here.

15

Judicial Committees: What was it like selecting them?

by Open mind in

looking back over the years it's funny to me now how we selected committees for jcs.

it seems like there was always at least one barney fife, gestapo elder who was chomping at the bit to be selected.

rarely would a guy like that get selected.

Vinny

On simple cases, who ever wanted the job got it. Usually the less capable brothers volunteered since it made them feel useful. Whenever an elder's family member or close friend ws involved, it was another story entrely. Politics, stacking the deck, maneuvering all were used every single time.

The worst case I ever saw involved the PO's own son, a ministerial servant, who was accused by two different people of breaking into the home of another Witness family (from a diff cong.) during their meeting night. My own son, who was 16 and df'd at the time, confessed to being a part of this as well. Two days after it happened I got him to admit he was there (I used the "they had fingerprints" trick, which was actually a lie). He confessed however and was turned in by myself (I was also an elder then). For three months he would not say who else was with him, though said that two other JW's were involved. The JW family had him taken to court even though he returned everything as well as apologized in person with me towing him around. They decided to press charges because he would not nark on the other two people. The owner of the house was also an elder and he said my son was not repentful enough by not telling him who else was there. So to court he went.

Three months later another JW comes forward and mentioned who the other two JW's were, after he was beaten up badly by another JW kid also involved in the break in. One being that PO's ministerial servant son. I asked my son if this was true, he said it definitely was. But he did not want to get him in trouble. And only agreed to tell because somebody else came forward first. I confronted the PO's son after the Thurs meeting where he confessed to me that he was there and broke into the home, stole the goodies etc. He said he did not know why he let it happen. I told him I'd give him until Sunday to go to his father and then the brothers.

One night later the father (PO) calls me. He asked me what we should do. (He knew exactly what to do but was hoping I'd sweep it under the rug.) I said we have no choice but to take it to the brothers. This was robbery and covering up as well. He is also an M.S. My son had to go to court as a minor, community service, fine, counseling on his record for five years etc. Had his son, an adult, been caught it would have been even worse.

So we met to form a JC a week or so later. We had two witnesses and a confession from the kid himself. Pretty open and shut case right? WRONG.

First of all the deck was instantly stacked when the PO's best friend and WT conductor stepped up and volunteered to be on the JC. (They had Both moved to this island together from the same town many years ago). Then another friend joined in to be on it. I knew this is exactly what would take place. But watched it happen anyway, while amazed. I then raised my hand and suggested that it would be less than the course of wisdom to have two close personal friends on a JC case like this. Finally another elder raised his hand and agreed with me. Then a third. We ended up getting those two friends off the case and a very fair and unbiased selection of brothers. I was not one of them since my son was also involved. The PO was stiff necked and pale after seeing what just happened in a matter of moments.

So, the very next night they meet, and the next morning I get a call from the JC chairman (our secretary), and they decided on public reproof along with his removal as an M.S. They said he confessed and cried and seemed sincerely repentful. That should have been end of story.

The very next Thursday, just before our meeting, I call the B school conductor to let him know his talk number 4 would need to be replaced since it was that PO's son who HE had just reproved and was removed. Then the shocking revelation to me that they, "changed their minds", that he was not reproved at all, nor was he removed as an M.S. They said the PO met with them two nights before and said his son was too ashamed to tell them the "real story" about what happened that evening. That what really happened was that his son had "NO IDEA" a robbery was taking place when he walked in. That when he walked into the house (under the cover of darkness...heh), and saw the other two were stealing, he made up some story about hearing people there so they would run away. In fact, he now claimed that he "broke up" this robbery. Unbelievably the JC committee reversed their decision entirely after hearing this new version FROM THE DAD, and PO.

Well, I had a big fat COW . I talked to my son who said this kid was lying. He said he tried to use his t-shirt to avoid leaving fingerprints. HE KNEW WHAT THEY WERE DOING. He said that he was the person that kept the sunglasses and bragged about it, (which I had to pay for). The other JW that was beaten up and is the one that came forward to begin with, said they talked about robbing the house because it was a meeting night. And why didn't he tell me on the night I confronted him about this story? Why did he not tell the original JC meeting that he broke it up? He even apologized to the elder whose house he broke into and never mentioned he "broke it up".

Well that elder whose house was broken into called the CO. The CO called the original JC brothers. The JC brothers changed their mind a second time, this time agreeing with their first decision to reprove and remove as an MS. The father then says they will appeal the decision. So, this time an appeal committee is formed and guess who is made chairman, but a very close friend of the PO from another cong. I went in as a witness, my son went in, the other JW who narked and then the elder and his wife who were broken into all went in to testify that this PO's son knew what he was doing ahead of time.

The decision was reached that he was innocent. No reproof, no removal, NOTHING.

Yet this is the very same PO that told me I should not get involved with my own son who was disfellowshipped starting having suicidal, emotional problems. He told me I might be destroyed at armageddon because I let my sone come back home to get help.

I have seen other similar stories like this with other elder's kids too. One was having sex for months with another sister. She would literally climb through the window of this elders's home and have sex many times. He was a pioneer too. Bought condoms and knew what they were doing. Yet this very same close friend elder that tried to sabatoge the JC committee above made it on this one and they only offered private reproof. I was on the JC of this sister. We told the chairman not to make any decision until we could compare stories. But they did not listen and offered the private reproof. We could not df her, for doing the very same thing the brother was reproved for.

Then, this very same kid (just two months ago) confessed to doing the very same thing once again. This time with a different sister and this time she was pregnant. Yep, just reproved once again.

It can be nice being an elder's kid at times.

Just Politics as usual in JW world...

41

When Did You Start Feeling Uncomfortable In The Truth?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

when did you start feeling uncomfortable in the truth?it started out for me by asking questions out of curiosity, which eventually led me.

out of the organization.

my history as a jehovahs witness could easily be summed .

Vinny

When preparing for Revelation, book of Daniel and Isaiah's Prophecy book studies. Especially the anti-typical, modern day applications of some of that stuff. Re-read three times, shake the head and throw the book down.

Then when my DF'd son went back to the meetings for over three months and afterwards said it just was not for him. The people in the Hall were so weird and had no life. I started looking at them from a different angle and could see what he meant.

Then the internet, and finding out about all the false predictions, medical disasters and doctrinal flip-flop mistakes blew the lid off.

29

X MS, Elders, COs., and DOs.....your thoughts?

by restrangled in

jw
friends

i wonder how it strikes you when you read of those facing or have faced one of your tribunals?.

as x men in charge, how do you feel reading the pain and panic here?.

r..

Vinny

I did apologize to one of the yonger guys whose JC I was a part of. We really went after him. A girl spent the night in his bed, as he confessed, though he claimed no sex. We never believed him of course, nor would it have mattered, we could have DF'd him just for that, but still just gave public reproof. He was so scared. He ended up being one of the very few that did not shun me after my DA letter. Lived right next door. He was killed in a motorcycle accident soon after.

I was on many cases, but always tried to be fair. There was no need to apologize for any those cases. We could have and even should have DF'd on several, but still did not. The thing that I disliked about being on judicial committees was the fear you would see in the faces of those that came in. All of the people I was involved with were terrified. There was something not quite right about that from my perspective. Having been on many made my own JCM really just like a regular meeting. I was very relaxed and rather in control to a fair degree.

One of the best friends of my oldest step son was deeply upset with me for years for not allowing him to associate with my kids after he stopped going to meetings. He was very emotional and vocal to others about how what I did hurt him for many years. I finally saw this young guy (no longer a JW) in the grocery store with his girlfriend. I did stop him, embrace him and apologize many times there. We hugged again and he definitely appreciated my making things right. But like I told him, I did things the Society's way. Which is why I am no longer a part of that system today.

There are quite a few elders that are just plain bad guys. But not all are. I also knew of several that were very sincere. That cared, and did not like the power and limelight. Like most all of us were at one time, they are simply in the dark when it comes to seeing the entire JW picture. They are captives of the "One True Faith" Concept.

But there are plenty of bad brothers out there too. I would guess probably 70 percent or more are in it for the wrong reasons. Just bad guys, who enjoy the control, enjoy the power and get a kick out of watching the fear in the faces of these poor JW's ready for the tribunal.

I am so happy to be away from of all of that today.