OOmpa says:..."Just don't happen enough.......I miss the chatter. We need something new already....new light or something. I can't just sit idly by anticipating the death of the 1914 thingy.....oompa"
I don't think it's a healthy way to live, just hanging out on EX-JW site, "missing the chatters"... and then waiting for, "something new already....new light or something"....
Kind of a sad existence, don't you think? Why not try other things? A little more balance might go a long way for you. Life has many opportunities for you to enjoy.
Just my .02...
Vinny
Posts by Vinny
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38BIG WATCHTOWER ANNOUNCEMENTS>>>>>>>
by oompa injust don't happen enough.......i miss the chatter.
we need something new already....new light or something.
i can't just sit idly by anticipating the death of the 1914 thingy.....oompa
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Vinny
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Diary of a thinking to return ex-Jw
by reniaa ini thought long and hard about posting this but the mis-information on this site finally persuaded me, i already accept many may not accept what i say on face value and get their appologist pens ready for making sure no pro-witness propaganda slips through the net on this site but here goes....... i've been on this forum for a few months my first post was about how i was thinking of returning to jw's and at my sisters recommendation to look at this site for both sides of the story before taking that step.. i faded from jw's 10/11 years ago now i left my hubby at the time divorced him to going on to have more relationships and kids, i was definately given the impression after asking on this site and with what i read that if i tried to return i might face df or at least a jc but definately a couple of elders questioning me over what i've been upto these last few years - none of these have happened.
i talked with an old jw friend (yes i do have then and she never shunned me quite happily accepted an offer of coffee from me and my asking for a chat) i told her i was interested in going back and was very frank about what i done in the last 10 years but not sure how returning was done now, she quite happily said she go ask for me to find out.. result!
she came back this week and said "all i had to do was goto meetings again" and an offer of a study was there for me if i wanted it to explore the open doubts that i had expressed i now had.. not quite the fire and brimstone welcome this site led me to believe would happen.. i will keep you posted with further updates if i feel the need to put them in future.. .
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Vinny
I became a baptized JW when I was 27 (from the world). I was a very active, zealous JW, and elder with many privileges and liked by almost all JW's during my 15 years since then. My wife was solid, kids were all raised in it and our 19 year old daughter was a regular pioneer --(all of this just over two years ago). I had no complaints with the Society or with individual JW's that I knew.
But then one day I learned the honest facts as they truly are. Here is my story:
http://exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com/topic/922/t/Letter-of-disassociation.html
Today I have no problems if people want to be JW's, including YOU. I say, as long as you know all sides of the JW religion (as most never do), then good for you, if that is what you want to spend your life doing.
You can live an okay life as a JW. just as long as you are content handing your life over to the Governing Body; being told what to believe and what not to believe. What you can do and cannot do. What words can say and cannot say. What you should wear and not wear etc. etc.
You will have all kinds of friends wherever you go, which has benefits. That is, as long as you agree with everything the Society says. Disagree with even one WT teaching and you then realize that all of those friendships are 100 percent conditional. Which to some people is not really true friendships. But at least you have been 'enlightened' beforehand about this brotherly arrangement.
You will have to be willing to allow your new child to die rather than accept blood, if an emergency should arise. (You might wish to read this thread sometime:http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/150613/1.ashx
You will have to be willing to allow your child to lose its only mother if YOU find yourself needing blood to live.
You will have to be willing to insist this same blood policy be accepted by any bible study you happen to meet (along with any kids they might have) in the field service before they can ever become a JW. And be willing to accept that some of these may die because of what you taught them to believe.
You must be willing to cut or limit all ties with any baptized JW (including your own children and close family and friends) if they simply say, "thanks but no thanks, the JW's just aren't for me"!
You must be willing to accept the fact that other people you bring into the JW's will also have to be willing to cut or limit ties with any baptized person (including close family and friends), that simply want to walk away from the JW's, even if they remain a devoted Christian afterwards.
You must be willing to accept all current JW teachings (including things you may not agree with or understand), even though they were wrong about vaccinations, organ transplants, alternative service, numerous end of world predictions, Beth Sarim, rape rules, marital infidelity rules and much much more.
No school sports, Cubscouts, Brownies, holidays, birthdays, proms, clubs and more for your kids.
No beards for your son of husband or any other man if they ever wish to carry a microphone or other privileges in the congregation.
No pants, new tattoos, piercings, longer hair, R rated movies if they want to be in good standing in the congregation and viewed favorably by other JW's.
As long as you are happy with these things, and many more like them, then I say good for you and I wish you and your family the best.
Peace and best wishes,
Vinny -
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The Story of Minimus
by minimus inwhen i was a teen, i aspired to be an elder.
from my pre-teens until i was 18, i was in every circuit assembly and district convention----having either ministry school talks or parts or experiences.
at 20, i conducted a bookstudy in the afternoon, also regular pioneered, was the theocratic ministry school overseer in the 2nd school and regularly taught the main school.
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Vinny
Hope this hasn't been asked already but.... Who will be playing You in the movie that will no doubt be released?
***** Pee-wee Herman. -
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Vinny
By minimizing personal contact and informal gatherings, there are less opportunities for child molestation. I'd bet that issue played a significant role in this new direction.
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Stay or leave your spouse after leaving JWs - Do you have regrets?
by Awakened at Gilead ini am in a situation that many of you have faced... whether to stay with my spouse or not after having learned the falsehood of the org.. my wife is diehard witness who gets upset whenever i talk about the org negatively.
she is not happy that i am on jwd... in fact the other day she picked up the keyboard and wanted to throw it accros the room or bash me with it when she saw i was on jwd... she is also very upset about me making friends with "apostates" and worldly people, and told me never to bring them to our home!
this concerns me, since i am not going to have any friends in the org, and i need at least a few friendships...she doesn't want me to talk to the friends in the cong about my decision so that i don't share my doubts.
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Vinny
"What in particular did you do that helped her to wake up?"
Then, a few weeks later I e-mailed her a personal experience of somebody that had actually died from not accepting an organ transplant back when they were considered cannibalism by the Society.
An hour or so later I received an experience FROM HER about a man that left the JW's, over the course of about two years, but by being very cautious he was able to get every single person in his family out as well.
Needless to say I WAS SHOCKED that she would SEND ME a story like that.
Still, I tried not to get overly excited and just proceeded with my own letter of disassociation. It was after the announcement was made, and they had a special needs talk on apostasy the following week, right in front of her and our still a pioneer daughter that really got her going. They felt insulted. Then when I was shunned and labeled for doing nothing wrong but disagreeing with WT Society teachings did she tell me she wanted to start examining things herself. SHE wanted to buy Crisis of Conscience, not me. Then she bought several others; In Search of Christian Freedom, Captives of a Concept, Combatting Mind Control, Kingdom of the Cults and a few others. I have only read both of Franz's books up til now. But she was just blown away by it all.
Because of having our daughter still in (my step daughter) she decided to just fade away rather than formally leave as I did.
For one full year, our daughter continued living with us and going to all the meetings while pioneering for many more months. We were always respectful of this because after all, we raised her to be one.
In six months she quit pioneering. Another six mos she stopped going to all the meetings and today (just two years later) she is completely out not even going to the memorial. It took TIME, Awakened at Gilead, to allow alternative thoughts to have an opportunity to manifest themselves.
My wife is out. (Took six mos).
My Pioneer step daughter is out. (Took about 18 mos).
And life is so much better without the WT Strings attached to our every move.
My suggestion would be to give your wife just a little room to breathe. (Rarely does anybody do what YOU have done; out in three weeks).
You might even try sending her this thread to read...
Apologize to her. Acknowledge that this must be extremely difficult for her to watch happening.
You can still proceed forward with your own exit. But by being a bit more conscious and respectful of her own feelings, along with a desire to maybe slow things down just a bit you may even help her to find the door as well.
My wife was a 23 year zealous sister. My step daughter a 21 year old raised in the religion regular Pioneer. And both are out today.
Who'd have thunk it?
My best to you and your wife!
vinny -
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Stay or leave your spouse after leaving JWs - Do you have regrets?
by Awakened at Gilead ini am in a situation that many of you have faced... whether to stay with my spouse or not after having learned the falsehood of the org.. my wife is diehard witness who gets upset whenever i talk about the org negatively.
she is not happy that i am on jwd... in fact the other day she picked up the keyboard and wanted to throw it accros the room or bash me with it when she saw i was on jwd... she is also very upset about me making friends with "apostates" and worldly people, and told me never to bring them to our home!
this concerns me, since i am not going to have any friends in the org, and i need at least a few friendships...she doesn't want me to talk to the friends in the cong about my decision so that i don't share my doubts.
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Vinny
Awakened at Gilead said:..."I made my decsion to exit 2 weeks ago"...
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Stay or leave your spouse after leaving JWs - Do you have regrets?
by Awakened at Gilead ini am in a situation that many of you have faced... whether to stay with my spouse or not after having learned the falsehood of the org.. my wife is diehard witness who gets upset whenever i talk about the org negatively.
she is not happy that i am on jwd... in fact the other day she picked up the keyboard and wanted to throw it accros the room or bash me with it when she saw i was on jwd... she is also very upset about me making friends with "apostates" and worldly people, and told me never to bring them to our home!
this concerns me, since i am not going to have any friends in the org, and i need at least a few friendships...she doesn't want me to talk to the friends in the cong about my decision so that i don't share my doubts.
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Vinny
My only thought, Awakened at Gilead, is that if you had any real hopes of maintaining your marriage, or possibly helping the wife to "see the light" herself, you would have proceeded much more slowly and cautiously than you have.
It seems somewhat apparent to me that you had no interest in doing either. And that's fine too, I guess. But a little more patience and discretion on your end sure could have made some kind of a difference or at least a less UN-favorable impression.
Tearing your blood card in front of her. Growing a beard. Going to apostate gatherings are all indications, to me, that you are trying to instigate negative reactions from her. Seriously, what else do you expect here?
Had I done any of those things to my wife, I seriously doubt she would have eventually joined me in leaving the JW religion altogether, which she did many months later. But I handled things much more respectfully than you have here. Today, we are closer than ever by having gone through this JW departure together. It takes TIME for almost every JW that learns some of the facts as they are, to allow it to sink in.
From what I have read, you never gave her even half a chance. In fact you seem to like throwing it in her face. And then you act shocked and offended when she responds in like fashion or out of desperation.
Why not show a little more class and respect for her beliefs than you have and see if things don't improve.
Even if the marriage ends, at least you can let it end by taking a higher road out than you have up to now. -
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So what caused you to have doubts in the first place?
by nicolaou ini had no doubts at all about the 'truth' untill a friend of mine in the cong' began falling away.
in trying to help him i had to ask questions and do research and that of course cracked the doors of my mind open for the first time in over thirty years.. years ago, when jwd allowed members to have signatures, i used the following quote from voltaire as mine.
i still love it.. doubt is uncomfortable, certainty is ridiculous..
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Vinny
So many newbies coming out of the closet on this one. Cool... and a ((((BIG WELCOME TO YOU ALL))))!!! I would have often have doubts, do a double take and shake my head when reading how the Society would apply some "anti-typical" fulfillment of scripture TO THEMSELVES. The Revelation Book study for example is FILLED with those "Modern Day Fulfillments" somehow applying to them and only them. They made me laugh at times. Other times I would literally throw my book down in disbelief. DO THEY REALLY BELIEVE THIS ABOUT THEMSELVES? Still, I managed to shake those doubts off every single time. (Probably had something to do with my chasing the "eldership" carrot)... Then one day I saw this comment after an MSNBC news article about Jehovah's Witnesses: "Wondering Why People Call The Jehovah’s Witnesse Religion A Cult? Cults Are High Control Groups. So One Has To Ask,”Is The Jehovah Witness Religion A High Control Group?” Here Is some of The Evidence On It. It Gets Ignored All The Time. But Here It Goes Again. Once The Watchtower Bible And Tract Society™ Made A Mandate That Their Members Could Not Receive Vaccinations. If A Member Said I Do Not Agree And Received Vaccinations OR Gave Their Young Children Vaccinations They Would Be Disfellowshipped And Lose Their Entire Family. Once Disfellowshipped Not Even Your Family Can So Much As Take A Meal With You If You Go Against The Watchtower™. SOOOOOOooo, Jehovah’s Witnesses Didn’t Take Vaccinations And Some Died. Even CHILDREN Died. Then One Day The Watchtower Society Says They Have New Light™ And So Now Jehovah’s’ People May In Good Conscience Take Vaccinations. So, Then, The People AND Children Who Died Not Taking Vaccinations….Who Did They Die For? Did They Die For Jehovah? Or For The Watchtower Bible And Tract Corporation™? Did The Bible Say Not To Take Vaccinations? Or Was It Just A Dogmatic Mandate made by MEN? Although There Were Other Health Mandates I Will Skip Them And Go To Another Biggie. Organ Transplants. At One Time The Watchtower Society™ Said No Organ Transplants For Their Members. To Receive Life Saving Organ Transplants Was Considered Cannibalism By The Slave Class™. If A Jehovah’s Witness Received An Organ Transplant Or Allowed Their CHILD To Receive A Life Saving Organ Transplant They Were Disfellowshipped. Shunned. Losing All Family,Friends,And A Voice In The Congregation. If A Jehovah’s Witness Questioned The Dogmatic Doctrine Of No Organ Transplants They Were Accused Of “Running Ahead Of Jehovah’s Organization”. Apostasy! Then New Light™ Comes From The Slave Class. Jehovah’s People Can Now Receive Organ Transplants. Many Jehovah’s Witnesses Died Including CHILDREN. Did The GOD Say Not To Receive Life Saving Organ Transplants? Or Was It Just A Dogmatic Mandate from 12 or so fallible men sitting up in a NewYork office? Now I Will Go To Another Biggie, BLOOD. Not Whole Blood Just Fractions. Jehovah’s Witnesses Latest Medical Mandate Is No Blood. Science Develops New Treatment For Hemophiliacs Using Blood Fractions. Many Jehovah’s Witnesses Hemophiliacs And Parents Of Children Who Are Hemophiliacs Whose Doctors Have Told Them About This New Treatment Call Bethel. The Watchtower Society™ Says No Blood Fractions. Even Just A Part Of The Blood Is Still Blood. It Must Be Poured Out Onto The Ground. Many Die. Many CHILDREN Die. One Day The Slave Class™ Says They Have New Light™. Jehovah’s Witnesses May Now Receive Blood Fractions. Did GOD Say Not To Receive Life Saving Blood Fractions? To Not Allow Your Children To Receive Life Saving Blood Fractions? Did These Men, Women, And CHILDREN, Die For Jehovah? Or Did They Die For The Watchtower men sitting in Brooklyn? What Would Have Happened In Any Of These Medical Mandated Cases Had The Individual Jehovah’s Witness Said,” I Am Sorry But, I Must Save My Life That IS A Gift From God. I Believe The Watchtower Bible And Tract Society™ Is Wrong On This Point.” The Consequence For Disobedience To The Watchtower Even For Nobel Causes Is Disfellowshipment. The Loss Of Your World As You Know It. The Loss Of Your Family, Friends, And Support At The Kingdom Hall AND You Feel Are Made To Feel The Loss Of Your GOD. You Feel And Are Made To Feel As If You Are Worse Then Dead. Now Even Parents Allowed Their Children To Die (Be Killed) By Dogmatic Medical Mandate from men sitting in a Brooklyn office. So Is This A High Control Group? You Answer This For Yourself. Use YOUR God Given Conscience. It Is Yours. It Is A Gift. Nothing God Gives Is Broken No Matter What You Have Been Taught. You Do Not Need Any Man To Tell You What To Do On Any Righteous Matter. God Is Taking Care Of You.Listen To The Still Small Voice Of Our Heavenly Father’s Holy Spirit. I Did Not Touch The Subject Of Whole Blood This Time,Because You Must Also Answer This For Yourself. But Look At The Record Of The Watchtower Bible And Tract Society™. They Have Been Deadly Wrong Too Many Times. Do You Wish To Take The Blue Pill Or The Red? ******* I admit, after reading that and a few others similar... (One from Odrade, I later found out), I was knocked off balance from it all. But, once again, like a well trained good little JW, I just put it out of my mind for about a month. "Those were obviously some sorry Apostates anyway, right?"... I said to myself. But folks, the damage was already done. I had heard things I simply could not get out of my head. Were they true? I finally checked all those things out and yep THEY WERE ALL TRUE. The WT Society had forbidden Vaccinations and Organ Transplants previously and then after many years simply, "changed their minds". HOW CONVENIENT. It seriously damaged their credibility overall in my mind though. I then decided to put everything on the table and see what else they were wrong about. Beth Sarim, Alternative Service, False Predictions, Rape Rules, Divorce Rules, shunning those that just walk away from the religion, Strange and wacky teachings throughout their entire history and much more... and then the biggest problem for me... BLOOD. I studied the JW position on Blood from the inside out over two solid months. (Many of my conclusions on blood are posted here: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/16/150613/1.ashx I was blown away. The JW's were WRONG ON BLOOD TODAY. Just like they were WRONG ON ALL THOSE OTHER THINGS BEFORE. HOLY COW. Bought both Ray Franz Books and learned even more that destroyed their arrogant and presumptuous, "WE ARE THE ONE TRUE FAITH" and "ALL OTHERS WILL BE DESTROYED BY GOD" nonsense. I finally disassociated just after the elders told me to agree with everything the Society teaches (just wait for light to get brighter they said), or be disfellowshipped outright. The actual letter of disassociation is posted here: http://exjehovahswitnessforum.yuku.com/topic/922/t/Letter-of-disassociation.html I then lost all JW friendships, and biz employees, family members along with was falsely labeled and shunned without doing anything wrong aside from disagreeing with current JW teachings. Which is a major sin to them. I debated for almost two years with active JW's on Beliefnet and other website locations after disassociating. It was not a pretty sight for the JW's. They kept losing every single debate on every single issue I had brought up. It was embarrassing actually. And still is when on rare occasion I jump back in. But there is nothing else to prove and I now stay focused on much more positive things. The JW's are simply not "The Truth" as many of us one time believed and as they have decieved themselves into believing today, while living in a bubble. Only the JW's think and say that about JW's. Most folks don't buy any of it.
Vinny
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Best Youtube of the Year
by Dogpatch insome ex-cult workers are calling this the best!.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jphyo_mkpho.
language warning but priceless!
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Vinny
"Some ex-cult workers are calling this the best!"
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Did Jehovah's Witnesses ever claim they were inspired?
by slimboyfat injehovah's witnesses insist they are not false prophets despite making false predictions because they never claimed inspiration.
but is that true?
well most of the time they seem to have been careful only to claim divine "guidance" or that they are "god's channel".
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Vinny
Some good ole fashioned QUOTES from WT itself!
"It should be expected that the Lord would have a means of communicating to his people on the earth, and he has clearly shown that the magazine called The Watchtower is used for that purpose." {YEAR 1939 85}
"Jehovah has established a very definite channel of communication through which he deals with his people .. It is vital that we appreciate this fact and respond to the directions of the 'slave' as we would to (((the voice of God)))." {WT Jun 15 1957 370}
: )
Just take this one snippet for example:
"Christian Witnesses of Jehovah .. consider all transplants between humans as cannibalism." {AWAK Jun 8 1968 page 21}
Blood is even WORSE than Organ Transplants. Over 65 years now. How many people have died following that bad blood policy where JW'S were BURIED trying to defend?
The fact is JW'S try to defend the indefensible. The WT Society IS NOT God's only channel on earth.
JW's have no answers to all these problems.
Neither does anybody else.
That is just the way it is.
Vinny