Pahpa

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Posts by Pahpa

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  41

  What extent will the WT go too silence us Apostate

  by jam in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  i was thinking and i know this is really out there, and i am not becoming paranoid.. i thought about the terrorist , what is told to these people to move them to blow.

  now some may say, no way that can happen with the jw,s.

  talking about us apostate only, not the rest of the world.

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  Pahpa

  Sadly, the Watchtower has found an effective means of ostracizing

  former members ("apostates") without violence. The cruel practice

  of disfellowshipping and disassociation has torn families apart and

  caused untold heartaches.

  The double standard of Jehovah's Witnesses is hard for many to

  understand. They tell non-believers to examine their religion and

  to question their leaders. But it becomes a serious offense when applied

  to Watchtower members. One only has to express doubt about the role

  the organization is playing to come under suspicion and scorn.
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  5

  Jehovah's Witnesses and morality

  by Pahpa in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am always puzzled by the contradictory morality of jehovah's witnesses.

  a person is formally disfellowshipped or disassociated in a congregation, that.

  person is usually castigated and shunned by all other members.

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  Pahpa

  Jehovah's Witnesses claim they live by a higher standard than the worldly system. Yet, many of the

  "faders" fade so they won't be under the strict Watchtower code. Some of them live contrary

  to the conduct recommended by the Watchtower. I've known of elders who continue to see their

  children and family members in spite of the infractions that would have meant disfellowshipping. If

  they believed in "due process" even "JW style" one would expect consistency.

  The inconsistency is seen in a greater degree when some members are suspected of a sin.

  The rumor "factory" at Kingdom Halls pass judgement even before a hearing. A person is

  often treated as a pariah before a judgement is ruled by the Judicial Committee.

  The double standard is seen even at the highest levels. Such was the case that involved

  Greenlees and Chitty. NeonMadman is correct. The organization is the idol worshipped

  by Jehovah's Witnesses. And hypocrisy is its byproduct.

  Pahpa
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  5

  Jehovah's Witnesses and morality

  by Pahpa in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i am always puzzled by the contradictory morality of jehovah's witnesses.

  a person is formally disfellowshipped or disassociated in a congregation, that.

  person is usually castigated and shunned by all other members.

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  Pahpa

  I am always puzzled by the contradictory morality of Jehovah's Witnesses. If

  a person is formally disfellowshipped or disassociated in a congregation, that

  person is usually castigated and shunned by all other members. However, if

  a member commits a seriously moral breach but moves or "fades out" family

  members and friends feel perfectly safe to associate in spite of the cimcumstances.

  It's as if "getting caught" is worse than commiting the sin. I know of some families

  that are almost relieved that a member of their family escaped before the elders

  took action. No attempt is made by them to report the impropriety to the

  body of elders in the area where that person lives. I personally don't approve

  of the disfellowshipping procedure as practiced in the Watchtower Society or the

  cruel shunning practices of Jehovah's Witnesses. But it does make one wonder how

  sincere they are in the moral principles they claim to follow?

  Pahpa
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  19

  Was there a 1974 Franz speech and subsequent coverup?

  by Nickolas in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  for those of us who remember it first hand, the 1975 fiasco is a strong indicator that the watchtower bible and tract society is not what it represents itself to be.

  in the late 1970's, after several years of unprecedented growth, the wtbts experienced an exodus of disallusioned thousands which many attribute to the failed 1975 prophesy (see www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/1975.php for details).

  the wtbts hierarchy subsequently played down the great disappointment of 1975, blamed its rank and file for having precipitated it, and has successfully swept it under the carpet.

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  Pahpa

  The Society always left a "plausible denialibilty" clause for its predictions. And

  it always seemed to blame the members for reading into them more than was

  intended. But for us who went through this period of time, we remember

  well the urgency and emphasis of the message from the Watchtower. Much

  of it came through the COs and DOs at assemblies. I remember one talk at

  an assembly where the Watchtower representative said we were no longer

  talking about years or months but should be counting the days and hours.

  Another announced that we were like the ancient Israelite army marching

  around Jericho on the last day just before the trumpets sounded and the

  walls fell. We all figured this was the official view of the Watchtower leaders.

  Many of us were shocked when it denied responsiblilty of the 1975 forecast.

  Pahpa
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  4

  danger for JW,s on facebook

  by jam in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  background; my son a agnostic, baptize but never df.

  the jw member of the family.

  knows his view.

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  Pahpa

  I'm dumbfounded by how many JWs including elders are posted on Facebook.

  I thought the Watchtower discouraged this type of thing? Recently, my

  daugther was contacted by her uncle, an elder. Of course, he tried to

  preach to her. She quickly removed her name. But I wondered if JWs

  see this as means to "count time" in the comfort of their homes. I must

  admit it is better than going from "house to house." I wonder what the

  official view of the Watchtower is on this latest trend?
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  38

  KM Jan 2011 Family Worship

  by dozy in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  there is a big insert in the jan kingdom ministry about the family worship night (which has evolved new capital letters - like governing body.).

  some helpful suggestions include the head of the household putting an agenda on the fridge door a few days ahead for the family to "build excitement and anticipation" (i kid you not.

  ) the provision is compared to the sabbath arrangement as a gift from god.

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  Pahpa

  Dozy is right. It seems to be right out of the Mormon handbook. The

  Watchtower seems to be experimenting a lot these days. With the

  recent changes in the book study and condensed meetings on

  Sunday one has to wonder if these accomodations are because

  of the lack of interest or the decreasing commitment of the members.

  Pahpa
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  64

  Has the WTBS ever explained the trinity?

  by wobble in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  if i were going to comment on a deep philosophical doctrine, i would first outline what that doctrine was,has the wtbs ever dne this properly with the trinity?

  from memory they have only ever reasoned at the level"one plus one plus one = 3, not one" type of argument,and odd references to trinities in pagandom.. surely a college education would be of benefit to them so they know how to present a thesis?.

  love.

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  Pahpa

  The development of the trinity doctrine took centuries. The earliest Christians who were for the most part Jews would never have accepted Jesus as "God" Almighty. And it is obvious that many Christians even in the fourth century rejected that idea. Regardless of the faulty arguments that the Watchtower has presented, there has been some opposition to this doctrine down through the years by various Christian groups and scholars. Because it is now accepted as "orthodoxy" by the majority doesn't necessarily mean it is true. Otherwise, many of the Protestant teachings could be branded as false since a majority of professed Christians reject them. (Example: Baptist rejection of infant baptism.)

  Even orthodoxy has declared the trinity doctrine as a "mystery." It can not be explained by human logic. It requires one to accept the philosophical explanation that God is divided into "three persons" or manifestations. One can not imagine the early Christians who were average working people accepting this. And even today, I think the average church goers can't explain it. They accept it only because their priest or minister tells them it is true.
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  50

  As I stated before the Great Tribulation is picking up speed!!!!!!!!!!

  by unbaptized in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  when i think about the biblical tale of noah!

  i think of the time we are living in today and how it resembles noah's time.

  no one's really paying attention.

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  Pahpa

  I think that this current news might be more indicative of a failure of a world power (U.S.) to maintain its economic standing in the world. The situation is a warning that all empires eventually are destroyed by overextending militarily or economically. What we may be seeing is the demise of the U.S. as the richest and most powerful nation in the world. Great Britain had this distinction before WW I. The collapse of its empire came relatively sudden. Now, it is only a shadow of its former self. Perhaps we are seeing a repeat of the same processes at work.

  Like other members on this board, I saw dire predictions with every event in the news that prompted JWs to predict the nearness of "the end" over the years. But the "convincing proof" turned out to be an unconvincing spoof.
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  11

  Is this normal?!

  by Lo in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i'm one of those ones who drifted away before getting to heavily in...thank god...but upon arrival in my new house i found a letter, a hand written letter in my letterbox from a local witness saying they had called around a few times and no one had been in, had a special message etc etc and gave an address which is a kingdom hall should the residents wish to contact her.

  is it usual to write such a long hand written letter??

  i think it's a bit strange.

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  Pahpa

  I had a call this afternoon from a Jehovah's Witness. Since my wife and I live in a private retirement community JWs can not make regular house-to-house calls here. So, we get an occasional phone call. And I've had some interesting discussions with the callers over the years. More often than not, it was an elderly person that called. Undoubtedly, it was one way to "count time."

  It should be noted, though, that unless the letter that was left in the mail box had been mailed with proper postage, the person leaving it was technically breaking the law. When I was still associated, we were instructed never to put the literature in a mail box. We could leave it in the doors or wait to make later contact. Unless the law has changed, this would still be an illegal use of the mail box.
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  10

  JW's have lost their minds....Fox News

  by tan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  not sure if this has already been posted but here's the story.... .

  http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,427803,00.html .

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  Pahpa

  Every religious group has mentally disturbed individuals. And one can not put the blame on a religious organization for those individuals that commit crimes. Certainly, the Watchtower Society would never have condoned such as those that were reported in Fox News. To the contrary it would condemn the perpertrators.

  More suspect is the system that is trying to stop the Watchtower from making converts. It is an old tactic to inflame the populace against an unpopular movement by linking a horrendous crime of two individuals to the whole organization. Shame on Fox News for reporting it in this fashion.

  James_woods is right. There are legitimate criticisms of the Watchtower. This is not one of them!