i don't know if this was discussed here before, but, what is the most ignorant comment you ever heard an elder say.
i once had an elder say to me that my brother, who was at the time fighting in vietnam will be destroyed and killed over in 'nam because he did not accept "jehovah"!!!!
i promptly told him to go "f" himself.
I told a Judicial Committee that I had had a miscarriage and an old elder (at least 80) said "That's an abortion!!! You just killed a child!!!" It took the other two elders 10 minutes to convince him that miscarriages do occur in nature.
BITE ME, WATCHTOWER!!!
< http://www.edition-temmen.com/timetable/.
hans-hermann dirksen, jurgen harder, hans hesse, and johannes wrobel .
chronology: development and persecution of jehovah's witnesses.
I need to do more research to support any conclusions, but it just sems to me:
1) It was not so much the possesion of bibles and teaching and witnessing of the Bible and God and Jesus that was the problem; it was the MAN MADE, AMERICAN mandated holding of property, printing machinery and the distribution of literature that contributed to the beginnings of great problem among the JW/IBSA's.
2) If the Witnesses could have just faded into the woodwork, and carried on their bible education work quietly with family, friends and neighbors, perhaps fewer would have been imprisioned and killed and Hitler might not have noticed them so soon.
3) AFTER the German government made it clear that JW's were a target, the AMERICAN Watchtower Society arranged CONVENTIONS, of all the damn things, which simply focused more attention on the poor JW's and therefore made them mORE of a target. It also made it easier for the Germans to identify individual JW's (by virtue of their attending). And the Bible says for American followers of Jesus to do this to their German brethen...WHERE?
4) The idea that German people had to be imprisoned and executed just so that an American printing company could make more profit just makes me want to cry.
Just my 1/2 cents worth...
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
i'm extremely confused by the answers in some of your posts.
you keep refering to "new light" and have also explained why the wtbts has made errors along the way, even though it has caused the "stumbling" of thousands.
your logic makes sense except for 1 questions that continues to go through my mind.. although all of god's messengers, apostles, disciples, etc.
New light, old light, STROBE LIGHT...
How many examples are there in the Bible where 'old light' became 'new light' became 'old light' AGAIN?
Since this question can't be answered in any affirmative way, I will simply await the name-calling and the patronizing holier-than-thou, God-is-on-my-side-only, responses JW's are trained from the platform to give and most likely will come.
Jehovah's Witnesses can't seem to talk any other way.
The alternative is to admit that they belonged to and SUPPORTED an organization that killed more people than the Branch Davidians and People's Temple.
No other organization is like this...THANK GOD ALMIGHTY!!!!!
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
< http://www.uj.edu.pl/confer/columbia98/bios.html.
a portion:.
carolyn wah (patterson, new york is assistant general counsel for the watchtower bible and tract society of new york, inc. ms. wah is an attorney and was admitted to law practice in the state of new york in 1985. she has published numerous papers and given presentations on issues of religious practice, minority religions, mental health and family law.
Hey, maybe someone should ask dear MS. WAH if she cares two whits about women who were df'd for being rape/molestation survivors, or children deprived of their life by parents who denied them available medical treatment.
I guess they can't pay the high lawyers fees.
sf...do you ever sleep?
(((sf)))
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
hsta hannover), hann.
hsta hannover, hann.
hsta hannover, hann.
It has seen asserted by researchers that Jehovah's Witnesses were not persecuted for 'God's sake', nor for 'Jesus' sake', nor for the Bible's sake.
They were persecuted because of the things they SAID the Bible MEANT and for their INTERPRETATION of the Bible, seeing as how Jesus did not speak either English (The first translation of the NWT) nor German (another translation FROM English).
This article actually relates the contents of one of their pieces of literature; and also that this woman was arrested because of this literature. As Ray Franz brought out in one of his books, is passing out literature a mandate established by Jesus? Was this something the woman was told she HAD to do or else be judged bloodguilty by God?
There is no excusing the Nazi regime for the lives they took and the damage they did. On the other hand, would Jehovah's Witnesses/IBSA's ever have been a target of Hitler's if they did not preach that 'only jehovah's witnesses/IBSA's would be saved in the Armegeddon that was coming any minute...' Why did they teach these things? Because they were told to by...you guessed it...J. F. Rutherford and his Watchtower Society. (What a far cry from the Mexican situation as outlined in Ray's book).
I am not aware that Rutherford nor the Watchtower ever expressed the slightest bit of regret about the lives their literature cost some of the German people. Telling everyone you're going to die die die' and 'be bird food' and whatever else unchristian messages they carried could ONLY have resulted in persecution of these very simple, probably good hearted German people; and it resulted in advertising and a lot of money in book sales for Rutherford and his business.
AND TO THIS DAY the Watchtower continues to use these dead people for advertising, for publicity, to produce more revenue. And not just the Germans. The Watchtower's policy of making Unchristian judgements on other people and governments is costing Greek men their freedom and Russian persons their very safety. The only thing that will end this seemingly never ending, multi-generational cycle is education of the public so that they do not FALL for this cult-oriented drivel in the FIRST place.
Rutherford was no different than Reverend Jim Jones or David Koresh, ready for their people to die for them for THEIR own personal reasons.
The Watchtower is no different than The People's Temple or the Branch Davidians; just follow the money trail.
And as far as The Watchtower being the only organization of its kind; THANK GOD ALMIGHTY!!!!!
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
i asked this question in hillarys thread.since it may get lost and was a whole nother topic,thought id ask here.. i've been wondering about this label for some time now.. in my old cong.
'good standing' meant someone attending mtgs,fs etc.
i had never heard it applied to walkaways.
There was a time when 'good standing' meant the minimum hours of field service are met, not df'd or da'd;
But it seems more recently that good standing now means simple not df'd, da'd, or under any restrictions and not in imminent danger of a JC. It may vary from congregation to congregation, and an elder/pioneer may have a different interpretation of the phrase from a publisher/inactive member in the same congregation!!! This last is my interpretation.
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
well folks, it was a great day today in sunny wollongong (can i say that, ozzie?)!
many apostates turned up (albeit belatedly, much to mrs ozzie's dismay!
) and after the mandatory exchanging of secret handshakes and gestures, the bbq began.
<Giving apostate wave>
Heehee....good going guys!!!!! Hope you had 'one' for me.
((((hugs all around)))))
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
check out this response to a topic over at yahoo single witnesses.
the poster known as greatgrooves2002 is surely toast after this one...lol!!!.
it seems that texasangelchild asked some pretty tough questions, as she recently began studying after the death of her twin sister.
((((((((greatgrooves2002))))))))).....you GO!!!!!!!
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
here's a good one.. .
hypocrite organization "disassociates" from the un.
they will come to your door soon, and they will bear in hand a magazine that warns you about "'religious hypocrisy".
I was under the (perhaps mistaken) impression that the Watchtower withdrew from the UN as a preemptive strike against being investigated for a fraudulant application and possibly being sanctioned.
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
If you could be reached by email, you might get more responses than you did the LAST time you asked this question.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=13785&site=3#164818
There are over 3000 registeered users, many don't want to post on this board.
Also, I recomended to you to find an ex-jw email listing on the web, there are many. There is one on the freeminds site. If you have trouble accessing it, perhaps someone could send it to you.
I understand your value your privacy....but do you want help or NOT!!!!!
Dungbeetle...so much dung, so little time...
