Posts by AllTimeJeff

6

Some Civility

by ufo1 in

jw
friends

it is with some hesitation that i post this as i dont post too often, however i am on here every day and i do read about 95% of all threads.

i also want to say that this is not meant in any way to insult anyone, or to single out any point of view.

the reason i post this is that this site has been and continues to be a great place for helping those of us who have been hurt by the wt, and i dont want that to change.

You know, I have to say that the threads that get heated generally are in the Politics or Heated Debate threads. There is a place for that, and I think its a good thing for former JW's to stretch their muscles.

Speaking for myself, I learn as much as I give on some of those debates. To work through the issues and learning to be a responsible informed citizen is an important step for people who leave JW's.

It's also a good reminder to me that the world is a rough place. One selling point JW's use quite a bit is their utopian view of their "spiritual paradise", and how arguments and heated emotions really shouldn't exist.

I agree that sustained bad feelings and anger are bad for anyone. But I know many who leave JW's are surprised to deal with the world on a different level. It's tough out there. Being a JW doesn't prepare you for that reality at all. So when I read of hot headed opinions, and people getting upset because (surprise!) people disagree with them, there is another lesson that is learned. Don't expect everyone to fall over for your thoughts. You've got to earn your way in this world, and the fact that you show up with your mere presence isn't enough to change anyone's mind.

To me, these debates reveal those who have at least thought through some of the issues and can explain them on some level, and those who inherited them from others, and want to parrot what they hear without giving it due thought, as a responsible citizen should. (both sides politically)

Religiously, the theistic debates that go on are just as important, for obvious reasons. Former JWs have a ton of stuff to work out on the whole god/worship question. No surprise that arguments will sometimes occur.

I do agree though, that a more civil, less hostile tone, could be taken by many. There are times I have failed in that, although I try my best to be civil. Sometimes I fail too. Still trying to improve there.

7

1914 A Significant Year - Not Just For the Jehovah's Witness Religion!

by donuthole in

was doing some reading on the teachings of the nation of islam (the religous group that malcolm x originally belonged to).

thought it was interesting that they believed that 1914 marked the end of 6000 years of the white man's dominance in the world.. previous research on the group informally known as the 2x2's or cooneyites revealed that their ousted founder, william irvine, preached that 1914 would be the end of the age of grace and a cut-off point for the saved and the world would enter a time period of judgment.. does anyone else know of any groups where 1914 is held to be a biblically significant date?.

AllTimeJeff

I just had an interesting thought about 1914. Esp for us former JW's.

To illustrate a point first, what are we going to remember 2001 for? 9/11.

1941? Pearl Harbor.

1914?

Most sane people remember or know that it was all about the start of WWI, the first modern 20th century war, complete with tanks, airplanes, flame throwers, and mass casualties the likes of which we hadn't seen before. Until WWII.

But JW's and ex JW's still have 1914 as that goddam prophecy the GB keeps trying to maintain, thanks to the odd coincidence that WWI started that year.

As Terry mentioned on another thread, a stopped clock is always right two times a day. Doesn't mean it works.

The real legacy of 1914 for the world is that tragic war. JW's are just a freak footnote to that year, but it doesn't matter in the least to the real significance of that year.

Of course, those who have escaped the JW cult have an entirely different view of that year, and we should honor that. But some perspective in restoring what that year really means for mankind and our planet is never a bad reminder, imo.

8

Ever want to punch a Dub?

by kurtbethel in

jw
friends

you can, on facebook.. http://www.facebook.com/vw?pageid=45870804&adid=222309385.

disclaimer: no person of any religious order was harmed in producing this message.

causing physical harm to any religious person is not endorsed by the poster..

AllTimeJeff

Ever want to punch a Dub?

Yes. I can never make up my mind if I want to beat the shit out of Circuit elders as Batman, Spiderman, or Thor.

131

ATJeff Answers Letters from JW Readers

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

i didn't want to hijack billy x's attempt at hijacking another thread directed to our apostate terrorist, reinna.

this is a parady that only ex jw's could possibly appreciate.

whether you appreciate my macabre sense of humor is entirely another matter.

AllTimeJeff

Dear Precious Brothers,

My window cleaning business isn't paying the bills, and cleaning toilets isn't working out so well for me. I was wondering if I could please, just please go take a course on shoe-polishing to get a job on the side.

Unfortunately, it seems we will be here for a while longer, seeing as generations can overlap each other, which DOESN'T MAKE NOT A LOT OF SENSE, but you guys have the holy spirit, so what freaking ever...

Thanks,

Brother Twinkles.

Dear Gentile Twinkles

There is a scripture that we like to refer to... no, make that a WT Article, no, I think it was in a 1985 Awake

Point is, we think you should do two things 1) Get more accounts and 2) Lower your price

Most economists think that this is a piss poor way to run a business, but remember, we did lower the pioneer hours in the 1990's, and we got rid of the bookstudy last year. So we think you should just suck it up and work harder and longer for less money. It's the bethel way!

Now if you will excuse us, we are going to commune with our dead and dearly departed former GB members. We are going to have a mult generational circle jerk.

Your multi generational brothers

The Borg

49

interesting email circulating amongst witnesses: gubberning body says preaching reason is..................

by DaCheech in

enjoy these remarks, friends.

and, as always, if you have received this from another source, please just delete, forgive me and move on!

saturday, january 9, 2010, 8:22 am .

AllTimeJeff

If someone with WT Library would like to do a sentence scope search of "Life saving work" I would be interested in what you would find.

PS Will I damage my computer if I get WT Library again? I feel so dirty thinking about it.

16

"Woe for the Earth and for the Sea!"

by wannabe in

"woe for the earth and for the sea!".

he has made known the end from the beginning, and what is still to come; as well, assures us all there, that his purpose will stand, and he will do all that he pleases.. .

"{jeremiah 25:31-36 niv}.

AllTimeJeff

Btw wannabe

I am cool with you believing the bible. I just was reading your post for a while, then my eyes got cross eyed, then I got confused because someone was trying to interpret Revelation to me again....

So it gets a little old. Suffice to say, Revelation isn't a book I think of to start with so that I can prove JW's wrong, insofar as anyone can interpret Revelation to anything they want.

But I do know that JW's are totally full of crap when it comes to their explanation, so I wish you well in deconstructing their crap.

16

"Woe for the Earth and for the Sea!"

by wannabe in

"woe for the earth and for the sea!".

he has made known the end from the beginning, and what is still to come; as well, assures us all there, that his purpose will stand, and he will do all that he pleases.. .

"{jeremiah 25:31-36 niv}.

AllTimeJeff

So, is Wannabe a jw or just a wannabe?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3wgaWAHo2Q

Well, I am all for beliving that Revelation is a cogent, logical, point by point explanation of something.

IF you can get past big furry beasts eating prostitutes and seeing horsemen riding clouds.

Sooooo, what? This means what wannabe? What context are you saying this? Preaching? Teaching? What is the practical value of what you wrote? (in a few sentences this time, please?)

15

Does the GB keep a list of all members of 144 000, alive and dead?

by african GB Member in

jw
friends

i've always wondered how they keep track of all members,.

like keeping a list and then scratching off those who pass away.. for example:.

bro minimus.

AllTimeJeff

No, it would NOT have thousands of names on that list.

I am probably taking the question and the title of this thread too literally, but you have to understand that from the GB's point of view, a partaker is NOT of the 144,000, even if they are baptized JW's.

We all know that there is no way to verify dead "annointed" ones, esp after the 1930's, when JW's started to develop their own laity class.

There is no list of every partaker. There is a list of "annointed" partakers that the GB keeps track of that they consider to be "genuine annointed."

This was not done throughout the history of JW's. I doubt they would claim that the list is all encompasing. (i.e. plausible deniability) But make no mistake that genuine annointed Christians are kept track of. The rest are ignored, other then to count them once a year.

Why else have it as an option to check off if the publisher claims to be annointed or other sheep? It is still on every publishers record card.

Particularly are brothers paid attention to. It isn't a list that they refer to to keep track of all who claim to be part of the 144,000. It is a list to keep track of those who claim to be annointed. Big difference there. It accomplishes two things: 1) Keeps track of potential trouble makers. 2) Keeps track of potential company men as future leaders.

15

Does the GB keep a list of all members of 144 000, alive and dead?

by african GB Member in

jw
friends

i've always wondered how they keep track of all members,.

like keeping a list and then scratching off those who pass away.. for example:.

bro minimus.

AllTimeJeff

Just to clarify, the CO is depended upon to verify "genuine annointed" to the branch. Locally, there is no provision for reporting names of partakers to the branch.

30

FRAUD at the proper time: Watchtower swindle and GB nonsense

by Terry in

food at the proper time?

there is a huge difference between an opinion and a false teaching.. what if it could be unambiguously demonstrated that a teaching is not merely opinion but a false religious view passed off as absolute truth in the name of a higher authority?.

would that not be fraud?

AllTimeJeff

Agonus

Surely if there was a strikingly similar vein of belief (other then an invisible personality in the heavens to worship) that would actually prove something, then it would have been pieced together by now.

The fact that man has in its history always worshipped something they created in their imagination doesn't prove anything. So far, none of those gods have been proven right? Isn't it a bit of hubris for this generations gods to be considered to their heretofore failed counterparts of the past?

It isn't the belief in something or someone greater then yourself that really disturbs me. It is that it is argued as though it should be accepted fact, using faulty premises, disingenuous arguments, and at times, downright falsehoods.

That is why I am a big proponent of seperating the quality of "spirituality" (semantics aside on the word) from the groups that claim it as their property, organized religion. One's personal path shouldn't be dictated by the superstitious agenda of any particular group.