Posts by AllTimeJeff

I got this to one side of one page. Of all the things I am most proud of, it's this. It was personal and factual. I know who the brothers are who would read this. I sure hope that it affected them.

There is no one who works in the Service Dept who dies ignorant of all the JW hypocrisy and lies.

75

one of the many questions that i am asked is what are the current gb members like, who are the hardliners and who are more moderate.. because of my previous job, at a european bethel, i had dealings with most of them with the exception of sam herd.. these are my observations of my conversations with them and how others who had dealings with them.. other ex bethelites may have contrary views to mine, but i would be surprised.. i had spent a lot of time with splane, lett and morris.

hardliners.

david splane, without doubt the one who commands the most respect and attention.

AllTimeJeff

Just some thoughts I have from my experience with GB 2.0

First off, the GB has always been Elder Body Ground Zero. Read CoC and any elder will instantly recognize that this group is the same as most elder bodies; With loud and quiet members of varying political savviness.

Also, just a general rule of thumb that I learned for myself: It's not the elder/GB who is the loudest you have to worry about. At least you know what they think It's the one who keeps to himself that is nice to everyone, quieter in his ways, that is the really dangerous one. Thus, Morris and Loesch are not the ones you have to worry about. They don't know any better then to be loud. Having said that Morris being in charge of the Service Dept is sort of like a demented Jaracz running around.

It seems to be the general consensus that Splane has become the most influential. I don't know if it's true, but you have to assume that the most politically astute would take that role. Splane would fit that bill.

Loesch is not taken seriously I think, which is why he speaks out more. He will always hate american football, and it will never be banned.

Lett is trouble. That rubber face is a facade.

Herd is along for the ride. If I am not mistaken, he was a big fan of Jack Barr. He was along for the ride too.

Pierce just wants to do "elder/GB" stuff. I don't think he cares as much about making policy or new prophecies as he is enforcing them.

Geoff Jackson uses humor to mask an agenda in my opinion. With him, we will know about whatever he is up to when it happens. He and Mark Noumair were in the same congregation in Patterson, where Mark served as PO c. 2005. They were/are tight.

There will be more GB members at some point. You can be assurred that additions to GB 2.1 will be expert @$$ kissers.

123

An Open letter to the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses (Elders/ Ex-Elders)

by stuckinamovement in

jw
friends

if you are an elder or an ex-elder please add a comment.

i hope that the governing body will see this.

it is too bad it has to be on an anonymous forum.

AllTimeJeff

I missed this. Certainly an excellent letter. I think all letters, regardless of position or rank are important. I think that letters from elders carry more weight though, because the Service Dept can't pretend the issues listed don't exist. I think it also adds legitimacy to the fank and file when they leave.

I know that the Service Dept reads all letters from elders when they leave (as long as they aren't novels.)

Just a personal opinion. Any elder knows the gold standard of elder letters is to keep it to one side of one page. If an elder does that in his resignation letter, it is sort of a subliminal "EFF YOU".

19

The Internet: Viewed by the Governing Body and Former JW's.

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

it's sort of funny how the internet has turned into the bugaboo of the governing body's existence.

imagine the nerve of people masquerading as ip addresses, with no congregation secretary to track back to!.

of course, "apostates/former jw's" have a view of the internet that sometimes isn't all to realistic either.

AllTimeJeff

St George, I hope that works out for you and your family.

Outlaw, only you can add the visual's to what many of us think.

I appreciate and agree with all of the comments, but I think Breakfast of Champions hit it best. Like the "Arab Spring" in the middle east and what it teaches, it is only when people decide to break free of their shackles that freedom is possible. Information was always available.

Dictators and despots, whether political or religious, are not looking to build anything on anything of quality that takes time. Fear is the mortar that mixes most quickly.

There are so many lessons to learn, but the biggest and best is the simplest, the one that I think is actually the biggest lesson of all of us being here.

We think that the information found on the internet caused us to leave. Sure, it helped me, and it helped you. I used to think that writing and exposing was key.

But could I do better than Randy Watters? Barbara Anderson? Ray freakin Franz?

Can you?

No, it really is a case of leading a horse to water, but not being able to make it drink.

The Arab Spring, imperfect as it is, demonstrates that information alone means nothing without the desire to be free.

If YOU want to waste your time in fantasies of bringing down the WT, you might as well try to write blogs in the hopes that you can bring democracy to Syria all on your own. Or maybe with a website dripping with blood....

If you want to get your family or loved ones out, you shouldn't be trying to forcefeed them information.

You should really test to see if they WANT to be free. That is really the only way out. And to be honest, most people don't want to be free and can't handle thinking for themselves. That is not exclusive of JW's either.

The internet didn't bring down JW's in the 90's and it won't in the future. It only freed those that wanted to be free, when they wanted to be free, when they were ready. That won't change.

No one leaves without being ready. Looking at it from that lens, the GB shouldn't really be as worried as they are. Sure, they can't give up the over 100 year old lie they protect. But no one will be interested in learning about those lies till they want to free anyway.

20

SIXSCREENS - what happened?

by RagingBull in

i went to the sixscreens site to see if rick had posted any new conference calls, but the last one was from the 7th of may.

did he stop them?

was it the johnny "the bethelite" fiasco that put a stop to it all?

AllTimeJeff

Ricks over-the-top style has been the subject of countless threads here in recent months and have stirred no end of debate and controversy.. By far the majority of posters have objected to his tabloid and sensationalist approach . . . to absolutely no avail.

I wasn't aware that he was the subject of controversy here, at least more then usual. I saw a thread about some fake he interviewed that apparantly wasn't real. If that was true, in hindsight, Mr Six Screens would be an easy target due to how naked his hatred and aims are toward JW's.

Regardless, I want to be clear that I have no genuine personal emotions against Rick. I have my own reasons with what I went through as a JW to say positively that Rick's methods are absolutely wrong and counter productive, to say nothing of my own very strong opinions of the state of mind of some one who creates a website designed to scare people about JW's instead of inform the public about them, and the willingness to interview anyone with wild claims in the hopes that somehow, that will bring down JW's. (?)

Alas, I can't control anyone or make anyone think. The paradox is that the very unwillingness to think and reason in reality that dooms JW's and their leadership can also happen to a former JW with delusions of bringing them down. Exhibit 1: Six Screens.

Again, that isn't personal, but in my view, it is very much the truth of the matter.

20

SIXSCREENS - what happened?

by RagingBull in

i went to the sixscreens site to see if rick had posted any new conference calls, but the last one was from the 7th of may.

did he stop them?

was it the johnny "the bethelite" fiasco that put a stop to it all?

AllTimeJeff

I wish Rick nothing but the best for himself personally. Having said that, I always felt his approach was overly dramatic. His website was WAY over the top and actually lessened his credibility to most reasonable people I think.

If he gets rid of his website, I think he does a service to his stated goal. It's over the top websites like Six Screens that the GB actually points to and says "See, ALL apostates are like this."

All apostates AREN'T like Rick. Most just leave, knowing that the majority of JW's are duped people, whose inclination is not to think for themselves and are thusly taught not to.

Rick wants revenge in my opinion. I apologize for the far away judgement, I am sure I don't have all the facts myself. But I do know his website and approach are counter prouductive to his stated cause.

I hope he finds real peace, and if he is reading this, I do wish him and his loved ones peace and healing from all that JW's inflicted upon him.

19

The Internet: Viewed by the Governing Body and Former JW's.

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

it's sort of funny how the internet has turned into the bugaboo of the governing body's existence.

imagine the nerve of people masquerading as ip addresses, with no congregation secretary to track back to!.

of course, "apostates/former jw's" have a view of the internet that sometimes isn't all to realistic either.

AllTimeJeff

It's sort of funny how the internet has turned into the bugaboo of the Governing Body's existence. Imagine the nerve of people masquerading as IP addresses, with no congregation Secretary to track back to!

Of course, "apostates/former JW's" have a view of the internet that sometimes isn't all to realistic either. We have all seen the few that have tried to bring the WT down in an act of vengeful hubris.

I don't refer to those whom I think are real stalwarts, like Randy Watters, JW facts and Barbara Anderson to name a few. Not to mention the many moderators of former JW boards (like this one) who keep these JW discussion boards from resembling Vancouver after a game 7 hockey match.

I wonder if anyone has given thought to what the internet has actually turned out to be (aka, reality) as opposed to what the GB and former JW's view it as.

The GB views the internet as a danger. They are correct.

The GB thinks they can keep their flock away from the internet. They are incorrect.

Apostates think they can bring down Jehovah's Witnesses via the internet. They are not correct.

The GB tries to demonize almost every aspect of the internet, esp websites that promote former JW experiences and exposes.

Some apostates use the internet to spread myth's about JW's that aren't true (ritualistic Satan worship at Bethel) instead of exposing the very real and easy facts about JW's that make them dangerous in. (protection of pedophiles, hypocritical stand on blood medicine, and their lies on false prophecies and the behavior of their leadership, past and present) Oh, and they could try and present them in a reasonable manner, but that sometimes is a swing and miss too.

In reality, the internet and what it has become has exposed JW's and the cracks that were already there. Apostates didn't create them. The fact is, JW's and the GB were always happy to embrace any kind of new printing technology. Communication technology is dangerous however, because they instantly lost control of the message.

The issue has always been about the control of the message. During the morse code years prior to the internet, the GB didn't have to worry about Ray Franz. Even when CoC was first printed, most JW's weren't aware of the books existence. Througout the 1980's and into the early 90's, JW grew all over the world at a rapid rate, esp in Western countries. It wasn't until the internet blew up in the mid 90's that those events of 1979-1980 became easily available for the first time. And that is when JW's stopped growing in the West, which has continued to now. While Ray Franz has passed on, it seems that the majority of the sales for CoC the past 15 years have been via the internet. That isn't an accident.

That is why I speak out against the extreme fringe of "apostate" websites. It isn't that they aren't well meaning. Six Screens, like Six Flags, seems like a lot of fun, but at the end of the day, you only end up all wet.

It's time to realize that the internet ISN'T bringing down JW's now, and it won't in the future. JW's are doing that all on their own by holding onto their Flintsone theology and worldview. They are doing it to themselves. The internet is merely a resource for those who start to wake up on their own and need to follow the light out of that cultish cave. Sure, some informative websites like freeminds and jwfacts absolutely help a few. But I am sure that the owners of those sites would admit that they haven't started a movement of any kind, and that their best contribution has been as a resource to those who have already taken their first steps out of the borganization.

The internet for apostates has the same value as it does for anyone else. It brings us closer together. The biggest help it provides former JW's is access to real information. But you can lead a horse to water, you can't make him drink!

I write this tonight because it occurs to me that it is now more apparant then ever that Jehovah's Witnesses got it wrong. 1914? A SHAM PROPHECY. Do we need to picket Brooklyn? No. They are leaving Brooklyn with their tail between their legs. We didn't do that, they did it to themselves.

Their is no point at launching a torpedo at a ship that is taking on water. Get your life preserver on first, then help anyone who wants to float away from the wreck.

The internet is good for hanging out, getting some facts, healing, and moving on. It's a great place for those brave JW's who WANT to think for themselves to start that journey toward freedom. The internet DOESN'T have the power to actually get people to think. And that is the great truth of it all.

JW's and other cults like them (and they are out there, they aren't going anywhere) will always attract those that don't want to think for themselves. You can't help people like that.

Do you want freedom and to accept responsibility for your own life? Then the GB has already lost, and you are on your way to freedom.

Plus, you get to hang out with really cool, mostly anonymous former JW's like me! (lol) Well, if you want to I guess.....

PEACE!

77

Please Do a 13-Word Sentence Describing How You Feel Right Now

by snowbird in

right now, i feel lower than a dead dog on flatwoods plantation road.. syl.

AllTimeJeff

I wish I could help YOU to see how beautiful YOU really are.

6

Nothing To Write, But Not Without Something to Say

by AllTimeJeff in

jw
friends

hey all.

i enjoyed my sabatical from our crazy little 5 feet of the cyber world.

i remember coming on here, leaving jw's and having so much to say, so much to expose.

AllTimeJeff

Hey all. I enjoyed my sabatical from our crazy little 5 feet of the cyber world.

I remember coming on here, leaving JW's and having so much to say, so much to expose. Not that I was in any way the first. I felt a slight bit unique only because it was at Gilead that I had my anti-epiphany. Are you kidding? I was an elder, got to be a pioneer hot shot, just like I always (thought) I wanted. All the while, deep deep down, wondering what the hell I was doing? Something wasn't right. Had to shun my gay brother pursuing spiritual bullshit goals. But I was "good" at being a JW. It took me some growing up to figure it all out. And I did, eventually.

Anyway, I wrote a lot, with a lot of passion, angst, regret, and gratitude.

Over the last couple of years, I haven't felt like writing much, because I feel I am rehashing all that I wrote about. I don't write for my mind, I write for my heart. I think I have said and exposed all I can.

Not that I don't remember the idiodicy of being an elder, the final attempt at brainwashing that is Gilead, how W E I R D Bethel is.

But since I have been out for 5 years, I ain't in da loop no more. (can't say that fact makes me sad)

I appreciate all the new ones who come on here, starting that necessary journey for themselves. I will lend my voice when the spirit moves me.

I hope you don't mind the new, improved, old man AllTimeJeff. (ok, that's bullshit hubris, I'm 36) I am here for me, because y'all are cool. I will do what I can to be supportive of you.

I still remember how much it sucks to leave and lose your way and try to find it again. Remember, be tough, even if you have to lead with your chin. Love you all. You all are my kin.