Posts by IsaacJS2

New XJW article at my site

by IsaacJS2 in

jw
friends

just thought i'd mention that i finally wrote up a new article.

i'd have a lot more of them by now if not for the migraines getting in the way of things.

anyway, this is about handling a witness favorite: "the society has gotten us both through the tough times.

Just thought I'd mention that I finally wrote up a new article. I'd have a lot more of them by now if not for the migraines getting in the way of things. Anyway, this is about handling a Witness favorite: "The Society Has Gotten Us Both Through The Tough Times. You Owe Them Your Loyalty!" That's one I've heard mentioned a lot in the forums.

I think this one comes across a little stronger than some of my other articles. Let me know if you think it's too strong. Also, if there are any other advice articles you'd like to see, let me know.

Hope these are useful to some of you. The index for all the XJW articles are here. The main page, as always, is here.

IsaacJ

7

Are Some Witnesses Becoming Scary?

by metatron in

jw
friends

perhaps many of you are out of touch with large numbers of witnesses.

i think it is fair to say that.

much of the 'fire' has gone out of them, in recent years.

IsaacJS2

I'd consider that a pretty standard response to the situation. Psychologically, people tend to dig in even deeper when their beliefs are challenged. The human mind seems to have trouble letting go of something, especially if that something is based on a major decision - like, "The WTS has the True Religion and I'm dedicating the rest of my life to it!" Studies have actually been done on this sort of behavior. This is why I don't think protests and such are a good idea.

Of course, there were plenty of fanatical, Uber-Witnesses back in the 90s when I was a Witness, too. So I wouldn't get too excited. I know a lot of people have been posting stuff about how the WTS is going down any day now, but I seriously doubt it. They'll bounce back. Even if they don't, somebody will jump in and create a new corporation claiming to be a continuation of "The Truth" almost overnight. No one will care about legal or corporate technicalities. It'll just be Jehovah's way of testing the faithful.

Shame really.

IsaacJ

8

Watch out for ......RELATIVES!

by Gill in

relatives can be a problem.

at least in the eyes of the wt society, relatives are a threat to the mind control tactics they employ on their slaves.. the thing is, relatives may well love their relations who have unfortunately become trapped in the watchtower lies and so may try to reason, help, rescue and perhaps even get cross when trying to release their loved ones who continue to be ensnared in the watchtower trap!.

i noticed in the last two watchtowers that relatives are mentioned specifically and wondered how far the road of isolationism of their members the watchtower is now willing to go in warning their members against those who may try to help them.. december 15th watchtower, page 22 para 8:.

IsaacJS2

One thing - just to throw it out there - but I've observed that people who truly believe in something (a cause, a religion, or whatever) will tend to dig in deeper whenever someone presses them to change their views. Relatives who try to "rescue" WT slaves from the organization can unwittingly push them even deeper into it. These situations are very delicate, but many people make the mistake of bulldozing into them, unfortunately. The WT is the kind of thing you have to cut out with a scalpel, not an axe.

If there's ever any hope of getting an earnest Bible study to part ways with the Society it has to be very early on. Once the foundation is laid, any serious pressure to get them to leave can actually backfire. I think that's one of the reasons why Witnesses put this idea into our heads early on. I was frequently told things like, "Remember, Satan will try to discourage you from studying. He may even use your family against you." I think the Society uses situations like these to help it keep new people and that's why it frames the issue in this way. It's a bit of a gamble for them, but it can actually serve their purposes and encourage a student to accelerate their progression toward baptism. Especially if the family member gets too crazy about the student's affiliation with the Society. And many do, which is exactly what the Society wants.

This is one of the reasons why I don't think that protests against the Society and things like that are a good idea.

Just my 2 cents...

IsaacJ

31

Top Ten Lame Excuses Why The Watchtower Society Predictions Never Came True

by Homerovah the Almighty in

top ten lame excuses why the watchtower society predictions never came true.

1. c. t. russell measured the great pyramid with his hands, found to be inaccurate.

2. judge rutherford was dyslexic, year 1925 should have read 5291 instead.

IsaacJS2

Did someone mention a top ten list????? Sweet. I hope some of these don't suck.

Top Ten Lame Excuses Why The Watchtower Society Predictions Never Came True

1. Jehovah was too busy thumb wrestling with Zeus to notice the date had passed. (Curse you Zeus!!!) Now we're all screwed.

2. We're already in the new system. But Satan built this race of machines that would lock all of our minds in a computer simulation called "The Matrix" to fool us. Jesus doesn't really know computers, but they've got an angel with a "Computers for Dummies" book workin' on it, so any day now...

3. Our magical fax machine to heaven is broken, so we had to make something up at the last minute. Our bad. Say, do you have any fairy toner we could borrow??? We need it really bad. (Keebler Elves too busy to lone them any of theirs)

4. Predictions? We never made any predictions. Oh, and day is now night and night is now day. As you were.

5. We were high.

6. Maybe they meant 1914 in heaven!?

7. Funny story. See, when Jesus makes predictions ... well ... he talks with sort of a lisp. Ya know?

8. Fine. Make up your own d*mn religion then!!

9. We were testing your intelligence. I mean, your resolve to serve Jehovah. Hey! Don't moon me over there! ...

10. Okay, hang on a sec. ::shake shake shake:: The black cube thingy says "Answer unclear, try again later."

IsaacJ

31

how is the WT a "literature selling scam"?

by inkling in

i have heard several people refer to the society as publishing company in the business.

of selling books and magazines.. i just don't see how this view can be valid considering that i almost never see.

any "voluntary contributions" come in from the door-to-door work.

IsaacJS2

I've seen several people mention that profits from the literature have been falling off. I was always told - even as a JW - that their profits had actually gone up considerably since they were forced to switch over to the donation arrangement. (According to my local Elders and the literature servant at any rate) Has this changed or what's up with that?

If the Witnesses aren't giving as much, then it would also stand to reason that profits would fall for the lit since they're the ones paying for nearly all of it one way or another.

IsaacJ

10

Is the Governing Body "Spirit Directed" or "Inspired" ??? See Difference..

by Lady Liberty in

hello all, happy sunday to you!!.

just read quandrys post about the 2007 annual meeting notes.

this comment made during that meeting just got under my skin, so i decided to start a thread to show the dictionarys definition of both of the words.

IsaacJS2

Bear in mind that I'm an atheist here, so I' don't believe in any of these people or things. But it seems to me that if Jesus - the most powerful being in all of everything this side of Jehovah - is really in charge of the organization and is somehow guiding it, then why has he allowed himself to be reduced to an impotent shadow who must subtly nudge a bunch of guys in the right direction whenever a decision is to be made? I mean, what's stopping him from taking human form and popping down once a week to call the old boys in for a board meeting? He can't possibly be that shy.

If Jesus or Jehovah or whoever is running the show behind the scenes, why allow their all important, life-saving organization vacillate from one policy to another year after year? Wouldn't they want their special organization to stand out with its integrity, wisdom, and uncanny knowledge of the one and only truth? Yet the Society regularly gets its facts wrong about all sorts of things. Things that anyone with a library card or a computer could find out in a matter of minutes.

It just seems kinda sad. This doesn't even make sense if you take their claims at face value. Yet it seems quite simple.

IsaacJ

9

Could the FS be the vehicle that creates cognitive dissonance, and.......

by AK - Jeff in

propels it into acceptance of the odd and somewhat unconvincing arguments and doctrines of jehovah's witnesses?.

in the classic paper by festinger and carlsmith on cd, published in 1959, it states;.

let us consider a person who privately holds opinion "x" but has, as a result of pressure brought to bear on him publicly stated that he believes "not x.".

IsaacJS2

I think that FS is a big part of the equation. The world view that the Society is putting out there is actually pretty fragile, so it needs constant maintenance. The meetings are a big part of it. I was always told how vital it is to have regular attendance back in the 90s. That's mostly about positive feedback and reinforcement. The repetition, making you parrot the Society's answers to questions, shaking hands with other drones...

Field servie is a good way to "firm up" those WT views with mostly negative feedback. Most people you meet at the door get mad or aren't interested. (Though it's getting harder to meet anyone at all) After the conditioning at the meetings, you view this with sadness and pity. You shake your head at them, knowing you did all you could to get the message across. If only they would listen. Shame really. Then you move on, glad you aren't like them: glad, in effect, that you are one of JWs and not some worldly person.

In fact, you're actually standing up for what you believe just by going out there because everyone knows who you are. You can't hide when you're going door to door, walking the streets and knocking on doors with a bag of magazines in your hands. Even people staring at you from their cars makes you withdraw from those nasty, dirty old worldly people and huddle in more tightly with other good and wholesome WT slaves. Man, it sure feels good being right and doing what's right. Holidays have a similar effect for converts like me. Refusing to celebrate them forces you to out yourself to your family and take a stand with the Society. It distances you from every non-Witness in your family, separating you from them and reality.

It's all just part of the system they've put into motion to get you and keep you.

IsaacJ

19

The ability to let go... Do Jws/ex-JWs have a problem with this?

by restrangled in

jw
friends

this is in no way meant to be an accusation.

it's just a question.

it could also be just human nature in general, or a personality type that was attracted to this religion in the first place.. it seems that several problems on this board just won't die a peaceful death.

IsaacJS2

I think everyone will agree that not all of us have a problem in the area of letting go and not obsessing. But I do think JWs - and by extension, ex-JWs - have a greater tendency to have issues with these things. We were taught to constantly focus on our flaws and to work on them by the WT elite. Or else. Just think back to the literature and you'll see what I mean.

"Are you doing this to make Jehovah happy? I asked you a question, maggot. SO ARE YOU??? Well why not?! ::Sigh:: Why do you suck so much? Maybe you should try not sucking as a human being. Then maybe Jehovah won't cry himself to sleep every night watching over your ungrateful a**! I so can't wait for Armageddon so I won't have to look at you any more. You disgust me. Hey, don't look at me like that! ..."

"Well then, you aren't doing that are you? What the--!!! Do you want to live or do you want Jesus to shoot you in the face at Armageddon, man?!? What is your deal?! Are you, like, weird or something? Do you have a deathwish?? Don't you realize you're playing with fire here! This is Jesus, man! JESUS! He knows everything, man. Everything! He knows if you've been good or bad! Just like Santa Clause! I don't want to be near you when Jesus points that revolver. No sir. Get away from me! I SAID GET AWAY! AHHHHHHHHHHHH!"

We're also warned to look out for flaws in others. Hey, they could be evil. Ya never know. The magazines say it's contagious. The evil I mean. Better to be safe than sorry. Evil can be harder to wash out than protein and ya know it's out to get ya. Hey! There's some evil over there! AHHHH! It touched my leg! It touched my leg! It buuuuuuurrrrns!

Does this sound healthy to you?

IsaacJ

8

Someone help me understand!!

by sammielee24 in

jw
friends

i always thought that the whole legal reason for putting up no trespassing signs, no soliticians, no religious persons, signs, was that it was my absolute right to privacy?.

i just had someone argue with me that there is no point to putting up these signs because i have no legal rights should any religious person choose to knock at my door.

that means that i have no rights or that my rights are always waved in the rights of any religious person - be they baptist, mormon, scientologist or mormons?

IsaacJS2

For years, "No Trespassing" signs were ruled not to apply to JWs and other door to door preacher types where I live. This was changed in one local town, though. I remember being told it's up to us whether we go to these places any way and risk getting arrested or kicked out by the cops. I have no idea if that law was upheld or not though. I have my doubts, but there's always hope. Several town in the area have tried to outlaw JWs preaching door to door from time to time, but I think this was the only one that went the "No Trespassing" sign route.

IsaacJ

16

how will I know you in paradise?

by tula in

so we have been led to believe that we will all look the same as we do now...except we will have no flaws and a perfected body without deformity or ailment.

hmmm..... how do we know this to be true?

is there any scriptural reference to this aspect of "resurrection"?

IsaacJS2

do you still believe this concept?

Not even a little.

IsaacJ