Posts by StephaneLaliberte

44

Money! How much did you "Contribute" To The WTB@TS When You Were A Member

by The Bethelite in

jw
friends

i was in full time service for six years including bethel.

once i got out of bethel, i figured i had already given them six of the best years of my life (ages 18-24) working as a slave/drone in their factory, so i rationalized that i had given them enough... so over the next 27 years i would say maybe $200 bucks is it.

i think their whole "voluntary contributions" idea is biting them in the ass, because over all jehovah's witnesses are a cheap group people with a few exceptions.

StephaneLaliberte

I started giving financially when I started working. Hence, within 17 years span:

~ 4,080$ to the congregations I attended.

~ 600$ to the World Wide Work

~ 1,000$ for the conventions.

If I try to ball park my volonteer time since baptized at age 13 (span of 22 years):

~ 4,000 hours of field service

~ 400 hours of vonlonteer work (Security, maintenance work, construction work)

~ 1,300 hours congregation activities (managing territories, magazines, small app to manage time, etc) *outside meeting hours.

~ 5,000 hours in meeting attendance

16

Who else provides all this spiritual food?

by StephaneLaliberte in

two days ago, i experienced a spiritual epiphany while visiting the library of a catholic university: i was shocked to find thousands of religious literatures produced by the catholics and protestants in the last few hundred years.

someone could easily spend a secluded lifetime trying to read them all.

for years, i was told by my religious leaders (jws) that the catholics and other religions did not provide spiritual food to their members.

StephaneLaliberte

Alex Williams: The scriptures are clear the preachers provide food but its JUNK food from teaching of Demons:

The argument to which I was referring to was the QUANTITY of the food, not the quality.

Much of your response focuses on the quality of the food and the history of the church. While this would be enough for another thread of its own, I wanted to focus on the fact that I was told that the people did not have access to any spiritual food, which, clearly, is not the case today.

You may also ponder on the fact that while JWs consider the teachings of other religions as “junk” and “teachings of demons”, this is also how other religions feel concerning the teachings of JWs; especially when it comes to the practice of shunning and refusal of life saving blood transfusions.

16

Who else provides all this spiritual food?

by StephaneLaliberte in

two days ago, i experienced a spiritual epiphany while visiting the library of a catholic university: i was shocked to find thousands of religious literatures produced by the catholics and protestants in the last few hundred years.

someone could easily spend a secluded lifetime trying to read them all.

for years, i was told by my religious leaders (jws) that the catholics and other religions did not provide spiritual food to their members.

StephaneLaliberte

Two days ago, I experienced a spiritual epiphany while visiting the library of a catholic university: I was shocked to find thousands of religious literatures produced by the Catholics and Protestants in the last few hundred years. Someone could easily spend a secluded lifetime trying to read them all.

For years, I was told by my religious leaders (JWs) that the Catholics and other religions did not provide spiritual food to their members. In contrast, the JWs had produced thousands of articles and about a hundred books! The size of the JWs library available to the public has always been an argument used by the JWs as proving that they were chosen by God to feed the Christian community.

Well, now I realized that this argument is false. The Catholics easily out do the JWs library by thousands of books!! And yes, such libraries are open to the public! And while this might not have always been the case, it is safe to assume such information was available by the time the JWs started their own activity.

It is certainly a strange feeling realizing that I grew up in a religion that hid this from me. Had I known this type of thing existed where Christianity is studied through so many different angles, I could have gone into religious studies. I even remember this being the first option presented by my guidance counsellor when I was a kid. Obviously, as a JW, this was not an option. And now, or should I say, two days ago, I finally fully understand what I have missed; I’m 40. What a waist.

9

14 kids from the same old congregation

by StephaneLaliberte in

this week, while talking with some old friends, i realized that there were at least 14 kids from a congregation in which i grew up that all left the jws.

that is, 30 to 35 years ago, there were at least 14 kids going to the hall that were of the same “generation” (5 to 13 years old).

in the last 30 years, they have all left “the truth”.

StephaneLaliberte

DesireousOfChange: I'm curious if there are any of the kids that you think might have been better off in life if they'd had stayed with The Troof?

Great question. You are correct in stating that many who leave tend to go to a debauched life and some never make it. In those I have mentioned, many experienced severe depressions and some fell into dependency for drugs/alcohol for several years. In fact, one of the 14 even died in a car accident due to reckless driving. Despite this, most of them now lead normal lives; even if this meant several years, if not, decades for many! And yet, some are still struggling with their spiritual identity to this day.

This often brings the comment from JWs: “All this is because they left the truth!” “See what happens when you leave Jehovah!” What they fail to understand is that for many, if not, all of those who struggled in their lives, the primal cause was, in fact, being raised in the truth in the first place.

Those who leaves the JWs will come from severely broken families. They will generally loose all proper contact with their family and friends. This, in and of itself, is already very difficult, and yet, there is more! They will also experience a sense of absolute loss, not knowing who to trust anymore.

Throughout their childhood and young adult lives, they were told time and again not to trust anyone but their religion. This trust is severely broken the day they find out that they were in fact lied to. That the history of their religion has been whitewashed, that they are in fact permissive towards pedophiles, that historical facts supporting their prophesies have been deliberately selected/manipulated to fit their narratives, that biblical passages have been taken out of context to support their believes, etc.

Deserters have to re-evaluate their view of the world and everything that surrounds them. As they struggle to build all this, severely isolated through the practice of shunning, those who cause the most harm than blame these victims: “It wouldn’t be so had they remained faithful to God (aka: Watchtower).”

9

14 kids from the same old congregation

by StephaneLaliberte in

this week, while talking with some old friends, i realized that there were at least 14 kids from a congregation in which i grew up that all left the jws.

that is, 30 to 35 years ago, there were at least 14 kids going to the hall that were of the same “generation” (5 to 13 years old).

in the last 30 years, they have all left “the truth”.

StephaneLaliberte

This week, while talking with some old friends, I realized that there were at least 14 kids from a congregation in which I grew up that all left the JWs. That is, 30 to 35 years ago, there were at least 14 kids going to the hall that were of the same “generation” (5 to 13 years old). In the last 30 years, they have all left “the truth”.

Many of us have suffered greatly: some were beaten, many have lost contact with their parents, some have suffered depression and I know of at least one who was molested by a known pedophile. And yet, ultimately, all of them have left and made new lives for themselves.

While we can be sorry for the pain we experienced and the impact this religion still has over our lives, we can rejoice in the fact that we have survived and are doing fairly well with our lives. We have since become Mail man, Inspectors, Doctors, Engineers, Account Managers, Investment counsellors, etc. And as we encounter various degree of success in our lives, we can’t help but observe how those who have stayed inside are still suffering greatly from such a choice. Some have died refusing blood transfusion, some have remained in the cleaning business with little aside, others have denied higher education to their own kids, etc.

Can you imagine? Looking at a congregation today and tell them that most of their kids will not stay in? That the majority of the parents in that hall raising their children will ultimately be told to shun them? How can they claim to be a “happy people” with good “fruits”?

40

How did Adam and Eve survive when kicked out of the Garden of Eden?

by I believe in overlapping in

it’s funny how a simple question like this is something that the dubs never even consider.

my dad asked this question to a couple of witnesses and they wondered for a minute and said; .

“i never thought about it, i’ll have to ask the elders”.

StephaneLaliberte

Alex, we exist because of air. Air does not exists because of us.

26

The Utterly most appalling terrible JW music video you will ever see

by Diogenesister in

........so far to date.

you've been warned....https://youtu.be/jjjnt5l5ts0.

StephaneLaliberte

Magnum: I agree with you that most JWs are in fact self-righteous and condescending with people who do not share their views. However, I can assure you that a great deal of them actually LOVE doing construction work, I know as I was one of them. Where you see hard labor, I used to see an oportunity to learn construction, hang out with my friends, have beautifull sisters serve me refreshments: heck, I felt like joshua in the 10 commandments! To top it all, I had a sense of pride as if I was a stone cutter for the temple of solomon himself, I know, it sounds crazy, but its true.

My point is that even if that wasn't your experience and isn't the experience of many half-awaken JWs, its is an absolute delight for many more.

Where I have deep sympathy for some brothers/sisters, is that they invest a LARGE amount of time/life into construction projects and don't realize that they are taken advantage of. But for the majority of JWs, its a few weekends of fun and lots of pictures and videos to brag about later.

26

The Utterly most appalling terrible JW music video you will ever see

by Diogenesister in

........so far to date.

you've been warned....https://youtu.be/jjjnt5l5ts0.

StephaneLaliberte

You know, the main purpose of my presence online is to do my part in exposing the bad things JWs do. As there are plenty of such bad things, I sincerely don't see the point in criticizing them when they do things that makes them happy like that.

In all fairness, some of the best times I had in my youth was on construction projects and I would have delighted in participating in such a video modifying the lyrics of an awesome song. So why not let them be happy for that moment? Yes, later on, they will face moments where there religion will cause them severe hardship, but for now, that project made them happy. Let them have that moment, for a moment it is.

39

Why Did You Stay In The JW Religion As Long As You Did?

by minimus in

jw
friends

were you so indoctrinated that you just couldn’t leave?

was it due to family pressure?

was it your friendships that you didn’t want to lose?

StephaneLaliberte

I was on this site for about 8 years before I called it quit. The main reason I was staying a JW was the thought the JWs were the closest to displaying the fruits of the true religion. At the time, I believed these fruits to be: The belief of a paradise earth, using God’s name, preaching work and low tolerance for perpetual sinners.

What made me change my mind was the realization that a just God would judge the actions rather than the belief. The belief is meant to help you do good actions by which you are judged. However, JWs focus so much on the teachings (Personal study, meetings, preaching and congregation responsibilities) that in the end, they lose focus on the actions themselves. This explains their lack (or absence) of charity, their endless procedural and organizational rules, and their tendency to leave so little to personal conscience. While they certainly give great consideration talking about how someone can be better, the rewards are based on meeting attendance, field service reports and responsibilities held. The end result is that the organization is prioritized at every turn causing absurdities such as the practice of shunning; unnatural loathing towards all non-jws and elders who do not report positively identified pedophiles.

In the end, a Christian is to be measure by the love he shows in his everyday life, not just what he preaches about.

5

I've Abandoned an Old Friend

by StephaneLaliberte in

raised as a jw, i was thought from early age that god was my friend.

and so, i was told to talk to him several times a day through prayer and share with him my broad range of emotions as i went through life; and so i did.

even when i left the jws, i asked for his support through countless prayers.

StephaneLaliberte

Raised as a JW, I was thought from early age that God was my friend. And so, I was told to talk to him several times a day through prayer and share with him my broad range of emotions as I went through life; and so I did. Even when I left the JWs, I asked for his support through countless prayers. I shared everything with him. Everything!

Then, as I searched further, I started to question that relationship, realizing that for a relationship to work, both must contribute to it. I never had a revelation, vision or heard any voice from the sky. I was basically talking to myself! And so, I started to understand that things I considered answers from God were in fact simply good opportunities. Besides, why would God answer any of my prayers and ignore those of millions who perpetually suffer injustice on this planet. Thus, I stopped believing in a “personal” friend and stopped praying.

As time passed, I went on to realize that there were in fact no evidence for his presence, only speculations, suppositions from people unsatisfied with their existence. And finally, a few years ago, I came to understand that God most likely never existed, it was an imaginary friend.

Yet, this morning, before going to work, I decided to take a small walk in the forest and listen to some music on my Bluetooth speaker. All is fine until Elvis starts signing “Glory Glory Hallelujah”. All of a sudden, and for a brief moment, I am overwhelmed by this feeling: “I have abandoned a friend”.

The religious person in me would see this as a sign that God does indeed exist and he is calling me out, “Come back to me my son!” - I could hear him say while looking towards the son. However, the logical person in me brought me back to my senses: “This is not God you are staring at, this is the son. And you, poor fool, have been indoctrinated since you were a toddler!” It’s a weird feeling encountering this type of feeling, the remnant of irrational teachings that was programmed in my head by my parents and a community that didn’t know any better.

Still feels strange though. Just thought I’d share.