Posts by StephaneLaliberte

12

Dutch JW publish open letter protesting accusations of mishandling child abuse and government inquiry

by Anders Andersen in

today watchtower netherlands published an open letter in a national newspaper, lamenting the accusations about them not handling child abuse issues very well.. they protest a scientific report made by utrecht university (by request of the government).. they protest almost everything our minister of justice has said about them.. they place themselves in the role of victims of unfair treatment, discrimination.. they point their finger a other religions (foremost the catholic church) because they are much worse.. they refer to jw being persecuted in wwii, as if that were relevant to the issue at hand.. all in all, they (probably) spent about 25k to 30k euro to publish their bullshit in a national newspaper.. not a single trace of any self-awareness, let alone even a hint of an apology.

quite the contrary.. they suck.. the minister of justice tweeted "this is exactly the problem: they spend money on lawsuits and expensive ads instead of improving help for victims #fail".. see the translation of the jw letter here: https://www.reddit.com/r/exjw/comments/ilair1/open_dutch_letter_a_little_better_english.

StephaneLaliberte

The first time Elders received instructions that JW victims were allowed to report abuse was in the early 2000. The first time I remember seeing this being written down in a watchtower is 2019. Yet, they say they wrote on the topic for over 35 years! Reality is that their public position has been much better in the last year, but they make it sound like it had been this way for decades! Not acknowledging all the wrong they did before that!

They say that they report to the police even if they don't have to and yet, there is no such instructions anywhere in their publications or elders procedural book. In fact, elders must call their headquarters FIRST to know if they should do it or not.

They make it sound like JWs are allowed to have non-jw friends while publications, videos, talks and dramas make it clear that this goes against their faith.

They say that they use the internet, but this again is highly controlled by the group. For instance, having a bookmark to an apostate site would automatically result in a serious talk with the elders.

They talk about how they were victims of the Nazis... everyone was! EVERYONE! Especially the Jews! Why bring this up here if it’s not to obtain unwarranted sympathy or trying to make a link between the present government and the Nazi party?

They view pastoral support as a priority. That's the issue right there! If you're victim of a crime, should your first instinct be to call the police or the elders?

In their publications, they have spent quite some time talking about prevention, but have very little details about how to handle it once it has happened. For instance, there is no publication that explains:

Their position on forensic science and it they accept it in their religious process.
Can a rapist be forgiven? Is it automatic excommunication?
When a rapist is re-instated, can he go back to the same congregation as his victim(s)
What is the minimal time for a rapist to be re-instated?
If they excommunicate someone for rape, why would they not report to the police? They do not protect the wider community.
How many times have the WT or its representatives reported to the police? In which circumstances?

Their letter make it sound like they covered all the angles about this problematic while they clearly have not.

30

Did you feel contempt for Non Witnesses

by Steel in

the other day i went to this farm owned by this jw lady with my wife being a jw and my mother being a non witness.

later taking to my mother she noticed this vibe like this jw lady really hated her.

she just had these little slags like when we tried to pay for the fruit we picked , she looked directly at my wife and said " don't worry about it, i only charge wordly people ".. i also have this aunt who is a jw we are estranged from.

StephaneLaliberte

Yes I did. This was one of the most liberating things I experienced when I stopped being a JW. I realized that I was judging people on their beliefs rather than their actions.

For instance, I used to judge my catholic grandmother who believed in the trinity. I felt that she didn't try to know God enough and worried she'd be destroyed. When I left, I realized that it God would have to be downright evil to destroy her simply for getting his name wrong.

Same thing with the holidays. What’s actually wrong with the holidays? Do they result in violence, abuse, and other crimes? Of course not!

This allowed me to open up to a whole lot more people around me and realize that there are a whole lot more good decent people out there. Even more shocking, my judgmental attitude as a JWs actually made me a bad person myself!

41

Noah's Ark : A structure that could never have been built in Noah's day

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

the ark encounter located in kentucky (opened in 2016) is a large representation of noah's ark based on the genesis flood narrative contained in the bible.

it is 510 feet (155 m) long, 85 feet (26 m) wide, and 51 feet (16 m) high.. .

genesis 6: 14 so make yourself an ark of cypress[c] wood; make rooms in it and coat it with pitch inside and out.

StephaneLaliberte

Reasoning I've heard by some believing folks:

If Jehovah could part the red sea in two, he could take care of all the engeneering issues that comes with building a ship this size.

In short: MIracle! Jehovah kept the boat afloat and the animals alive.

8

Yes, As a Matter of Fact I Did Destroy Your Family

by Sea Breeze in

.

and..... there is not a damn thing you can do about it because freedom of religion is guaranteed in the constitution.

suck it up buttercup.. - would make a nice billboard.

StephaneLaliberte

While I don't hold them accountable for all of the harm my family suffered, I can say that they certainly contributed a great deal to it. As I still have a fair relationship with some of my JWs relatives, I have held back a great deal on my activism against them. I just hope that I'll live long enough to take actions once these relatives pass away.

I know, this is not a heroic stand, however, my relationship with my relatives is still more important than speeking up for the moment.

29

Tonight's Meeting

by Studyover in

during tonight's meeting the brother seemed to read out something along the lines of "you may be helping a poor sister who you think may be struggling, but in turn that sister may be getting financial assistance from the government.

it is always best to stick to jehovah's arrangement in these matters so that help can get to those who most need it, including the worldwide work".

i think it may have been an article about social media platforms initially and how they should be avoided and then this was mentioned.

StephaneLaliberte

But what about those examples in the watchtowers and convention where someone got help from fellow brothers and sisters and they saw it as an example of Jehovah's hands?

Another example of double speech!

14

So according to wt. Doctrine, If you die one day before Armageddon...

by nowwhat? in

you will be resurrected.

but if you live one more day when armageddon starts you will die a horrible death with no chance of a resurrection.

makes sense to me!.

StephaneLaliberte

That never made sense to me when I was in. Never believed it. I was thinking that God would be just somehow and never put too much thoughts into it. But if you stop and think... it doesn't make any sense, at all.

21

No, They Will Never Notice!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

since the watchtower has already made this bible public, i can put a link out here.. no, the rank & file will never notice the words "governing body" have been inserted into acts 15: 1-35 in the 2019 new world translation, matthew to acts.. click the image to make it larger if need be.. https://postimg.cc/sqvdl10w petra!

StephaneLaliberte

JW reasoning:

The apostles = Governing Body

The elders = Governing Body helpers

The whole congregation = represented by the apostles and the elders.

21

Australian Royal Commission’s “BCG” is told “Screw You” from an exJW

by Las Malvinas son Argentinas in

jw
friends

csa victims need our support, not vindictiveness.

in that vein, lord farquaad has these kind words for shelly, aka “bcg”.

false dilemma logical fallacy.

StephaneLaliberte

To be honnest, I'm a bit surprised that Loyd fell for this one. He should have entirely ignored that thread until his name came up. Sure, she likely talking about him and I can understand he toke it personally. But her statement implying that other xJWs take advantage of sexual victims is baseless and merites no attention. Unfortunately, by replying to that comment, he landed her some vague credibility that ultimately brought the thread on this discussion board.

I'm disappointed that such thread exists. .

14

How about this from a recent wt.

by New day in

https://www.jw.org/finder?srcid=jwlshare&wtlocale=e&prefer=lang&docid=2020600.

StephaneLaliberte

It always amazes me how JWs will say that it was not a prophecy. A prophecy is a prediction, a claim about something that will happen in the future. "Millions now living will never die". How is that not a prediction, a prophecy?

Ridiculous.

22

Did You Have Good Relationships With The Elders?

by minimus in

jw
friends

my experience was that most jws wanted to have an elder “friend” just in case they got into any “trouble “.kinda like knowing that certain cop who might get you out of a jam.

.

of course there was another group who did everything they could to either kiss the elders’ ass or stonewall them anytime they came snooping around.. how did you and the “older men” get along?.

StephaneLaliberte

There was a period in my life where I was young, with no car, and struggled for basic groceries. At that time, I expected them to be there for me. They weren't.

Eventually, as my situation got better, I got married, got a family of my own and thinking back on what happened, I realized that the issue at its base was not these man. It was the Watchtower. I’ve been in several congregations and the story was always the same: Elders had families, full time jobs and simply running the ~~business~~ congregation was the equivalent of a second job. Then, top this off with the problems of parishioners where a noticeable part of them suffer from depression and other mental illness.

The expectations of the Watchtower are too high, they are unattainable. In the end, the problem at its core is that elders should be able to make a living and focus on their role.