I remember a Witness company servant once told me to go on in school. Of course, I was in the second grade. The company man had a one pony rodeo painting business out of the back of a 1948 Chevy panel truck with a limp clutch pedal. He wasn't a failure, he just started on the bottom and liked it there.
garybuss
JoinedPosts by garybuss
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14
Prominet elder goes against the society's advice on education!!!
by Samuel Thorsen ini just wat to inform you that i have from absolutely trustworthy sources that rolf furuli (one of the absolutely best known and most recpected elders in norway, and altso a scolar known as a hard core 607-apologist among opposers) did have a local needs speech last week (or maybe the week before) where he went directly against the watchtower anti college education pollicy and warmly recomended all the young ones in the congregation to go on and get them self educated.. i wonder for how long ha can keep his position??
if he gets the boot wee'll se a theocratic earthquake here in norway..
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garybuss
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29
What is wrong with the Memorial date this year?
by Cindi_67 inthe memorial is supposed to be held in nisan 14, jewish calendar.
that day is april 19, 2008. why is the memorial being held this coming saturday march, 22?
does anybody know?
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garybuss
The Society prints their own calendars, so they can pick any date they happen to like. Their excuse for missing it every year is listed on the WT CD, just search "memorial date".
The real reason the wrong date is used is:
1. Always treat the Governing Body as if they are never wrong:
2. The Governing Body wants this date for the memorial meeting;
3. If the Governing Body is ever wrong, see rule #1.The Watchtower 1977 June 15 pp. 383-384 Questions From Readers
I understood that the Memorial celebration was always on the evening of a full moon. But in 1977 the Memorial was on April 3, and my calendar gave April 4 for the full moon. Why the difference?
Often the celebration of the Lord's Evening Meal and the full moon do coincide, but not always. There may, for example, be a day's difference, depending on where you live and the calendar used.
To see why this is so you need to understand the basic method presently used by the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses in establishing the date for the annual Memorial celebration.
It was on the 14th of the Jewish month Nisan, the date of the Passover, that Jesus directed his followers to commemorate his death. (Luke 22:14-20) Appropriately, the date for the Memorial celebration is arrived at as the Jews back then determined the date for the Passover. They began the month of Nisan when they could first see the new moon in the spring nearest the equinox. Passover came fourteen days later.?Isa. 66:23; Ex. 12:2, 6.
Jehovah's Witnesses now follow this ancient pattern in determining the Memorial date. Please note that the first thing that needs to be established is when the new moon nearest the spring equinox (about March 21) will be visible in Jerusalem. This is not the astronomical new-moon time listed on a calendar or astronomical table. Why? Because the first thin sliver of the new moon is not visible until eighteen to thirty hours after the moment of astronomical new moon.
Let us take 1977 as an example. In determining the matter months beforehand so as to inform the congregations earth wide, the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses had to calculate when the new moon would become visible in Jerusalem. From the astronomical standpoint the instant of new moon was at 20:33 (8:33 p.m.) Jerusalem clock time on March 19, 1977. Of course, that new moon was not then visible nor would it be for many hours. But could the first sliver of the new moon be seen the next evening about sunset? Because of various involved factors it seemed unlikely that the moon could be sighted in the rather bright sky west of Jerusalem about sunset on March 20, 1977. Consequently, the Governing Body settled on March 21, 1977, as the time when, with assurance, the new moon would be in position to be seen from Jerusalem about sunset. Nisan 14 would thus commence at sunset on April 3. That is when Jehovah's Witnesses held the Lord's Evening Meal. What about the full moon that month? When was it?
Astronomical tables list the full moon as occurring on April 4 at 04:09 (4:09 a.m.), Greenwich (England) Mean Time. But at that same moment if you live in another time zone obviously your clock would show a different time. For instance, Stockholm (Sweden) and Rome (Italy) are in the next time zone to the east of Greenwich. Hence, for them the moment of full moon occurred on April 4 at 05:09 (5:09 a.m.). New York (U.S.A.) and Lima (Peru), though, are five time zones to the west of Greenwich, so for them the full moon was at 23:09 (11:09 p.m.) on April 3, 1977. Because of this variation according to time zones some 1977 local calendars indicated that the full moon occurred on April 4 and others said April 3.
In any case, the basic point to appreciate is that the date for the celebration of the Lord's Evening Meal is determined by the new moon (visible in Jerusalem), not the full moon. Nonetheless, the Memorial falls fourteen days after the appearance of the new moon. Thus it always occurs about the time of the full moon. It is good to know this in case some of Jehovah's Witnesses are cut off from contact with the Governing Body and do not know what date for Memorial has been determined. In that situation, if they observed the Memorial on the evening of the calendar date for the full moon after the spring equinox, they would likely be celebrating it on the same date as the rest of their brothers or at least very close to it. [end quote] -
41
Do You Ever Fear The Jehovah's Witnesses???
by minimus inare you completely devoid of fear regarding jws in your life at this point?
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garybuss
You wrote: "Are you completely devoid of fear regarding JWs in your life at this point?"
What's there to fear? That might be a "yes".
What're they gonna do? Hit me with a magazine? Ha!
I'd say some elders I know are afraid of me. I had one RUN away from me at the mall. That was funny. I had another one spin his tires getting away from me. All I did was show him the Aid book. Maybe the hard binding scared him. -
66
What do you do when you exit and your wife stays in?
by Quirky1 ini have recently left the wts and almost have my da letter ready to send.
my wife is still in and is higly upset by my stand.
she is afraid she'll lose her parents because they are still jw's and refuses to leave the wts, she still beleives it.
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garybuss
I never yet saw a bad deal I wanted to stick with. One ship that won't float is a partnership. Partnerships survive, not because of their agreements, but in spite of their differences. I kind of like to test things. There's nothing like a little religious strife to test a marriage. If it falls apart like a two dollar suitcase in the rain, good riddance.
I'm not gonna stay in a bad deal so I can stay in a bad deal. If I've got a good partner, something like me quitting an incredible group like the Witnesses won't put it in the dumpster. If I've got a bad partner, I don't want to invest any time or resources in a dead horse.
I'm not gonna be married to anybody who disrespects me . . . period! Life's too short. -
25
Bob Marley & the Wailers - Your Favorite Songs and Albums from Him ?
by flipper inah yes, music fans , the " king of reggae " as he was so aptly called.
my wife and i really like him a lot.
so what are your favorite songs from him ?
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garybuss
Stir it up
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14
Undefendable WT Lies
by still_in74 in.... i find we often go into long-winded discussions that go several wt's deep and span numerous decades.
if a jw even bothers to listen they will quickly excuse it away.. what i like are those quick and easy undefendable and undeniable times when the wt knowingly lies and/or rewrites history.. heres an example i recently discovered from you tube.. *** g90 4/22 p. 6 how long can we live?
how long can we live?.
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garybuss
Yes, the talk had two titles. One was MAY never die, the other was WILL never die. The quote is technically true. The talk titled MAY later was published and became the "subsequent book" (titled WILL")
It's easy to check. Good topic, Thanks! -
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May 15th 2008 Study edition of The Watchtower as PDF file
by fokyc inmay 15th 2008 study edition of the watchtower can be downloaded here as a pdf file, it is ocrd and bookmarked:.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/w3184k.
there are 5 study articles:.
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garybuss
Thanks! I'm glad to have copies of the public edition as well. Good job!
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2007 Memorial Outline?
by V inanyone have access to this?
i need it for watchtower comments.
wouldn't it be nice to scoop the talk?.
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garybuss
Proclaimers chap. 10 p. 137
Growing in Accurate Knowledge of the Truth
As the events following 1914 began to unfold and the Bible Students compared these with what the Master had foretold, they gradually came to appreciate that they were living in the last days of the old system and that they had been since 1914. They also came to understand that it was in the year 1914 that Christ's invisible presence had begun and that this was, not by his personally returning (even invisibly) to the vicinity of the earth, but by his directing his attention toward the earth as ruling King.
[Brackets are in original paper text] -
31
Has the Org gone witch-hunting those who are gone, but not Dfd?
by cyber-sista inhey it's been awhile since i've left--almost 5 years now!
i haven't visited this site for quite a while now.
i was never dfd, but i have little contact with anything to do with jws.
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garybuss
I cherish my Witness stories. I loved it when the Witness servants (now called elders) would sit and watch my 1959 Cadillac while I slept. I walked to work, and later I found out they watched my car all night while I was at work too. The Witnesses were very effective. I never had any hub caps stolen while they were on duty.
The neighbors should have thanked me. The Witnesses weren't out bothering people peddling religious fiction and soliciting donations while they sat and watched my parked car.
The last elder I saw in the mall actually RAN away from me. Bold and fearless, they are not. I should have chased the bastard but I was laughing too hard to run. -
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Need help please: re blood doctrine discussion with elder
by yesidid ini was saying to an elder that the gb now says it's ok to have hemogloblin.
he nearly flipped his lid.. now he wants proof from the societies publications.
he also said hemopure is only 2% hemogloblin.
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garybuss
*** km 11/06 pp. 3-6 How Do I View Blood Fractions and Medical Procedures Involving My Own Blood? ***
How Do I View Blood Fractions and Medical Procedures Involving My Own Blood?
The Bible commands Christians to "abstain from ... blood." (Acts 15:20) Thus, Jehovah?s Witnesses do not accept transfusions of whole blood or the four primary components of blood?namely, red blood cells, white blood cells, platelets, and plasma. They also do not donate or store their own blood for transfusion.?Lev. 17:13, 14; Acts 15:28,29.
What are blood fractions, and why is their use a matter for each Christian to decide?
Blood fractions are elements from blood that are extracted through a process called fractionation. For example, plasma, one of the four major components of blood, can be divided into the following substances: water, about 91percent; proteins, such as albumins, globulins, and fibrinogen, about 7percent; and other substances, such as nutrients, hormones, gases, vitamins, waste products, and electrolytes, about 1.5percent.
Are fractions also covered by the command to abstain from blood? We cannot say. The Bible does not give specific direction on the subject of fractions. Of course, many fractions are derived from blood that has been donated for medical purposes. Each Christian should make a conscientious decision as to whether he or she will accept or will reject the medical use of these substances.
When making such decisions, consider the following questions: Am I aware that refusing all blood fractions means that I will not accept some medications, such as certain ones that fight viruses and diseases or that help blood to clot in order to stop bleeding? Could I explain to a physician why I reject or accept the use of certain blood fractions?
Why are some procedures involving the medical use of my own blood a personal decision?
Although Christians do not donate or store their own blood for transfusion purposes, some procedures or tests involving an individual's blood are not so clearly in conflict with Bible principles. Therefore, each individual should make a conscientious decision as to whether to accept or to reject some types of medical procedures involving the use of his or her own blood.
When making such decisions, ask yourself the following questions: If some of my blood will be diverted outside my body and the flow might even be interrupted for a time, will my conscience allow me to view this blood as still part of me, thus not requiring that it be "poured out on the ground"? (Deut. 12:23,24) Would my Bible-trained conscience be troubled if during a medical procedure some of my own blood was withdrawn, modified, and directed back into my body? Am I aware that refusing all medical procedures involving the use of my own blood means that I refuse treatments such as dialysis or the use of a heart-lung machine? Have I prayerfully considered this matter before making a decision?
What are my personal decisions?
Consider the two work sheets on the following pages. Work Sheet 1 lists some of the fractions extracted from blood and how they are commonly used in medicine. Fill in your personal choice as to whether you will accept or will reject the use of each of these fractions. Work Sheet 2 lists some common medical procedures involving your own blood. Fill in your personal choice as to whether you will accept or will reject these procedures. These work sheets are not legal documents, but you may use your answers on these work sheets to help you to complete your DPA (durable power of attorney) card.
Your decisions should be your own and should not be based on someone else's conscience. Likewise, no one should criticize another Christian's decisions. In these matters, "each one will carry his own load of responsibility. " Gal. 6:4,5.
[Footnotes]
Helpful information on this subject is found in the June15, 2004, issue of The Watchtower, pages29-31.
Helpful information on this subject is found in the October15, 2000, issue of The Watchtower, pages30-1, and the Transfusion Alternatives?Documentary Series?On DVD.
[Chart on page5]
Work Sheet1
UNACCEPTABLE YOUR PERSONAL DECISION
TO CHRISTIANS
WHOLE Choices You
BLOOD FRACTIONS Need to Make
PLASMA ALBUMIN UP TO 4% OF PLASMA
A protein extracted from
plasma. Types of albumin
are found also in plants,
in foods such as milk and
eggs, and in the milk of
a nursing mother. Albumin
from blood is sometimes __I accept albumin
used in volume expanders or
to treat shock and severe __I refuse albumin
burns. These preparations
may contain up to
25percent albumin. Minute
amounts are used in the
formulation of many other
medicines, including some
formulations of
erythropoietin (EPO).
IMMUNOGLOBULINS
UP TO 3% OF PLASMA
Protein fractions that may
be used in some medicines
that fight viruses and
diseases, such as __I accept
diphtheria, tetanus, viral immunoglobulins
hepatitis, and rabies. or
They may also be used to __I refuse
guard against some medical immunoglobulins
conditions that threaten
the life of a developing
baby and to counteract
the effects of snake
or spider venom.
CLOTTING FACTORS
LESS THAN 1% OF PLASMA
There are various
proteins that help blood
to clot in order to stop __I accept
bleeding. Some are given blood-derived
to patients who tend to clotting factors
bleed easily. They are or
also used in medical __I refuse
glues to seal wounds blood-derived
and to stop bleeding clotting factors
after surgery. One
combination of clotting
factors is known as
cryoprecipitate.
Note: Some clotting
factors are now made
from nonblood sources.
RED CELLS HEMOGLOBIN 33% OF RED CELLS
A protein that transports
oxygen throughout the body
and carbon dioxide to the __I accept
lungs. Products being hemoglobin
developed from human or or
animal hemoglobin could be __I refuse
used to treat patients with hemoglobin
acute anemia or massive
blood loss.
HEMIN LESS THAN
2% OF RED CELLS
An enzyme inhibitor
derived from hemoglobin
that is used to treat a __I accept hemin
group of rare genetic or
blood disorders (known __I refuse hemin
as porphyria) that affect
the digestive, nervous,
and circulatory systems.
WHITE CELLS INTERFERONS A TINY
FRACTION OF WHITE CELLS
Proteins that fight
certain viral infections __I accept
and cancers. Most blood-derived
interferons are not interferons
derived from blood. or
Some are made from __I refuse
fractions of human blood-derived
white blood cells. interferons
PLATELETS At present, no fractions
from platelets are being
isolated for direct use
in medical treatment.
[Chart on page6]
WORK SHEET2
YOUR PERSONAL DECISION
PROCEDURES INVOLVING THE MEDICAL USE OF YOUR OWN BLOOD
*Note: The methods of applying each of these medical procedures vary from physician to physician. You should have your physician explain exactly what is involved in any proposed procedure to ensure that it is in harmony with Bible principles and with your own conscientious decisions.
NAME OF WHAT IT Choices You
TREATMENT ACCOMPLISHES Need to Make
(You might want to
speak to your
physician before
accepting or
refusing any of
these procedures.)
CELL SALVAGE Reduces blood loss.
Blood is recovered
during surgery from __I accept
a wound or body cavity. __I might accept*
It is washed or filtered __I refuse
and then, perhaps in a
continuous process,
returned to the patient.
HEMODILUTION Reduces blood loss.
During surgery, blood is
diverted to bags and
replaced with a nonblood
volume expander. Thus __I accept
the blood remaining in __I might accept*
the patient during surgery __I refuse
is diluted, containing
fewer red blood cells.
During or at the end of
surgery, the diverted
blood is returned to the
patient.
HEART-LUNG Maintains circulation.
MACHINE Blood is diverted to an
artificial heart-lung __I accept
machine where it is __I might accept*
oxygenated and directed __I refuse
back into the patient.
DIALYSIS Functions as an organ.
In hemodialysis, blood
circulates through a __I accept
machine that filters and __I might accept*
cleans it before returning __I refuse
it to the patient.
EPIDURAL BLOOD Stops spinal fluid leakage.
PATCH A small amount of the
patient's own blood is
injected into the __I accept
membrane surrounding the __I might accept*
spinal cord. It is used to __I refuse
seal a puncture site
that is leaking spinal
fluid.
PLASMAPHERESIS Treats illness.
Blood is withdrawn and
filtered to remove plasma.
A plasma substitute is
added, and the blood is
returned to the patient. __I accept
Some physicians may want __I might accept*
to use plasma from another __I refuse
person to replace that
from the patient's blood.
If so, this option would
be unacceptable to a
Christian.
LABELING OR Diagnoses or treats illness.
TAGGING Some blood is withdrawn,
mixed with medicine, and __I accept
returned to the patient. __I might accept*
The length of time one's __I refuse
blood is outside the body
may vary.
PLATELET GEL; Seals wounds, reduces
AUTOLOGOUS bleeding.
(MEANING "MADE Some blood is withdrawn
FROM YOUR OWN and concentrated into
BLOOD") a solution rich in
platelets and white cells. __I accept
This solution is applied on __I might accept*
surgical sites or wounds. __I refuse
Note: In some formulations,
a clotting factor taken
from cow's blood is used.