Posts by VoidEater

Yes, it is Millerite by way of Second Adventists. Even the splintering when Rutherford siezed power is similar to previous Millerite-descended groups splintering at the Great Disappointment (again, a prediction of Christ's coming that didn't happen - isn't the explanation of an "invisible" coming so much more convenient?), or when Smith won the greater number of Mormons.

The whole point of the Second Adventist movement was the prediciton of Christ's coming, and with this it's easy to explain the JW fixation of the end of this system of things. It's a great way to sweep in the disenfranchised or the hopeful (and the gullible, yes) with a promise of this evil system is being done away with by Christ. I've often been asked why the JWs seem to talk about the end of the world so much - well, it's kinda obvious, innit? It's their reason for existing and their mechanism of getting converts! What else do they have? OK, aside from "no Hell".

But wait...there IS Hell - the Hell of being shunned by family and friends if you so much as disagree with a group of old men on the East Coast who have appointed themselves as arbiters of God.

Sorry...off point...the scary thing is that they SHOULD be concerned about chronology, it really is the whole point of the faith - knowing when Christ is coming and the end of the world will occur. This ever changing date is the only little thing that's so worrisome (We can predict the future! Really! Um...maybe not exactly...but Real Soon!)

79

Spirituality

by Aleman in

why care about spiritual things?

i see most of all of you speak in different opinions of what is or may be true spiritual things (while a few ar just freezing cold or dead spiritualy), but i ask all of you, why even bother to care or pretend to care of spiritual things?.

-aleman.

VoidEater

Having an articulate spirituality (view of spirit, connection to spirit, relationship to the unseen, etc.) adds a dimension to the human experience for many people. It can also be a way to express certain core beliefs in a conventionalized framework. It also gives a greater context within which to understand a big part of human development of the millenia.

For me, it's a way to express experiential occurances, and acknowledge/relate to the rest of the universe (actual, metphorical) I find myself in.

22

Must JWs Confirm They're JWs?

by Simon G Best in

i was just wondering.

is there some sort of doctrine, or belief, principle, rule or whatever, that says that jehovah's witnesses, when asked, must confirm that they're jehovah's witnesses?

(one possible basis for such a rule, that comes to mind, is the bit about peter denying jesus three times before the cock crowed.).

VoidEater

There's nothing in the current dogma that would insist on their telling the truth - the "new light" on "theocratic warfare" gives the easy out, and the example of sanctioned bribery supports this new view. They would possibly be applauded for lying to you to see if they could trap an apostate.

Too bad this way of thinking didn't allow folks to avoid WWII concentraion camps or persecution in Malawi.

21

MY LETTER TO SOCIAL SECURITY

by badboy in

jw
friends

i have written to social security, telling them that i don't like their orm which threatens one with suspection of benefits if i fail to return the schedule forms on time.. i explained to them in my letter that instead of sending these forms,they should give me some help to achieve my goals,that would be more helpful.. .

VoidEater

There ar many things in life - and in particular bureaucracy - that are silly or onerous. Still, most adults participate to the best of their ability to achieve a desired end.

I appreciate that you can express frustration and anger here in this safe forum. i hope the venting can lead to a more relaxed place where you can effectively deal with the bureaucracy that you are seeking aid from.

29

Do Witnesses Care About Chronology Anymore?

by minimus in

jw
friends

let's say christ threw the devil out in 1914, so what?

does 1914 have any real signifance to a jehovah's witness anymore?

all i can see is that "this proves we're living in the last days of the last days".

VoidEater

VM44: I have seen your avatar, and bow in respect to your power and wisdom!

minimus: Over the past 40 years I have been party to "deep discussions" on chronology in three different states - my dad has always wanted to ... uh, well, let's say he's wanted to understand it all, though we could also say he's also wanted to prove he's smarter than them ... anyway, in EVERY CASE I have heard, the untlimate answer from various elders and overseers has been, "Well, I can't really follow it either, but I just take it on faith that it all makes sense". The answer from the more typical garden-variety JWs has been that they don't really even try to understand it, it's just not that important to them.

Ah, the denial of reason.

Personally, I always thought (even as a child) that if the organization is pinning it's entire authority and reason of existing on a chronology that both proves the end days are here and that they are God's Chosen, then the argument they present had better make pretty good sense - enough sense that anyone can follow it. After all, one of the big selling points of this religion is, "You don't have to take anything on 'faith' - we explain it all!".

So, No, from what I've seen most JWs simply ignore or gloss over the chronology. It's not important to them.

30

Most Witnesses Don't Know the "Current Truth" on Matthew 5:5!

by deaconbluez in

matthew 5:5: "happy are the mild-tempered ones, since they will inherit the earth.".

if you ask most witnesses what this verse means, they will say that it means those who are meek/mild/humble will be given the earth as a reward to live forever on.

i was surprised to find out that this is not the official watchtower teaching of that verse.

VoidEater

I really thought that the Other Sheep becoming non-sequitors (having no direct relationship with God, not inheriting the Earth) would finally send my dad over to the Land of the Sane...his ego would certainly not allow him to have to pray to God through the FDS! But, no...still sucking on the teat of spoiled milk...

It was when I heard the "new light" that the Other Sheep needed the papacy of the FDS for a relationship with God that some inner withholding deep inside me that I didn't even know was there finally splintered. All through the 60's and 70's it was "personal relationship with Jehovah"-this and "standing before Jehovah"-that. And then to find out they had tried to usurp that relationship by demanding that only they could come to God through Jesus?? That crucked me even within my own faulty subconscious belief system!

Hmm...am I sounding bitter?

I guess I could see myself passing until they finally came out and said the Other Sheep are nothing more than invited to support the "real" followers of Christ.

Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

18

Are you making progress?

by nvrgnbk in

jw
friends

we're all in different stages of exiting the jw organization.. how do you feel about where you are at today, compared with a year ago?

do you see positive growth in yourself?

or do you feel stagnant?.

VoidEater

nvrgnbk: I have enjoyed being here, have enjoyed the conversations (where I agree, where I differ), and your posts in particular.

Thank you very much -ve

18

Are you making progress?

by nvrgnbk in

jw
friends

we're all in different stages of exiting the jw organization.. how do you feel about where you are at today, compared with a year ago?

do you see positive growth in yourself?

or do you feel stagnant?.

VoidEater

I've got to admit it's getting better, it's getting better all the time...hey, I've heard that somewhere before...

I have no "religion" to call my own, and feel fine with that.

I believe in God, but due to experiential non-evidence not due to what anyone tells me.

Lost faith in the Bible as the one true inspired word of God, but think it has some wisdom.

The only healing left to do is that which time takes care of on its own...nothing more to do but notice the ripples as they break the surface on occasion, and notice I'm not in agony any more (get a sharp pain every once in a while when some memories might get triggered).

Being here helps.

When the anger comes, I write about it. Again, this board helps. I used to talk about it in therapy, and that helped, too. I meditate, walk, see that there's more in my life than my past...

58

Tell Us About Your JW Father If You Had One.

by new boy in

jw
friends

we are great friends now....but he wasn't much of a father growing up.. worked all the time...we went on few vacations....pretty much pussy whipped my my nazis jw mother.. he never did believe in the whole jw thing.

he just when along with it, for my mothers sake.. she never did respect him for not being a "spiritual head" and pretty much let us kids know about it.. i, like my mother became very self rightious and judgmental.. i wished now he had just came to me just once and said "keith maybe the jws are not the people you think they are.

" but he was to afraid of my mother to say that...even though he knew it to be true.i would have never believed him....back then....but it would have planted a seed.... .

VoidEater

"This was one of the best hreads ever... so sad, but would any of us rather be pushing doorbells Saturday? Nah, I loved my dad but damn, I won't lie for any man....I won't live my life as a lie"

Amen, Dawg, and I think a lot of us here love you...