Posts by Gordy

21

Israeli Propoganda

by Yerusalyim in

but that doesn't mean the propoganda isn't true.

here's some interesting facts.. .. israel is one of the tiniest nations on the face of the earth... only about.

8,000 sq.

I've often been puzzled that there is this little Jewish nation surrounded by millions of Arab Muslims. Some of the Arab nations make billions from oil. Why haven't they raised the best army money can buy in the way of the latest armament and just taken Israel out. Why haven't they formed a "coalition" to do so. Don't give me the usual line "Well its because of the Americans". The oil producing countries could just say to the USA "No more oil off us if you interfere". Why not? Do the oil producing countries need American dollars as much as America needs their oil.

Also when I seen the Palestinian towns they seem to run down and in bad condition. Why haven't the wealthy Arab nations helped build up these towns. They could have the best schools, hospitals, housing etc.That would shame Israel . But they seem content to supply money for arms and explosives instead.

Has Israel just become the excuse for all the ills of the Arab/Muslim world.

46

How far does the shunning go for you, by your JW parents or children?

by LyinEyes in

jw
friends

my dad is a jw, trying to reach out to be an elder again......also pioneering.

i saw my cousin , his nephew , the other nite at the dance club......i told him i havent seen my dad, nor heard from him in almost 2 years.

he said he saw him a while back but that he heard he moved.. last time i talked to my dad, it was over me not going to the circuit assembly he was trying to get me to go to.

Gordy

In April 1996 I suffered VERY bad depression, attempted suicide.

Was reproved and removed as a Ministerial Servant.

December 1996 wife tells me I must leave home, Elders consider me "spiritual danger" to family.

Move to other congregation in next town. Begin to doubt "Jehovahs loving organisation" as I got about as much love and help as Osama Bin Laden would from the Americans.

August 1999 stopped going to meetings, wife stops having any contact with me, two JW daughters still did.

September 2001 decided to disassociate from JW's. Two JW daughters stopped from having contact.

Have not spoken to, or seen Wife since 1999 or two daughters since end of 2001.

Two sons and another daughter disassociated and came to live with me.

7

CAN YOU HELP PLEASE!

by Gordy in

i have recently received this letter.. can anyone give any help or advice to this lady.. i have left off her address as i have not got permission to from her whether or not to pass it on.

she uses a "btopenworld" address so i presume she is in britain.. if any of you do have advice to give please write to me at: [email protected].

letter is a follows:.

Gordy

I have recently received this letter.

Can anyone give any help or advice to this lady.

I have left off her address as I have not got permission to from her whether or not to pass it on. She uses a "btopenworld" address so I presume she is in Britain.

If any of you do have advice to give please write to me at: [email protected]

Letter is a follows:

Please can you suggest any help regarding the following:

My daughter is at the commencement of an acrimonious divorce.

Since early March her husband has become a fanatical recruit of the Jehovah's Witness Movement....attending their bible studies, lessons, meetings etc., three times a week. He has also attended Assemblies. She is absolutely opposed the Witness Movement and its ideology.

His conversion, he claims, is to save their three year old daughter from Armageddon. He has categorically stated that he intends to teach (indoctrinate??) the little girl with the teachings of Jehovah and to take her to meetings and Assemblies.He began reading 'bible stories from a Witness 'child bible story' book.... when our daughter saw the book, she was horrified by the graphic illustrations of murder etc...and considered the book totally unsuitable material for a three year old. In his defence, he argued that the stories were no more graphic than tales of Red Riding Hood!

Our daughter does not want there little daughter indoctrinated in the Witness Movement...but doesn't know how to prevent it! Via her solicitor, she is seeking a prohibitive steps order to restrict the possibility of the husband taking the child to meetings etc.,....however, she is concerned...as he states he has already won the right to teach (indoctrinate) the child....through his 'Freedom of Speech'. He claims that several cases have already been fought and won by Witness parents wanting to subject their children to the teachings of Jehovah!

Our daughter has now left the marital home with the child and is currently living with us. (This has caused the husband to become extremely angry towards us.)

Please can you make any suggestions that may help in this situation.

Kind regards,

D H

11

Need help with Watchtower Quote

by Double Edge in

jw
friends

i've seen the quote numerous times here, but can't seem to currently find it using the 'search' feature.

it's the one the watchtower uses regarding examining your own religion for the 'truth'.

it's meant for other religions, but i want to turn it around and use it for examining the jws.

Gordy

It is not a form of religious persecution for anyone to say and to show that another religion is false. It is not religious persecution for an informed person to expose publicly a certain religion as being false, thus allowing persons to see the difference between false religion and true religion.

WT Nov 15 1963

12

Also for UK - did your congregation do anything with other congregations?

by truthseeker in

jw
friends

hi eveyone, did your congregation ever have organised gatherings with other congregations nearby?

my old congregation rarley mixed.

there was so little social life that we had no choice but to visit other congs.. another question - did you get any counsel if you constantly attended a kingdom hall other than the one you were assigned to?

Gordy

Hey Gadget

In my area there is a lot of mixing, but only if your part of the clique.

In the Liverpool/Manchester area there is always big parties. I've been in pubs with hundreds of people in them, and 75% of them have been witnesses. I keep on getting invites to go to them, because no-one down there knows I'm df'd. There's 2 coming up in the next month. I live on Merseyside and never heard of these parties. Do the elders know about them

In my congregation it was hard enough to get to associate with other brothers and sisters.

Never mind with other congregations.

The only time we saw "other" congregation was at assemblies and conventions.

27

New light?

by dmouse in

.

is this new light?

according to the new society book 'learn from the great teacher' it looks as if pocahontas will be resurrected!.

Gordy

Often wonder when a JW, if the "paradise" is the world restored to what it was before Adam sinned.

How come all these people in the WT pictures wore modern clothes, who made them.

Also remember seeing a picture in a publication, they had a tractor ploughing a field, was it left over from Armageddon. Where does the fuel come from, isn't that pollution?? Also on the table was a jug with water/juice in, but it had ice-cubes in it, so there will be fridges. Which means a power source etc.

The WT offers this new world to people only if they become JW's, everlasting life, no war, crime , illness etc. Did we become JW's because of a love for God or because we were being bribed by what was on offer?

Where we taken in by a form of spiritual materialism.

19

UK only - What assembly circuit were you in?

by truthseeker in

jw
friends

i think there are about 20 cong in each circuit (correct me if i'm wrong).

i was in the sussex circuit, can't remember which number though.

any of you remember which circuit you're cong was assigned to?.

Gordy

Cheshire 2

15

A Question for serious Bible Students...

by Jessica Rabbit in

jw
friends

why were some ancient writings not included in the bible as we know it?

for instance the book of enoch goes into detail of his experience of being taken to heaven and later coming back to earth to share his experience with his sons, and then later died a natural death.

i have read this book and it is full of details that no one back then could have described without our modern science and technology we have today.

Gordy

Critics of the Gospels sometimes declare that they believe that the time between the death of Jesus (appx. 33 A.D.) and the date of the actual writing of the Gospels (appx. between 60 A.D. - 90 A.D.) allowed time for exaggeration and elaboration to creep in. Critics will say it is something like Chinese whispers. One person says one which in turn is passed on to someone else. They in turn pass this on to another and more elaboration is added on, and so on and so fourth. The end result is that the original story has been greatly changed. Is there any weight to this argument? A look at some of the evidences in support of the reliability of the Gospel texts show that there are actually many very good reasons for believing them to be accurate representations of the life of Jesus just as it happened.

During the period when the Gospel writers wrote their accounts many eyewitnesses would still have been alive and would have objected if the Gospels were exaggerated in some way. This would be something like a group of people trying to fictionalise a whole series of events that happened during World War II. There are too many people still living who would be able to challenge inaccuracies.
Similarly, as with the second world war the events that occurred were striking and significant, making long lasting impressions upon the minds of the people who went through the experience. This is even more so with the Gospels. The things that Jesus said and did would have had powerful impact and long lasting impression upon the memories of those who witnessed the events. The culture of Jesus' day held to `oral tradition'. People spent much time and effort in memorizing texts. Michael Green observes that many Jews memorized the whole Pentateuch and that there were Greeks who could recite large portions of Homer's Iliad (The Truth of God Incarnate, p. 124).
As the Jews were expecting a political leader rather than a miracle worker, it would not have helped the disciples cause to present Jesus as a miracle worker.
Other non-Christian historical sources verify some of the people and events described in the Gospels. For example:
Thallus
Tacitus
Josephus
If the disciples fabricated the stories of Jesus then why did they include material that could have been potentially embarrassing to the Church? Surely, if these stories had been changed as time went on they would have omitted such sections in the Gospels. Examples of these are: Peter's denial of Christ, Jesus' apparent difficulty in healing a blind man, many disciples deserting Jesus because of His hard teachings, His family believing He was out of His mind, being unable to do miracles in His home town because of people's lack of faith in Him, etc. Even the crucifixion itself was a difficult thing for the Christians. It would have been easier for them to have left this out rather than keep it in the Gospels had they been fabricated. Crucifixion in the ancient world was for slaves and criminals. Consequently, the early Christians had difficulty in presenting this message to people who were familiar with it. It would have been far easier to have left all this out had they made the stories up.
If the disciples fabricated the stories of Jesus then why did they include material that was an issue to them? The early Church faced many difficulties regarding doctrine and Church order. Examples of these are: circumcision, speaking in tongues and spiritual gifts, divorcing when deserted by an unbelieving spouse, meat offered to idols, etc. If the early Church had fabricated the life of Jesus they would have had a golden opportunity to add their own solutions to these difficult problems, but, as the Gospels stand, there is no record of these issues being tackled.
Why should anyone assume that the Gospels are fabricated? We do not do this with other historical documents, so why the Gospels? Paul Copan points out in his book, "True for You But Not For Me", that we listen to what someone says as being factual and truthful and only have cause to doubt them if something arouses our suspicions. Historians approach ancient documents this way and take an `innocent until proven guilty' approach. Interestingly, it is most often the case that historians are more likely to accept the Gospels as basically true and reliable documents whereas liberal scholars, who are not experts as historians, are more likely to approach the Gospels with an already presupposed scepticism.
If the Gospels had been fabricated by Jesus' disciples why did they put such high demands on themselves by putting their own words and concepts into the mouth of Jesus? Surely, if the disciples themselves were responsible for putting their own words into Jesus' mouth they would have allowed themselves more freedom for their own ends.
Gospels based on earlier written accounts: "undertaken to set down an orderly account of the events that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed on to us by those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and servants of the word" (Lk.1:1-2).
The Gospels are all set in an historical, geographical, cultural, religious, and political context, and reflect this in their contents.

63

I am so hurt. JW friend has disowned me :-(

by Hamas in

jw
friends

i got to hear some real bad news

i was speaking to my 'best friends' sister only minutes ago.

my 'best friend' i used to do everything with.

Gordy

You are sad because your "friend" no longer speaks to you.

My wife and two of my daughters have not spoken or had any contact with me since I left 5 years ago.

How do you think I feel about the Watchtower!!!

203

Poll suggests world hostile to US

by Simon in

an interesting read:.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/2994924.stm.

some key bits:.

Gordy

In reply to the survey

"Many Brits in Misery"

Survey also shows the following if you look at the figures they other way.

9 out of 10 Don't think they would be better off dead.

75% find life fair

9 out of 10 are not miserable

3 out of 4 are happy

2 out of 3 are not exhuasted, are appreciated, and not underpaid.

75% are satisfied with their sex life

5 out of 6 are in happy relationships

90% of men are NOT emotionally, physically, verbally abused by partners.

94% of women are NOT emotionally, physically, verbally abused by partners.

It would seem that the vast majority of Britons are quite content with their life then.