Posts by gravedancer

i received a reply from michael a. cremo, author of forbidden archeology: the hidden history of the human race (see http://www.mcremo.com/index.htm ) regarding the topic genetic evidence for "macroevolution"?

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=21092&site=3.

gravedancer

Well as McGinnis explains:

"The creationists' argument rests in part on the fact that animals have two sets of chromosomes and that in order to get big changes, you'd need to mutate the same genes in both sets of chromosomes"

"It's incredibly unlikely that you would get mutations in the same gene in two chromosomes in a single organism. But in our particular case, the kind of mutation that's in this gene is a so-called dominant mutation, so you only need to mutate one of the chromosomes to get a big change in body plan."

"If you compare this gene to many other related genes, you can see that they share certain regions in their sequences, which suggests that their function might be regulated like this gene," says Ronshaugen.

"This may establish how, not only this gene, but relatives of this gene in many, many different organisms actually work. A lot of these genes are involved in the development of cancers and many different genetic abnormalities, such as syndactyly and polydactyly, and they may explain how some of these conditions came to be."

So I quoted the scientists involved in the study. Please do not argue with me over what they said ;-) (just joking)

Since much of the studies are occurring in the name of evolution are producing the latest genomic based medication perhaps the creationists might develop a conscience that prohibits them from taking the drugs. We were taught for years on thing such as XMAS to look a the origins and if the origins of things were "unscriptural" we should refrain. Asking for consistency is just too much??

6

Genetic evidence for "macroevolution"...

by ThiChi in

jw
friends

greetings list members:.

i received a reply from michael a. cremo, author of forbidden archeology: the hidden history of the human race (see http://www.mcremo.com/index.htm ) regarding the topic genetic evidence for "macroevolution"?

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=21092&site=3.

gravedancer

Thi Chi,

I think there is a problem. You post something and then say we should not respond to it - because it was penned by someone else. So why post it? It seems like a cop-out to me. So you are not even open to discussing the ideas and concepts? Do you agree with them? do you understand them completely?

Did you get permission from the author of the email prior to posting his email and all his personal contact info?

23

More Anti-Cult Crap

by proplog2 in

jw
friends

it's nice to see ros post here but unfortunately its the same anti-cult hype.

a cult is just about any organization that you decide to leave for one reason or another.

let's consider these enlightening comparisons of moonies and jw's.

gravedancer

Proplog

So is there a point to the stuff you are writing? Are you willing to say that JW's are NOT a cult? What do you say? Are they just slightly misled?

Please enlighten me.

6

Evolution and Man's Consciousness of ...

by D wiltshire in

jw
friends

evolution and mans consciousness of god existence .

when man discovered how to make fire it was an evolutional break thru.. his mind (brain) had developed to the point of making all kinds of discoveries.. a natural question for a being as he gains more and more consciousness is at a some point to ask the questions:.

why im i here?.

gravedancer

Consciousness is sometimes regarded as intrinsically mysterious - something probably beyond human comprehension, maybe even impossible to define. On the other hand consciousness is an ordinary fact of life - babies are born without it and develop it over the first few years of life. And whatever it is, it presumably evolved - like other complex biological phenomena. Even if we regard consciousness as a curse, then that makes it even more plausible that it has a biological benefit to counterbalance its obvious disadvantages - or else natural selection would have gotten rid of it long ago (saving a lot of hungry brain tissue in the process). We experience the dawn of consciousness every morning when we awaken.

People often find 'consciousness' mysterious, but the real mystery is awareness - and many other animals are aware, so this is not a specifically human mystery.

The proper questions should be as follows. Firstly, is awareness an evolved adaptation? In other words did awareness evolve to solve a problem with reproductive consequences for the animal, or is awareness it perhaps an epiphenomenon? And if we assume that awareness is an adaptation with a biologically useful function, the second question concerns the biological nature of this adaptation - what is the mechanism by which awareness solves the problem it evolved to solve?

So consciousness cannot be any more biologically mysterious than any of the other extremely hard to understand and explain abilities we and many other animals enjoy. Indeed, consciousness is almost certainly a great deal simpler than human vision - which requires enormous amounts of brain tissue and hundreds of millions of years of evolution to perfect. Consciousness seems to have taken only tens of millions of years to develop, and involves only a relatively small amount of the cerebral cortex.

Most of my post was reproduced from this fascinating piece of work by Bruce G Charlton MD: http://www.hedweb.com/bgcharlton/awconlang.html

8

The victim

by gravedancer in

jw
friends

granted, many/most of the participants on this board have been wronged by jehovahs witnesses (either by elders, the governing body, the policies or the unnatural discipline).

many have also been wronged by their government, their parents, their peers and their relatives.

we are all victims.

gravedancer

Celtic,

I won't argue with you on the readiness of the victim...(although you are confusing psychiatry with psychology).

But I strongly believe that the worst stage of being a victim is when the victim thinks they are a helpless victim...what is so hard to understand? Try and simplify it and you will see it looking at you.

8

The victim

by gravedancer in

jw
friends

granted, many/most of the participants on this board have been wronged by jehovahs witnesses (either by elders, the governing body, the policies or the unnatural discipline).

many have also been wronged by their government, their parents, their peers and their relatives.

we are all victims.

gravedancer

Celtic,

I am not attacking you either. However, when someone is sitting feeling as though they have no answers and are anxious/depressed they are victims of their own state of mind - the worst kind of victim there is.

In saying that I am not condemning them or being insensitive - but trying to point out the reality of the situation. when we are in that state (and most of us get to be in that state at some point) we cannot see for ourselves. Yes, I probably would have felt as though someone saying what I had to say was "insensitive" too when I was in that state.

"Just providing a hearing ear" or "a shoulder to cry on" furthers the victim mentality because it legitimizes it in the mind of the victim. By being the sob-rag you are in effect allowing the victim to say to themselves: "others see me for the victim too and they agree I am one and they are confirming that my life is worthless".

What alternative do you have to offer?

7

Fantasy theories

by ninjaturtle in

jw
friends

evolutionists like to point out that there was 4 billion years for evolution to play with.. but consider http://uk.news.yahoo.com/010222/80/b5mxs.html.

it looks like 90% of natural selection was wiped out and the random mutations had to start working with a much smaller base only 250 million years ago.

gravedancer

If you are really interested then I suggest you start with what is already published such as "A Speed Limit for Evolution" which article can be found at http://dspace.dial.pipex.com/jcollie/sle/index.htm

8

The victim

by gravedancer in

jw
friends

granted, many/most of the participants on this board have been wronged by jehovahs witnesses (either by elders, the governing body, the policies or the unnatural discipline).

many have also been wronged by their government, their parents, their peers and their relatives.

we are all victims.

gravedancer

Granted, many/most of the participants on this board have been wronged by Jehovah’s Witnesses (either by elders, the governing body, the policies or the unnatural discipline). Many have also been wronged by their government, their parents, their peers and their relatives. We are all victims. That is a fact. Let’s accept it.

I have a favorite saying “ask the next question”. So let’s do that. The next question: What are you going to do about it?

How do we overcome the “victim mentality”?

The first step is the realization that you determine the value of your own experience. You also control some of the content. Nobody else can tell you how much certain things mean to you. You are the only one who is having the life experience you are now living, and you are better off appreciating your life's value, if you can find value in your life events, even if others believe you are wasting your time. You are as real and authentic as any of the folks who would say otherwise, and you have a right to be your own person. Loving yourself better may very well require that you believe in yourself more fully. Are you prepared to do this, or do you think that to do so would be pretentious? Would it be better if everyone thought you were worthy and capable, but you? And what about the change; do we really want to make changes in our lifestyle, in order to get to a place where we enjoy life more overall?

The “victim mentality”: if things are going wrong, or badly, or not to my liking, then someone is to blame. It is necessary to identify the person(s), circumstance(s), or source(s) of why things are not as I think they should be. Blame must be determined and accepted by the wrongdoer, and things must be made right. I am justified in being emotionally upset. Neither growth nor learning result from the bad things that happen to me.

The person who defeats the victim mentality: I completely and wholly accept that everything that has ever happened to me, that is presently happening to me, and that will happen to me in the future provides me with opportunities for learning and growth; and that no one else can be rightly blamed for any negativity, hurts, or abuses which my emotional nature experiences. I shall seek no exceptions to this belief, even when the apparent cause is not of my making.

The irony of overcoming a “victim mentality” is that victory has to start in one's mind -- the very place the person is struggling. The person has to see (him or herself) in a different light, and above all want to change their situation. Overcoming any type of hardship is never an easy thing to do, however, there are some people who are more persistent and determined to make the necessary changes to break free from that victim mentality

Sadly, most will never overcome it and will live out the rest of their days believing they had no control of their own destiny.