Erica, you have all of my respect. I add my thanks to the others here and am grateful that despite all odds and what sounds like poor representation, justice was done. It gives me more faith in the jury system. You have endured more than your share of sorrow; I wish you only happiness for the rest of your journey here on earth.
Posts by Grunt
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36Thanks for the support love, Erica
by angel ini am erica garza rodriguez.
i wanted to write and thank all of you for your interest and support during this long pursuit of justice.. to those wonderful friends who were able to travel to ritzville for the trial, my heart overflows with humble gratitude.. bill bowen (and wife sheila, behind the scene).
b (you know who you are), pat, chris, richard and wife, gsark, baharama and sister, maximus, were you there?
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9
Anyone else notice the milestone? Thanks Simon...
by individuals wife inanyone notice the milestone tonight - we've just passed the amazing total of 100,000 posts on this board!!!!
thought we all needed a pat on the back and three cheers for all our effort!!!.
what a lot we've got to say!!
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Grunt
Thanks Simon,
Your site is the best I have ever visited. I like the way you can get notification of answers to a post. Even though I try to avoid anything that would be censored I like the lack of censorship. Most importantly you have attracted a great group of people to post. I have learned a lot here and as I don't attend a church on a regular basis I think of this bunch as the closest thing I have to a congregation of fellow believers. Your efforts are genuinely appreciated. -
Guilty on All Counts!!!
by Grunt injust called out to washington and found out that veliz (the jehovah's witness elder that molested erica and others) was tried and found guilty on all counts.
great news for erica and those whom he abused through the years.
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Grunt
Just called out to Washington and found out that Veliz (the Jehovah's Witness Elder that molested Erica and others) was tried and found Guilty on all counts. Great News for Erica and those whom he abused through the years.
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48
Kent's Tabloid Journalism = lies??
by Kismet inkent has recently undertaken posting more and more 'headlines' fashioned much like those found in tabloid rags such as the national inquirer.
such headlines skirt the issue but rarely are an accurate representation of the real story.. case in point a headlines such as:.
never marry a jw!
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Grunt
How do I feel? Great.
Vomiting? I see it more as lancing their wound than vomiting up my chunks. Many people lurk here. A lot are Witnesses. Any that are honest, and a lot are or all of us wouldn't have left, have to admit that the facts are the rank and file are the only ones that do the dirt and pay the price. When was the last time a GB member went to prison for anything? Or pioneered for that matter. They have two standards, or really one standard and a non-standard. At the top everything is flexible. I picture it as going like this, "Hmmm, can't get into these new countries with the present stand on blood eh? Ok, change it to a conscience issue, by the tell the r and f nothing has changed but the name. Voting too, huh, ok, same deal, same message to the rank and file. By the way, find some way to beat the drums, these people are slowing down!!! We can't allow, uh, make that, Jehovah doesn't want His people to slow down now SO Close to the END. That's right, beat the drums a little bit, light a fire under these publishers somehow. Do what you have to do but these numbers have to come back up."Besides when you lance a wound, everyone can see the puss and know just how infected it was.
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17
Berry Case on Great Crowd
by Kent intopic closed great crowd discussion board .
read all about it!!!!
posts: 1122. from:.
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Grunt
Kent, thanks a lot for the pictures. I started to say, "Hey, that looks a lot like Sitka, Alaska" but then thought you might take it as some kind of put down so I didn't. It is beautiful. I live close to a coast too, actually two coasts, but am not smart enough to send pictures. You and Jan have actually caused me to learn quite a bit about Norway, thanks. Why aren't there many Swedes on these boards? Or do they just hide it?
MadApostate,
Principal=WTS - Sounds right to me.
Agents=Elder Bodies/Comm - ditto
Third Parties=R&F harmed by Elders' actions. - Couldn't agree more.
"I would respond to Grunt's post, but can't figure out what he is "grunting" about. If he is congratulating KK, who can't even get his facts straight, then he deserves no reply!!!"
Hmmmm, then give me none. Or is it too late for that? As you did reply I have to wonder what was so confusing about my Grunts? Let me explain them.
I said thanks to Kent for putting up this post from GreatCrowd that was deleted, and for his opposition to the Cult I hate. I next called him a Yankee and tricked him into sending me some GREAT pictures of a place I am unlikly to visit all in one fell swoop. Not a bad trick that. I agreed with him that here as it evidently is in Norway, the jury is totally unprecdictable and despite having a great case presented can come in with an off the wall verdict.
Do you agree that the Witnesses are a clueless cult that destroys lives?
Do you agree that a jury can ignore facts and render a bad decision sometimes?
Do you sometimes find Norwegians a little boastful and overbearing, trying to force their world view and culture on the rest of us? (send more pics please)
If you disagree with the above then it is little wonder that you aren't sure where I am coming from. Let me make it clear, I would pay money to drive a bulldozer through Bethel and then Patterson. I despise the group known as Jehovah's Witnesses for the lies they spread and the people they hurt. I will carry the weapons of any man wanting to fire a shot at the Tower, if it gives me a better shot too. I want the Tower in rubble and then I want to dance on that rubble and fling it at rusty old printing presses and laugh while I do it.
Does that clear the fog? -
48
Kent's Tabloid Journalism = lies??
by Kismet inkent has recently undertaken posting more and more 'headlines' fashioned much like those found in tabloid rags such as the national inquirer.
such headlines skirt the issue but rarely are an accurate representation of the real story.. case in point a headlines such as:.
never marry a jw!
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Grunt
I have butted heads with Kent a few times. Usually half in fun when he would make some remark about the USA, that was, OF COURSE, wrong. I don't like the way he insults people. I think the rule we should follow is that we talk to one another just like we would face to face. Most of us are not so rude as to say "you are stupid" to someone face to face. Yet here many feel free to do so. I do my best to talk to people here the same way I would if they were in front of me. Courtesy is the name of the game until I get insulted. Even then I am not going to curse someone.
Having said that, let me say that I am deeply indebted to Kent and others like him who have done so much work. I have profited from that work. I try to spread the benefits of the information from him and the others like him.
As for being bitter and angry, I don't see that as a flaw in him. I AM A BITTERLY ANGRY MAN WHEN IT COMES TO THE WATCHTOWER, whether he is or not. Simply said, I hate them. I am sorry to admit to being so childish but I really, honestly, would love to beat the hell out of each member of the Governing Body that has inflicted so much harm on so many. They should be in prison in my opinion. They have caused a lot of others to be and yet they sit on their flabby butts in New York and skate while the poor "sister" loses her husband because she chooses the WT over him, while the poor child dies for lack of a bone marrow transplant, while families are shattered and forsaken, they.....there I go, see? I get up a head of steam pretty quick when I start thinking about the two faced hypocrites and phonies. Why shouldn't we be angry? Look what they doing and to whom they do it. They've earned my contempt.
As for what Kent says, it was all true. Not partially true.Kent said:
"Today the Watchtower is all about money. ...
And business is what it's all about. Weapons production, security companies, real estate companies, travelling agencies, microwave equipment, grocery stores, Car sales, fruit exporters, printing, stocks - you name it - and the Watchtower do have a finger there!"The things he mentioned all support what he said, it is all business, all money. They sleep with everyone that they forbid the rank and file to talk to.
You replied to him:
"While the Watchtower Society may have some connection to the above, it has been proven time and again that some of the above have nothing to do with the religious organization except sharing the same name."They share the MONEY. Which is what it is all about, business. Witnesses can't work for a church, but they can file a lawsuit with Jimmy Swaggart and the Moonies as cronies. If they own stocks in an arms business then they should give it away, destroy it, something, but don't profit from the "unclean" thing. They have whored their way around in France trying to influence political policy, they sucked up to Hitler, and George Bush could have his way with them anytime he wants to by offering them tax incentives or loopholes. Or he could make them put the bibles away and cause them to lie and say they are a "cultural club" if he threatened to take away all their property and freeze their accounts if they are a religion. It is laughable. They are supposed to be the ONE that would stand up when all the other religions lay down? Ha. They would be happy to tell the rank and file to die like sheep rather than compromise, but at headquarters they have a true appreciation for the dollar bill. The bulgarian blood deal gives you a good idea of what they are capable of, and what they allowed in Africa. No, Kent is doing a good job I think. Not quite up to Swedish Standards, but still a pretty good job.
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Berry Case on Great Crowd
by Kent intopic closed great crowd discussion board .
read all about it!!!!
posts: 1122. from:.
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Grunt
Thanks for posting this, Kent. I had heard someone mention it but had not read it. I used to take the trouble to go to boards like that and present as moderating a tone as I could, but not being willing to lie makes it hard to really post with a clean conscience. I appreciate a lot of the posts you put up. You have Yankee ways, but the last thing I would accuse you of is not having the facts or presenting them. Your biggest fault lies in your extreme Norwegian Nationalism, and I guess when you are raised on the soup of National Pride, it is hard to overcome. (I do wish when defending it you would present pictures like Jan does. Thank you too, Jan, if you are out there) I also agree with you that until the jury has spoken the facts presented don't mean squat..... just look at O.J. Simpson.
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15
Spouse & Child Abuse - JW style -experience
by waiting ini received this through e-mail on another forum "pioneeroutreach".
fascinating, horrible, reading.
it's long - but guaranteed to leave you thinking "what the ........".
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Grunt
Thank you, Waiting, for a very perceptive post. As a man I think it is easy to overlook a lot of things that I should notice. You, my wife, and a lot of ladies who have worked with me over the years have helped me to understand things I would have always viewed from the wrong slant. I think you are right about the daughter also, my heart aches for all the kids like her. She had to put up with the lousy father, sexual abuse from the same, the lousy marriage, the poverty and grief after the marriage and now probably the loss of her mother and maybe even her siblings. Wow. I hope she is getting help and that she can find a good mate and sustain a happy marriage. She deserves some of the sweet things of life instead of all the sour.
I want very much to send flowers to Erica, after the trial is fine. I just want her to know that there are people out there who care, who are sorry for what she has been through and who respect what she has done. I would really like to send them to the two other girls whose testimony was not accepted. I am told (by my wife :) that the age of the victims has a lot to do with the time limitations. She said she thinks if perpetrated on a child under 11, there is no time limit for prosecution, for older girls there is. Doesn't seem fair, does it? A teenager is a child too. I hope the pervert gets life. If not he will just hurt other children. I hope the other "elder" that abused her is prosecuted also somehow. I would wager that there are more victims out there for both of these guys. If you get an address, I would appreciate it. I thought about just sending it to the prosecuting attorney, I have his phone number and could call and ask if he could get them to Erica. A comrade in the seige of the Tower, -
15
Spouse & Child Abuse - JW style -experience
by waiting ini received this through e-mail on another forum "pioneeroutreach".
fascinating, horrible, reading.
it's long - but guaranteed to leave you thinking "what the ........".
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Grunt
I can't understand how it happens and continues to happen. I guess they get caught in some kind of high pressure treadmill. She had the ingredients to what she thought was a great life, husband with a good job, kids, triplets even, and all in the "truth." Then when it began to unravel I guess she couldn't figure what to do without him. A single mother with one kid has a hard time, one with six? I guess the idea was daunting. No love, lots of kids, sick kids, and the cult. What a combination. She has had to put up with far too much. I wish her well and hope that as she is already on the net that she may find her way out. There are programs that could help her a lot. I also have to say she misread the school situation. Most states have a hot line for child abuse and schools do NOT supress information, or at least none of the ones I have been in contact with do. Information like this would never have been the responsibility of a student teacher, or even a teacher. It would have been turned over to a guidance counselor and dealt with by someone who knew the lay of the land and the ways to help. In Florida, an abused child would have someone there by the end of the school day to go home with them and check the situation out.
Waiting, you too have had to deal with too much. You have done it well and seem to be using it to help others. People like this are fortunate to find advice from those like you who have had the strength to stand up and get out.
By the way, are you sending flowers or anything like that out to Erica? I would like to. I guess I will go back and see if they put up an address. Thank you for a sad but eye opening post. -
21
Witnesses admit to counting time on-line ...
by dedalus ini wonder how much of a trend this is, and what it means for the watchtower publishing empire.
hours up, placements down .... http://www.greatcrowd.com/159ubb/forum1/html/000234.html.
dedalus
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Grunt
Thanks for all the links. As for the dubs coming here, I believe they do and in droves. Free speech is a wonderful thing and draws them like flies to honey. Even if all they do is lurk, it is still refreshing to them. I love the fact that some are counting time on line. I hope they log a LOT of hours here. Even the arguments here are educational for them, and though the language in some might put them off a little, they have heard it all before on the playground. Besides the language can let them feel "superior." Coming here shows they really are interested in truth and not just propaganda, with the amount of evidence available that interest will be fed at the expense of the Purple Press in Brooklyn. As for ManofTrueGod or whatever, he is a proven liar. Once he left and claimed he wouldn't be back over at Wit.net, he was back before he was missed, hmmmm, might have been a while at that. How very like them to pull such a thread. Too bad he couldn't make it to the trial to lend support to the pervert.