i mentioned to an elder/friend the other day that it occurred to me that there really doesan't seem to be any scriptural precedent or mandate for the tradition of praying before we eat.
i said that jesus blessed the loaves and fishes when he performed that miracle, and he blessed the wine and bread at the last supper, but i couldn't think of any other example of it.
i also suggested that the tradition of praying before eating was probably rooted in giving thanks to the various gods of nature and the perception og god as being involved in the outcome of the harvest, and that, by that way of looking at it, we probably shouldn't pray before eating....silence..
Mrs Jones, the Rabbie Burrns 'Selkirk Grace' recited on Burns night it as follows:-
"Some hae meat and cannot eat
And some wad eat that want it
But we hae meat and we can eat
And sae the Lord be thankit"
Ok - now in English!
Some have meat and they can eat
Some cannot eat that want it
But we have meat and we can eat
So let the Lord be thanked
This grace usually covers, the believers and non- believers and doesn't really cause offence. Well not after a few whiskeys!!!
this or something like it, will be the preface:.
in 1973, the year i graduated from college, i joined what sociologists now call a high control religion, what others would call a cult.
sixteen years later, my wife and i mailed a letter to the groups headquarters formally ending our relationship with them.
You should have a good base of interested people here. I would certainly want to read it, just keep us posted where/when we can get it. Good luck.
this economy is killing me.
many sleepless nights..
You are not alone Paul, but I'm sure that dosn't make it any easier. Hope you can manage to ride the storm.
i mentioned to an elder/friend the other day that it occurred to me that there really doesan't seem to be any scriptural precedent or mandate for the tradition of praying before we eat.
i said that jesus blessed the loaves and fishes when he performed that miracle, and he blessed the wine and bread at the last supper, but i couldn't think of any other example of it.
i also suggested that the tradition of praying before eating was probably rooted in giving thanks to the various gods of nature and the perception og god as being involved in the outcome of the harvest, and that, by that way of looking at it, we probably shouldn't pray before eating....silence..
I hate the fact that JWs go ahead and give thanks even in the company of non believers - it is so insensitive. There is absolutley no need for it. I myself prefer Rabbie Burns Selkirk Grace - any Scots out there will know what I mean
my grown kids are all jehovah's witnesses --- last i knew --- and live (or lived) in the cary, elgin, barrington, crystal lake il area and i am wondering if anyone on this site would know them.
they are between 25 - 35 years old.
if you attended any hall in these areas --- or were familiar with witnesses from these congregations --- over the past 15 years or so, would you please pm me?
I wish you well in your search. I am sure you will find them - the internet is a wonderful thing in situations like this.
i am noticing a difference..... "raised in's" seem to be a little more relaxed and better suited for their world after the kh.
"converts" seem to be a little disoriented.
maybe b/c they saw the truth as away out of this crazy world only to be massive dissapointed.
From my experience, born-ins are less able to cope. They literally have no connection with 'the world'. If you are a convert, you can at least go back to what was 'normal'. If you are a born-in, you go back to what is 'evil'. My uber JW ex MIL, has a warm side to her, she was not born-in. Her daughter, on the other hand, is way out there - not able to reason, totally unsympathetic etc. I see the difference in them, and so do my kids, as one being born-in and one being 'formed' out of the org.
well, follow this mouse.
.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psupz7wn_5q.
Soooo glad it had a happy ending.
do you not know that they teach wrong doctrine?.
i hope you do i pray you do!
it's brainwash on so many lvls.
This has been one of the funniest threads I have read - like a comic strip. Outlaw your post had me on the floor laughing. Sorry Barbra, but something's not quite right with your posts.
for "the happiest people on earth" i found so many folk in the cong had depression or suffered with "nerves and axiety" there was one lad who was due to go and "work" in bethel and changed his mind at the last minute and spent nearly all his time on his computer in his bedroom from then on (he must of been on this site !he apparently "went schitsophrenic(dont know how to spell it sorry ) as did his sister and his poor mum was probably the most dedicated dub in the cong but was considered as a bit "bonkers" by all in the cong .
there were 3 elders i know of who had depression and many rank and file , i must admit it did make me question how "happy "being a dub would make me when i was a study and voiced my concerns i was told satan was trying to get them out the truth so they were depressesed or some rubbish like that , but i was also told that people who leave the truth are depressed because they dont have the truth !
you cant have it both ways !
Hi Looloo, my ex has had very bad anxiety and depression and had to give up work at one point. He says it is because when we were together and I didn't believe, it caused him terrible stress. So, now we are separated, I wonder what will happen. I almost wish his panic and stress will come back, just to prove that it's not me, it's the org. and all his twisted beliefs, but at the same time, I wouldn't wish it on anybody. I would say that cult=mental illness in a lot of cases.
i am such a placid person.
i will always turn the other cheek.
i will always be the one to yeild.
Oh I feel your pain Aussie Oz. I am so glad that my kids were grown up before we separated, and before that time I was able to influence them about the org. I can sense a panic that you may lose them to the org forever, and I think that is what is making you so (jusifiably) angry. Could you possibly present a dossier to the court of the realities of the cult? I feel that this needs to be done on a 'grand' scale, for future court cases, so that the courts are more knowledgable about JW and don't just treat them as another religion. Good luck with it all.
