I'd be very surprised if Dr phil mentions them but breifly because they are just not doing the sort of sensational stuff he will be talking about like closed communes, sleep deprivation, food restriction, drug coersion. So in england not sure I'll get to see this show but hey keep me informed to see if he actually mentions it.
Posts by reniaa
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28Nov 5 Dr. Phil - Cult Mind Control - WATCH TONIGHT!
by still_in74 inwednesday - november 5, 2008mind control?its hard to believe, but in america alone, there may be as many as 5,000 religious groups preying upon the weak and vulnerable, and all in the name of god.
dr. phils guests have warnings for you and your children.
seeta says when her 18-year-old daughter joined a religious group called 1 mind ministries, she left home with her 7-month-old son and never returned.
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I am an active elder and I voted today!
by outofthebox intoday is a proud day for me.
i became part of my fellow citizens in this country by casting my vote.
it was a thrilling experience (more like a disney ride really, since the line wasn't that long).
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reniaa
Well, I guess OOTB has shown that the JWs can not be God's clean org...as the WT claims these men are appointed to position by the Holy Spirit. Perhaps though, the Holy Spirit has moved OOTB to this position to be able to help others out of the org.
Reniaa, did you pm Mary yet for her book?
You surprise me Isaac I did think you wouldn't fall into the class of 'end justifies the means' and would actually appreciate that some people considering their age and situations are best left with the comfort and hope of their faith especially if you cannot offer them an alternative. you are right I am more pro-witness these days and am currently sorting my life so as to get to at least one meeting a fortnight,
The argument that holy spirit would not allow a bad person in is ridiculous unless you can guarantee perfection in the leaders of any faith, The example of bad seeds getting in goes way back to Jesus and Judas, even peter denied Jesus 3 times so holy spirit didn't protect him there, you say you follow bible isaac so i'm surprised you made that point!
As for Mary's book considering I have read a number of mary's view on my points she is particularily hate-filled on the JW front, I don't think her book would give a fair or unbiased look whatever the subject if it concerns JW's, so nope it holds no interest for me and I feel the same about awakenned at gileads book too. I saw a thread were he was canvassing for negative experiences there was no attempt to ask for alternate ones.
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Who is Jehovah?
by cameo-d ina god who loves the smell of burnt flesh - tis a restful odor to him don't you know.
lol.
i bet you like the smell of a roasting boar bar-b-que, too.
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reniaa
hi laialeo I found something lately is it true jesus's name is spelt two ways in the NT as both yeshua and ious the greek way by paul? both quite different sounding in the 2 languages?
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So why ARE women allowed to speak at congregation meetings?
by easyreader1970 inthe apostle paul said that women should be silent in congregation meetings and not flap their traps.
if they need to talk about something, they can talk about it with their husband when they get home.
so why does the wbts pick and choose which verses they apply and which they do not?
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reniaa
The funny thing is without the headship rule I think the position of elder would be something appealing to me lol not for looking good but just because it's obvious a job were you need a lot of sincere belief in God and love of your fellow man, and JWs need loving elders to counter ones that I accept are on power trips unfortunately it seems to be a fact in life that people react in good and bad ways to having power within various orgs.
Do you think women would make good elders?
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I am an active elder and I voted today!
by outofthebox intoday is a proud day for me.
i became part of my fellow citizens in this country by casting my vote.
it was a thrilling experience (more like a disney ride really, since the line wasn't that long).
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reniaa
Is it right to destroy a person's faith without offering an alternative like Jw's and jesus did.
Sir82
Good question.
Here's a good question for you:
If I see that you are in a theater watching a movie, and I notice the theater is on fire, and I yell for you to get out, do I have the obligation to tell you where else that movie is playing?
Mickey mouse Re: I am an active elder and I voted today! Is it right to destroy a person's faith without offering an alternative like Jw's and jesus did.
What about a Mormon deconstructing a Catholic person's faith and indoctrinating them into the LDS faith? How about a Christian who converts to Judaism? You would probably consider all of that a moot point, trading one false religion for another and this is the crux of the whole issue with you Reniaa. You think JW's have "the truth". You are truly a captive of a concept. You are unable to consider the evidence objectively because all you are interested in doing is attacking the characters of fellow posters here and detracting from the subject at hand.Personally I'm not sure yet where I stand when it comes to belief in God or the Bible. I haven't had sufficient opportunity to study everything I want to yet. I still think it's better knowing I was wrong and searching for the truth than deluding myself I had it right in the first place. It seems to me the most important thing to you is security, so you'd sooner cling to a fallacy than acknowledge it as such and face uncertainty.
Hmmm the save anyone from a burning cinema this a vague simile, I think the question would be more correct by offering....is someone better being saved from a burning cinema only to be put the burning shop next door? If you could guarantee their life would be trouble free outside of the Jw's from druggies, school shootings, wars, unforseen and terrible circumstances then your cooking with oil, the JW's and any other faith for that matter offer HOPE real hope beyond all that we can hope for in an existance without God.
Have you ever watched 'highlander' the movie 'there can be only one!' it's that way with all religions and the bible, don't fool yourself, all religions agree on this, JW's are not unusual in this respect , you may get the occasional ultra modern one that says all roads lead to God but even they will say something like erm that excludes extremist muslims (who in there own way are extremely commited to their god), the majority of christian faiths may in many cases club together but in their own minds they believe it is a 'Jesus only' club and those that don't believe in jesus 'here's a ticket to hell' lol hense why isaac amongst others like born agains on here thinks i'm condemned by virtue of not believing in Jesus as God.
You can't have it both ways you can't say JWs are bad because they believe only the JW's have the 'truth' and then go on to say but we are saving people from the faith because they have it wrong erm you are contradicting yourself Jw's can only be wrong if you think there is a right answer concerning belief in God! but then you are not offering that right answer just saying well your on your own now 33,000 faiths to chose from and thats only the christian ones, and the 70 year old sister with no family whose lived 50 years in the Jws looks at you helplessly with no idea were her next hope will come from! and you say 'I've saved you be free but don't expect an alternative from me I've done my bit, i'm sure you'll find a nicer faith of course you may have to do the work yourself not many faiths actually evangelise outside of their little groups."
Research in bible is always good but a difficult process mickey mouse I wish you well with that. My research led me back to Jw's but I appreciate that is not the same for everyone and I do respect other faiths but inevitably if there is a god then we all stand before him individually and have our hearts judged, the only God I could stand before with any sincerity is Jehovah I've tried the others but I couldn't find the faith for them! So I'm throwing my lot with Jw's for good or ill :S
reniaa
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I am an active elder and I voted today!
by outofthebox intoday is a proud day for me.
i became part of my fellow citizens in this country by casting my vote.
it was a thrilling experience (more like a disney ride really, since the line wasn't that long).
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reniaa
Awakenned at gilead you surprise me....you've been a special pioneer you have gone abroad lol i've never even had a passport you have tought Jw faith from country to country and presumably you were taught to teach them same way as me that we were not there to destroy faiths but replace them with Jehovah and the promise of the new world. But from your words its looks like its God not just the JWs you've lost your faith in. You cannot assume that because you feel happier to be satisfied with a life with no hope of something beyond 3 score years and 10 that others will feel the same, I don't I tried atheism it was depressing as hell.
[seriously] BTW, JWs go knocking on peoples doors every day and destroy other peoples faith... why is it OK for JWs to do it and not ok for us to destroy the "faith" of JWs?
maybe issaac of all the people who replied to me who when looking in the bewildered lost face of someone young or old whom he has just taken all the underpinings of their hopes and faith in their God would try and replace it with his belief in Jesus although i'm not sure. but the rest of you seem to be of the opinion it's ok to destroy a JW 's faiths whatever their circumstance because they will automatically be better off and you have no responsibilty to replace it with the hope with something new?
I find that thinking niave at best and downright blinkered at worst. but I made this point in my post earlier,, Is it right to destroy a person's faith without offering an alternative like Jw's and jesus did.
Let me make one thing clear if someone comes on this website and loses their faith well the first action was their's and its not like the wt haven't warned them lol I used to think the wt were worrying to much but having been on this site and checked a couple of others they really are unremittingly apostate hehe i've even had a few on this site try and get me banned simply because of my pro-witness inclinations...... but if you enveigle yourself in a high up people-effecting congregational position with lie's and trickery as OOTB has done and proceed to do whatever your revenge/humour/unthinking agenda makes you do then that is a completely different thing OOTB is not offering an alternative he only wants to destroy. I've taken this off topic but I was shocked to see OOTB carried on with it, part of me hopes he is just lying to make himself sound good on this site.
Well back to the subject at hand...Voting to be honest I don't care much about it, even when I could easily have voted when I hadn't had contact with Jw's for years, I didn't bother, I'm english and a bit oldish so remember all the fuss when Magaret thatcher was to be the first woman primeminister, she turned out to be a typical polition in a skirt, polititions are like priests they have been honed and taught in the political arena so they all become fairly similar and fairly interchangeable most have writers that have probs writen the same speaches for half a dozen candidates. The bible says man cannot save Man and my experience is political leaders can't either but they are good at declaring war!
anyway enjoy your voting it is a historic one the first black president! you can say you voted him in and one in the eye of the WT but of cause i'm not saying you whole reason for voting is just to thumb your nose at WT you probs now are really commited to the political growth and wellbeing of your country.
OOTB I didn't know you were english? lol I hope your cong is far away from any near me in Yorkshire.
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So why ARE women allowed to speak at congregation meetings?
by easyreader1970 inthe apostle paul said that women should be silent in congregation meetings and not flap their traps.
if they need to talk about something, they can talk about it with their husband when they get home.
so why does the wbts pick and choose which verses they apply and which they do not?
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reniaa
This is an interesting topic and yknot's info is correct with WT ruling I remember (lol old fogey i am ^^) when bookstudies with no men have had to be conducted by women and the older sister usually had a scarf handy, anyone else remember?
I think the wt are right after reading the scriptures myself Paul is clearly reinforcing the headship principle but since we know women then were given the gift of holy spirit too go and preach and talk it wasn't the coverall that we can mistake it for, certainly most older christian faiths took it to heart lol lightning might strike from heaven than pope let a woman talk in church (although times are changing)
Watchtower were letting woman talk and do the teaching door experiences well before the modern upsurge for women and gay priests came along now a woman speaking in men's position in church without head covering is no surprise.
But.....this is a bible teaching! so is the bible right here? or is this something we should consider outdated and something modern christianity should rewrite because we know better than bible writers?
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I am an active elder and I voted today!
by outofthebox intoday is a proud day for me.
i became part of my fellow citizens in this country by casting my vote.
it was a thrilling experience (more like a disney ride really, since the line wasn't that long).
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reniaa
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You're a good man OOTB
As to Reniaa question:
managed to destroy the faith of any faithful old witnesses yet?
We can only hope so. Once faith is destroyed in the WT one can begin to know Jesus and understand the Bible.
I'll answer you isaac as a good example of the posts mentioning mine.....You all call JW's a lie but they are not the ones that added a scripture and make a son a god so personally I do not think it is a lie so no i'm not being a hypocrite, not in the same way OOTB is.
If jesus had just come and made Jews know their faith was a lie but replacing it with nothing how cruel is that? I respect mormons or {pick any other evangelical faith) before I respect people that seek destroy someones faith without putting an alternate hope in their hearts, and after their faith is destroyed and they have doubts and loss not even sure there is a God and my goodness there must a be few of you that know what that is like and trust me I DO TOO, you would do that to another human being especially someone too old and having invested a whole life in a faith and religion to ever be able to rebuild with the same confidence?
Congratulating yourselves that you've helped destroy the WT when all you've done is selfish self-indulgent playing with people for your own revenge agendas! well forgive me If I think my so-called lie is better than being like you lot, who have let bitterness and revenge make your hearts very cold.
Their teaching will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus, 18 who have wandered away from the truth. They say that the resurrection has already taken place, and they destroy the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless, God's solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: "The Lord knows those who are his," [
OOTB is playing a silly game and my prayer is that he manages to hurt no-one and least of all himself and his family.
I'm done
reniaa
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I am an active elder and I voted today!
by outofthebox intoday is a proud day for me.
i became part of my fellow citizens in this country by casting my vote.
it was a thrilling experience (more like a disney ride really, since the line wasn't that long).
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reniaa
And when the new
puppetleader goes to war with Iran, all those that voted can be happy in supportingwarmongerersfighters for peace andoilthe common good.you are still enjoying your lie OOTB? managed to destroy the faith of any faithful old witnesses yet?
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jesus denies being God! scriptural discussion.
by reniaa ini thought after recently reading the bible i would put up for disussion some recent scriptures up which for me show that jesus never viewed himself as god and anyone listening would also see it this way too.. first mark 10 :17-20.
17as jesus started on his way, a man ran up to him and fell on his knees before him.
"good teacher," he asked, "what must i do to inherit eternal life?
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reniaa
hi sacolton i thought this one had become a dusty achive but in response let me show my favourite scripture....
3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,
peter's words after jesus's resurrection and still clearly showing jesus as God's son and not God.