Posts by BonaFide

Did any of you have any "secret information" you used to believe and tell?

by BonaFide in

sorry, wrong area..

How I was appointed C.O.

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

if you have never served out of this country or spent any time preaching in another country, you may have certain ideas of how a c.o.

behaves and talks and acts.

what is the youngest c.o.

If you have never served out of this country or spent any time preaching in another country, you may have certain ideas of how a C.O. behaves and talks and acts. What is the youngest C.O. you have ever seen? In the country I served in, it was 23. I was 26 when I was trained, and I was 28 when I started full-time C.O.work.

I arrived in my assignment in 1989. I lived in a missionary home, I had to put in 140 hours per month. Lots of experiences. I came back to the U.S. and gave talks and slides and stuff each year. After two years, I was trained as a substitute C.O. It was two weeks of training, one week I observed the C.O., the next week he observed me. That was it, then I got a letter of appointment from the branch as a sub, but I didnt sub at all. But less than a year later, I was called to the branch, and they told me to get ready, in three weeks I was to start permanent circuit work. I realized my dream. They said I had to wait for an official letter from the Governing Body, since they appoint all circuit overseers, so for now I was a sub. About four months later I got a letter from New York.

They also give the C.O. a binder filled with letters. If the previous C.O. is not up to date with his binder, you can get the letters from the branch. The letters are supposed to stay with the circuit. They are all the letters to the C.O.'s from 1973 on. So I read all those letters.

I had no car at first, so I rode the bus. I felt great, even though developing countries are pretty difficult to live in. I had to stay with the friends, all cold showers, and sometimes just a cot and curtains to separate you from the family. Or I slept on a cot in the Kingdom Hall. I loved it though. I really felt I was doing great, I read about missionaries and C.O's in the WT and wow, I was one now. After two years I got a car. Cheap, auction car from the States. Nice car for that country though.

What else can I say? I wasnt the best C.O., but I wasnt the worst. You would be surprised at some of them. I tried hard, I didnt get into trouble, yes some other C.O.'s did. I tried to be a cool C.O. though.

But one of the ways the branch judges you is how good your recommendations for elder and servant are. A lot of people don't realize that the local branch appoints elders and servants, not Brooklyn. I averaged about two or three rejections a year. That means I along with the body of elders recommend someone, and the branch rejects it. The branch said that is a good percentage, and that I had pretty good judgment. Also, when the Zone overseer visits, they have a one-hour meeting at the branch with a District Overseer, a Circuit Overseer, and a member of the Branch Committee. Twice they invited me to do that, probably because I speak English. But that was a great privilege. I was not the youngest C.O. either, some of the really tough areas had brothers even younger. Some had not even been appointed as elders before. They went straight from servant to C.O.

I taught pioneer schools, the first few times, it was fun. After that, we got a letter with a bunch of strict instructions, so it kinda took the fun out of it. I have the pictures of me teaching those pioneers schools, the group photo.

I acted humble, but I really felt important. I preached with the congregations even in the evenings, to show that we should be zealous. I tried to be fair in judicial committees. Here they seem way more merciful. In that country, any sin and you are disfellowshipped. Seems like that, anyway. I would consult the D.O., who was from Europe, he had a lot of wisdom, or so I thought.

One big mistake I made once was changing the C.O.report. The congregation report was in duplicate, and the recommendation report was in triplicate. So this one elder was pretty mean to the friends, and the branch said to maybe delete him. But when I served that congregation, he was the only elder. So I called in two other elders from another Hall. They didnt know him, so i made the call to delete him. I reconsidered that night and looked up more information, so I informed the D.O. He said we could revisit the matter the week of the assembly. So I didnt sent in the report to the branch. The next week was the assembly. We met with the D.O., and the elder was not recommended for deletion. We all signed it, and gave a copy to the elder to put in the congregation file.

A few months later I was called to the branch. About 45 minutes from the missionary home. They called me into a private room. They held up two reports, one recommending deletion, and one saying to give him another opportunity. I had left the third copy in the congregation files before I left that Sunday. Oh no. In the meantime that congregation had been reassigned to another circuit. So the next C.O. who took over that area saw two copies with dates six days apart, one recommending deletion, and one not. Looked like he had paid me off or threatened me or something. They also called the D.O. in to corroborate my story. He did. They told me it looks bad to change your mind, but I really felt it was Holy Spirit. Anyway, they laughed at the end of the discussion. They said I could have made worse mistakes.

Those memories feel strange now. I had one life here in the States, then another life as a missionary C.O.,then I came back and another life working again. Now even another life as someone who has learned what is really going on in the organization, and why things are the way they are.

I appreciate those who support me on this forum, my situation is not as bad as some, but it is hard sometimes.

And for those of you who don't believe me, go right ahead.

I don't need everyone's approval anymore.

BF

16

I worked with C.O. yesterday in field service

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

so yesterday i worked with the c.o.

we went in a car group, four brothers.

is late 40's, in circuit work about 9 years.

BonaFide

I am not sure what their plan is. I am not that popular anyway, its that there are so few single brothers in the organization, that even if you are not a great catch, you are still popular.

16

I worked with C.O. yesterday in field service

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

so yesterday i worked with the c.o.

we went in a car group, four brothers.

is late 40's, in circuit work about 9 years.

BonaFide

So yesterday I worked with the C.O. We went in a car group, four brothers. The C.O. is late 40's, in circuit work about 9 years. We went to McDonalds first for coffee, stayed 20 minutes, then drove to a return visit, then back to KH for lunch. The C.O. told a lot of experiences in the car about the tract campaign, and how the work is growing in sign language in the United States. He didn't seem to have any doubts or worries whatsoever. He seemed sure of himself, happy, and enthusiastic. I tried to sense if there was any underlying doubts, but I couldnt tell if anything was there.

He talked about how Bethel in New York is so smart for selling the real estate now, and how they definitely have Jehovah's spirit because they buy and sell at the right time. also how the ones that were reassigned from Bethel love the field ministry and are glad they are reassigned. He said some were not too thrilled at first, but now they are happy.

I talked to him that night before the meeting, he said there are "matters pending" with me. So that didnt make me happy. But he also asked me how long I was a missionary and C.O., so he was polite I guess.

But it was just surreal to be with someone who is like I was a few years ago, in every conversation he turns everything around to reflect good on God's Organization.

He also acts like he is important, but yet humble at the same time. The way he walks and talks. He brings up the fact that he is the C.O. but then he like says, "I would like to know, how are you my brother." Hard to describe. Like "I know I am the C.O. and appointed by Brooklyn, but I am still a regular guy."

I don't see any way that I could have brought anything up that would have changed his mind or made him think even a little bit. Everything he said revolves around how we have the truth, and we are God's people.

BF

12

Update on me

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

well, in the past couple of months the elders still havent met with me again regarding the porneia accusation.

either they are waiting for the circuit overseer visit next week to ask them what to do, or they wrote to bethel, or the sister decided not to lie anymore, i am not sure.

but seems like the elders are really after me.

BonaFide

It was a big deal to me to make that kind of money.

Anyway, the reason I don't sound like other C.O.'s is because I was sent at 23 to be a missionary. In other countries, the circuit overseer has to be young, its just too hard a life for older brothers. There is no car that they give you, I rode the bus for two years, then I finally got a car.

But if any of you still doubt me, you can always PM me and I will be glad to give you any detail you want.

I do appreciate the support many of you have given me and also the phone conversations.

BF

12

Update on me

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

well, in the past couple of months the elders still havent met with me again regarding the porneia accusation.

either they are waiting for the circuit overseer visit next week to ask them what to do, or they wrote to bethel, or the sister decided not to lie anymore, i am not sure.

but seems like the elders are really after me.

BonaFide

Well, in the past couple of months the elders still havent met with me again regarding the Porneia accusation. Either they are waiting for the circuit overseer visit next week to ask them what to do, or they wrote to Bethel, or the sister decided not to lie anymore, I am not sure. But seems like the elders are really after me.

But I am still giving talks and commenting, although I am not asked to pray for the congregation. Two of the elders are nice to me, one avoids me completely.

My family is ignoring me more and more, they heard the rumors I had sinned, I guess, and plus I said a bunch of questions they think are apostate. I see them all the time in my JW apartment complex, but I have to say hi first, then they barely say hi. That has to be the weirdest thing of all. My brother told me that our mom talks to him more than me, twenty years of him being shunned, now its me. What a terrible thing we did to him for so many years.

I just hate going to the meetings and sitting there with that weird gross feeling of "are they going to talk to me after the meeting in the back room?" When the elders get up and go back there I think its about me.

I know some of you will criticize this, or say to suck it up, but there is no way you can understand unless you were born into the organization. Your entire family and friends believe that they are doing the best thing for you. I was loyal to the death for so many years. I never had any friends outside the organization. And now when I realize things, they turn on me, and they think its the right thing. I keep on thinking of that short story, "The Lottery" by Shirley Jackson.

At least my job is going good, I am making good money. $5,000 last month after taxes, that is really good money for me anyway. I was always broke before. Other than that, wow this is so hard to deal with. I wonder if when they finally talk to me I should tell them to put any accusations in writing, the elders' book says that on page 110. When I was a C.O. and elder, I only saw one brother do that.

BF

33

Meeting with Elders - but not about me

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

so i agreed to meet with the elders to testify against someone.

this person is an elder, is married, but plays around and messes with sisters.

that's right, he is married.

BonaFide

When I first came back from my missionary assignment, I was assigned by the C.O. to deal with a molestation accusation case. We had to call the police and make a report. The Legal Department at Bethel gave us strict instructions. I felt weird because of all the rules, like we had to call New York on a landline, and we couldn't identify ourselves when we called the police. But I still felt it must somehow have God's spirit to handle the matter like this.

Now I realize that the Society was protecting itself.

I should have done a lot of things better. That's why I testified against that elder, I just hated to see more people suffer when I could do something about it.

I have noticed that a couple of you do not think I am for real, or my background is for real. I could give my name, but what would that accomplish? I am known pretty well in three languages in this area. In past topics, I feel I may have given out too much information already.

If you PM me, then I can give as many details as you like about myself. I wouldnt like to be taken in by a fraud myself, I already was for many years.

BF

33

Meeting with Elders - but not about me

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

so i agreed to meet with the elders to testify against someone.

this person is an elder, is married, but plays around and messes with sisters.

that's right, he is married.

BonaFide

I wonder why I come across as juvenile?

Anyhow, the girl is about 30 years old, the other two were a little younger. The elder is 48 or 49.

BF

33

Meeting with Elders - but not about me

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

so i agreed to meet with the elders to testify against someone.

this person is an elder, is married, but plays around and messes with sisters.

that's right, he is married.

BonaFide

So I agreed to meet with the elders to testify against someone.

This person is an elder, is married, but plays around and messes with sisters. That's right, he is married. By messing around I mean sending personal gifts, sending secret love messages, and trying to kiss them and eventually touch in private areas. It has happened with three different sisters over the past 6 years. His wife is in denial, and blames everyone else. The love notes he sends to other sisters? He claims they are all forged, and that a big conspiracy is going on. No one would testify against him, he has a strong personality.

I know those meetings are unfair and often ridiculous, I always tried to be fair when I was in charge of them. But I feel bad for these girls who look to elders for help and then they are taken advantage of.

So I decided to testify. He said he did visit a sister but there was nothing to it. He said the notes were forged. My testimony was that he had bragged to me a couple of years ago that he had touched a girl. I counseled him with another elder, but now recently I heard he is doing it again, and also denying it. So I decided to testify to get him to stop hurting people. During the meeting, he said he did touch the girl, but it was "over her underwear." So the presiding elder said that men and women are like watches, if you touch the watch it is not that sinful, but if you try to wind it up, that is the sin. That is porneia. He explained to us that he learned that at Kingdom Ministry School.

I was then dismissed, since I was only a witness to his earlier confession, I do not know the outcome. I saw one of the girls outside, and I told her she can sue, but another elder was standing right there and he said, "Well, we don't want to bring reproach on Jehovah's name."

If this sounds pretty ridiculous to all of you, thats because it is. I sent an email to the sisters' mother later, telling her to sue because this person is an elder, but she is reluctant. Reproach on Jehovah's name.

BF

5

Does anyone have any idea what to do?

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

a sister called me last night very upset.

she knows that my family is avoiding me because of my questions and "doubts' about the organiation.

but we are still sort of friends.

BonaFide

Aude, you have a good memory. It's just sad because she can see all this hypocrisy, but she won't even consider that the Organization may be not all it says it is.

BF