wantingtruth

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Posts by wantingtruth

• 
  24

  The Kingdom of God - when in Heaven ? -- according to Jesus

  by wantingtruth in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  john said "...the truth came through jesus christ" ?

  --------the kingdom of god---------- .

  "the kingdom of god is near.

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  wantingtruth

  Y Y 2 , regarding the "latter days" and God's people

  I invite you to read some words here
• 
  24

  The Kingdom of God - when in Heaven ? -- according to Jesus

  by wantingtruth in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  john said "...the truth came through jesus christ" ?

  --------the kingdom of god---------- .

  "the kingdom of god is near.

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  wantingtruth

  Yadda yadda , thank you for this question - is a very good question

  as it was told , in 33AD Jesus started using his "all power" in Heaven

  all prophecies , all the rest of the Bible regarding His "coming" are pointing to the action of starting to reign over earth , or "reigning in the midst of his enemies"

  so, not only Matthew 24 and 25 , but also all Revelation are pointing to events and actions in wich God's people and His saints are involved in , a little before and during the Kingdom's installation on earth,

  as apostle Paul said

  Romans 9

  28 for the Lord will execute his word upon the earth, finishing it and cutting it short.

  in fact , what is the second coming of Jesus ? --- it means exactly "the coming" on earth of the heavenly kingdom (or the extension of his ruling and using 'all authority" ) , as we were taught in the prayer "Let your kingdom come , let your will be done as in heavens , so on earth."

  wantingtruth
• 
  24

  The Kingdom of God - when in Heaven ? -- according to Jesus

  by wantingtruth in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  john said "...the truth came through jesus christ" ?

  --------the kingdom of god---------- .

  "the kingdom of god is near.

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  wantingtruth

  In order for us to understand the weight of Jesus words , which words were contradicted by WTS

  (and we were educated according to wts doctrines )

  it is wery important for us to find the place decided by God for the "teaching of Christ"

  The "teaching of Christ " - what is it , and why it is so important ?
  
  2 John 1:
  9. "Anyone who runs ahead and does not continue in the teaching of Christ does not have God;
  whoever continues in the teaching has both the Father and the Son."
  
  God's spirit lead us to see the importance given by Jehovah Himself to Christ's teaching !
  
  But first , what is this teaching ?
  
  -- Jesus answered to us :
  John 7
  16. Jesus answered, " My teaching is not my own. It comes from him who sent me ."
  
  Again we see , apostle John wrote leaded by spirit (John 1 )
  17. "For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ. "
  
  Jesus Himself said regarding to all His Father's word (including the written word in the O. T. ) :
  John 17:
  17. "Sanctify them by the truth; your word is truth . "
  
  The question is : if God's word in O.T. is truth , why ap. John said "...the truth came through Jesus Christ" ?
  
  As we can see , the knowledge/teaching God has sent through His Son has priority, or has a special importance !
  
  Not Jesus , nor ap. John decided that , but Jehovah Himself !
  
  Let us hear His voice :
  Matthew 17 :
  5."While he was still speaking, a bright cloud enveloped them, and a voice from the cloud said,
  "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased. Listen to him!"
  
  
  Now , what is to be understood through the expression "teaching of Christ" (only a part of what He preached)? Let Him answer to us :
  Mathew 28 :
  20. " and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." Matt.28.

  Apostle Paul agrees with this priority/importance given by Jehovah to the teaching of Christ:
  Hebrews 1 :
  1. "In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways,
  2. but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe..... ."
  
  also Hebrews 12 :
  24. to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
  
  25. See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven ? "
  
  It has been prophesied that in the "latter days" there will be a certain action inside/within God's people :
  Daniel 8 :
  10. It grew until it reached the host of the heavens, and it threw some of the starry host down to the earth and trampled on them.
  11. It set itself up to be as great as the Prince of the host; it took away the daily sacrifice from him, and the place of his sanctuary was brought low.
  12. Because of rebellion, the host of the saints and the daily sacrifice were given over to it. It prospered in everything it did, and truth was thrown to the ground.
  
  13.Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, "How long will it take for the vision to be fulfilled—the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, and the surrender of the sanctuary and of the host that will be trampled underfoot?"
  
  14 He said to me, "It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated."
  
  As we can see ,the truth is thrown down during the 2300 evenings and mornings. God's promise is , "then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated."
  
  The action of reconsacrating takes place when Jesus is present at the Temple !
  
  When Jesus begins his action , He finds "the truth"-the correct understanding of His teaching-- down !
  
  So He have to re-put His teaching to the place decided by Jehovah Himself !
  
  It is written at Acts 3 :
  21."He must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything, as he promised long ago through his holy prophets."
  
  When Jesus starts his second presence , He does like that :
  Revelation 3 :
  20. "Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me."
  
  Also in Luke 12 :
  37. Blessed are those servants, whom the lord when he cometh shall find watching:
  verily I say unto you, that he shall gird himself, and make them sit down to meat, and shall come and serve them.
  
  What do you think He will serve at the table to those watching when He comes ?
  
  -- Exactly the correct understanding of "the teaching of Christ" !

  ................................................................................................................................................................

  --------THE KINGDOM OF GOD----------
  
  Jesus preached this Kingdom as it follows:
  Matthew 4 :
  17. From that time on Jesus began to preach, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near."
  
  Mark 1:
  15. "The time has come," he said.
  "The kingdom of God is near. Repent and believe the good news!"
  
  WHAT is God's Kingdom ?
  
  According to Jesus words
  Matthew 6 :
  10. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done , as in heaven, so on earth.
  
  .. .we see that His Kingdom means the state where His will is done !
  
  And surely it implies a certain order made by God .
  
  This "order" means a certain structure of authority between God's heavenly and earthly creatures, of course , made by God, or according to His will !
  
  So, Jesus named this kingdom as being
  -- OF GOD and
  -- OF HEAVEN
  
  What means that ?
  Of course, it means
  -- this kingdom belongs to God (YHWH ), it originates from HIM !
  -- its place of birth is in Heaven , there is its capital city of residence , from there it will be extended all over the God's creations .
  
  That means , the Kingdom of Heaven CAN EXIST IN HEAVEN even not being come yet on earth.
  
  But what the "Heaven" is ?
  
  People often would think it is all the space from where human eye cannot see further.
  Well , let us see a scripture :
  Psalm 33 :
  13. From heaven the LORD looks down
  and sees all mankind;
  14. from his dwelling place he watches
  all who live on earth-
  
  Job 1 :
  6. One day the angels came to present themselves
  before the LORD , and Satan also came with them.
  
  
  So , when the Kingdom of God and of Heaven gets start , it start in Heaven, where is God's "dwelling place" , and "before the Lord" where sometime the angels present themselves....
  
  Now let us see Jesus teaching about this kingdom...:
  
  -- "the Kingdom of Heaven is near"... means it was THEN near , when Jesus was on earth !
  
  --(Matt.12:28 ) : But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.
  
  ... that means God's kingdom WAS ACTIVE in Heaven at the moment when Jesus was speaking/ when He was on earth !
  
  YES , when Jesus WAS on earth the Kingdom WAS active in Heaven , even it was not fully installed ": the future King was on earth , not raised at God's right side yet !
  
  John 18:
  37. "You are a king, then!" said Pilate.
  Jesus answered, "You are right in saying I am a king .
  
  ...Jesus was King then !
  
  Furthermore Jesus taught his followers how to pray the Father
  Matthew 6:
  10. Thy kingdom come.
  Thy will be done, as in heaven, so on earth.
  
  IF we believe that Jesus words are the truth ,
  then we believe that He taught us that
  as the Kingdom was already on Heaven,
  and God's will was done there,
  our prayer(and desire also) to be :.."let (this God's order and state where His will is done) come on earth"
  
  surely Jesus did not say "Thy will be done ..on earth ..as it will be done in Heaven some time in the future.."

  Now we can correctly understand what Jesus meant when He said
  Matthew 16 :
  28. Truly I tell you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in (into) His kingdom.
  
  The Son of Man was seen "coming" into His Kingdom at Pentecosta , when the earth / his followers on earth / received the confirmation from the Holy Spirit that He has been exalted and enthroned - in full power in Heaven - !
  
  BUT WHAT ABOUT THE DEVIL AND HIS ANGELS ??
  WHEN WHERE THEY THROWN OUT OF HEAVEN ??
  
  --(John 12:31) "Now is the time for judgment on this world;
  now the prince of this world will be driven out....
  
  ... where out ? literally stick on earth ?
  -- NOT ! but "driven out from "God's dwelling place", out from "before the Lord" where they could go before Jesus came on earth !
  
  --( Luke 10:18 ) He replied, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
  
  -- apostle John said regarding Satan using past tense :
  ...( Rev 9:1 ) "The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth."
  
  WHILE Jesus was on earth He was spiritually fighting against Satan , but the very moment of overcoming him was at the moment of His death !
  -- a short time before His martirio , Jesus said (John 16:33)
  "...I have overcome the world." -- inclusive its god !
  
  Apostle Paul agrees with that Colossians 2:15:
  "And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross."
  
  So it is absolutely sure ,
  The Kingdom of God and of Heaven get started in HEAVEN at that time when Jesus accomplished his service on earth , and immediate after his resurrection He received all power !
  
  Jesus said ( Matthew 28 )
  18. Then Jesus came to them and said,
  "All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me."
  What could retain Jesus from using all authority
  starting with that time ?
  -- Nothing could retain Jesus from using this authority in Heaven !
  
  BUT as concerns earth , YES , something retained Him !
  IT was Father's will - as prophetically exprimed in Psalm 110
  1. The LORD says to my Lord: ( at His enthronement )
  "Sit at my right hand
  until I make your enemies
  a footstool for your feet. "
  
  Well , but WHY this scripture is to be applied only concerning the earth , and not also for Heaven ?
  -- IT IS because we believe Jesus' teaching !
  -- HE taught us that His enemies were already thrown out of "Heaven" at the moment of His exalting at the right side of the Glory
  
  
  Well , at Pentecosta ,the Holy Spirit enlightened the first christians to understand ..(Acts 2 )as Peter said :
  
  32. God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all witnesses of the fact.
  33. Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear.
  34. For David did not ascend to heaven, and yet he said,
  "'The Lord said to my Lord:
  "Sit at my right hand
  35. until I make your enemies
  a footstool for your feet."
  
  36. "Therefore let all Israel be assured of this:
  God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ. "
  
  Well , here the word "KING" did not appear , but Jesus being "exalted to the right hand of God" and using "all authority in Heaven" , IT MEANS HE WAS KING IN HEAVEN !....as He said it to Pilat...
  
  BUT REGARDING EARTH ??
  
  Jesus said he received also "all power on earth".
  So , was it something who retained Christ from using His "all power" on earth ?
  -- YES ! It was YHWH' will , exprimed prophetically in Psalm 110:1 and correctly quoted and understood by apostle Peter at Pentecosta !
  ..........................................................................................................
  
  Now , we are able to understand correctly God's words in Psalm 110:1,2
  1. The LORD says to my Lord:
  "Sit at my right hand
  until I make your enemies
  a footstool for your feet."
  
  2. The LORD will extend your mighty scepter from Zion;
  you will rule in the midst of your enemies.
  
  God said to Jesus "sit at my right hand" that is
  --to sit on throne and to use/exercise "all power recently received" IN THE HEAVEN , ruling as KING ,
  --BUT to wait regarding the earth " until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet." !
  How so ?
  
  As Jesus taught us already , in Heaven were not enemy at His exalting moment , they were OUT OF HEAVEN !
  OUT of the place were the Kingdom was ruling !
  
  BUT WHERE were they ?

  --ON EARTH -- the visible enemies ,
  -- and "in heavenly realms" the invisible ones , as ap.Paul said in Ephesians 6 :
  12. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities,
  against the powers of this dark world and against the
  spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.
  
  Well, are not this "heavenly realms" "the Heaven" where the Kingdom is ?
  NOT !
  As I said , THE HEAVEN where God's Kingdom is ruling , is "before the Lord" and Devil with his followers are somewhere FAR AWAY (beyond) FROM THAT PLACE !
  
  Now we see that the following God's words "until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet."
  ... referes to the time and situation when YHWH will give both the permission and the commandment to His King to START REIGNING OVER THE EARTH , where the enemies are now !
  
  That action of His starting reigning over earth is prophetically shown by the words "Christ returning" or "Christ's (second)coming".
  
  These knowledges debated here are necessaries for further understanding of other prophetical passages and prophecies which are to happen on earth , as the Revelation 12 for instance .
  
  Because Christ started ruling in Heaven immediately after his ressurection , according to the"teaching of Christ", there is no place for such interpretation which leads to 1874 or 1914 or other years as the time for Christ starting to rule in Heaven.
  
  with great respect for Jehovah, and His enthroned King , Jesus Christ ,
  
  wantingtruth .
• 
  3

  The Great Tree - 7 Times of Daniel = 1914?

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the 7 times of daniel = jesus returning invisibly in 1914 and being enthroned in heaven?.

  daniel 4:23-33 (new world translation):.

  23 and because the king beheld a watcher, even a holy one, coming down from the heavens, who was also saying: chop the tree down, and ruin it.

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  wantingtruth

  the correct interpretation of a prophecy must be based on Jesus' testimony , on Jesus teaching .

  and Jesus teached that the Kingdom was set in Heavens at the time of His first coming (clik here and read posts 28,30 )

  the purpose of His second coming remained to be ... the "bringing" on earth (or its extension over the earth ) of this Heavenly Kingdom

  so, the interpretation given by society to Daniel 6 is not based on Christ teaching and not from God
• 
  38

  Are you UNDERSTANDING towards Second, Third, and even Fourth-generation Witnesses on this forum?

  by BonaFide in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do you all realize how tough it is for a second-generation witness?

  what about a third-generation witness?

  fourth?.

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  wantingtruth

  BF , please receive a few words from me (not very "english" words )

  I read your first post...

  what happens now , is from Jehovah"s hand !

  Jehovah doesn't require to his believers to quit worshiping Him ! He requires to do it according to the truth !

  and the "truth" He delivered through His Son . It is the love for truth that may "educate" an long-time worshiper of Jehovah what to do in the present circumstances.

  as purplesofa said , the aim may not be to leave the wt with any price , but should be to obey Jehovah with all our power... and doing that , surely, a fight is aproaching at horizont....

  the real problem teached specially by Bible prophecyes is that the wt org. is not the "Kingdom of God"

  the judgement started at God's House in autumn 2005 and it is going for 10 years , and Jesus command for us is to "seek God's Kingdom"...

  the present living generation have to leave this wt organisation in order to enter in God's Kingdom( because the wt is ready for distruction by Jehovah Himself)

  well, the first ones entered on kingdom will have some priviledges , but Jehovah does not forget his sheep (sincere ones as you who cannot live without faithfull relatives in ) and immediately after spring 2012 He will proceed to make free them as He made free his people back in Egypt ... see Micah 7:15.( tell to your relatives this verse and ask them what do they think that means ? )

  the true knowledge of God's word together with your own fath in it may act as comfort and as a preparation for the future battle....

  let you be interested in God's word as Jesus teached , and believe his word

  the actions going on with this org. and its members represent Jehovah's judgement over/on/with his people which include destroing the "weeds" and their wt organisation and slavation of those who "tremble at his Word"

  wantingtruth
• 
  2

  Jehovah's Disloyal Organization?

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it needs to be said: the watchtower society is teaching its most involved adherents a powerful lesson in disloyalty.

  it should be no surprize that the watchtower endlessly prates on about loyalty.

  what has changed however, is the sudden sacrifice of bethelites and others to come in the pursuit of its greedy survival.

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  wantingtruth

  Not to wonder that they will pay a heavy price !

  in fact , no word in Bible that God has had to "provide" his faithfull with an ....earthly organisation...never found that in Bible...

  it were the ambitious one from within his people who "invented" a "earthly organisation" with the purpose that it will became His Kingdom on earth !

  But the bible clearly says:

  Psalm 127

  1 Except Jehovah build the house, They labor in vain that build it: Except Jehovah keep the city, The watchman waketh but in vain.

  The men who built this organisation were manifesting the spirit of those who started to build Babel

  Genesis 11

  4 And they said, Come, let us build us a city, and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven, and let us make us a name; lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.

  furthermore, they wanted to bring to themselves "all peoples and all nations" as shown here

  Habakkuk 1

  6 For, lo, I raise up the Chaldeans, that bitter and hasty nation, that march through the breadth of the earth, to possess dwelling-places that are not theirs.

  10 Yea, he scoffeth at kings, and princes are a derision unto him; he derideth every stronghold; for he heapeth up dust, and taketh it. ....................

  15 He taketh up all of them with the angle, he catcheth them in his net, and gathereth them in his drag: therefore he rejoiceth and is glad.

  16 Therefore he sacrificeth unto his net, and burneth incense unto his drag; because by them his portion is fat, and his food plenteous.

  17 Shall he therefore empty his net, and spare not to slay the nations continually?

  Habakkuk 2

  5 Yea, moreover, wine is treacherous, a haughty man ( the FDS ), that keepeth not at home; who enlargeth his desire as Sheol, and he is as death, and cannot be satisfied, but gathereth unto him all nations, and heapeth unto him all peoples.

  6 Shall not all these take up a parable against him, and a taunting proverb against him, and say, Woe to him that increaseth that which is not his! how long? and that ladeth himself with pledges!

  7 Shall they not rise up suddenly that shall bite thee, and awake that shall vex thee, and thou shalt be for booty unto them?

  8 Because thou hast plundered many nations, all the remnant of the peoples shall plunder thee, because of men's blood, and for the violence done to the land, to the city and to all that dwell therein.

  12 Woe to him that buildeth a town with blood, and establisheth a city by iniquity!

  In the above quotation we see that the makers of this org. together with all who idolatrise it will have an shamefull end from Jehovah's hand !

  But God's worshippers are invited by Jesus to seek first the Kingdom of God, or of Heavens and its righteousness / Matt.6:33.

  a correct knowledge regarding God's Kingdom in Heaven is required , also , in order to understand how this Kingdom will come on earth

  see here a few words about when started the Kingdom in Heaven , as Jesus teached , read the posts 28 and 30

  wantingtruth
• 
  9

  When POLITICAL ELEMENT TURNS ON RELIGION

  by cameo-d in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  will this perhaps only "appear" as destruction of religion?.

  could it be that religion will simply go through a reformation?.

  hasn't the political and religious element always been bedfellows?.

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  wantingtruth

  oh, oh, "sunrising" ,

  it is not that your "message" come from "north" ? ... Daniel 11:44.

  by the way , I have read something similar with your message here

  you are welcome , "sunrising" !

  wantingtruth
• 
  26

  What a Satanic bunch we are.

  by Mickey mouse in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  today's watchtower was nice.

  under the heading:.

  satan - a defiant adversary and apostate.

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  wantingtruth

  Quote the AH :

  "Why are the GB members so anxiously nervous about themselves and their teachings, they start a members only WT. as one example and there are many others.

  The simple answer to this is they are now aware of all the information about them on the NET. information that they cant control, they cant disfellowship the inter-net.

  It was easy before when they came across opposers they would simply DF them or demonetize with a label to keep them away from the flock,

  now the inter-net appears with a mountain of evidence against them and they cant do a dam thing about it.

  Its no wonder they are getting more cultish and try put up a bigger wall up and around themselves."

  ==========================================

  friends , I think you know what is that.... it is war , a "spiritual war"

  the WT organisation is the last fortress of Satan on earth (before his being caught and bound ) in his fight against the Kingdom of Christ !

  The WT leaders/GB and others are represented in prophecy by Pharaoh of Egypt , who make his heart hardened when he met God's message

  in our days God facilitates the "revelation" of the hidden things and wrongdoings of the Man of Lawlessness/Pharaoh asking him to let the sheep free to worship Him as Jesus taught them, "with spirit and with truth" ,

  but he , the GB is more and more hardening his hearth , untill he will meet God's judgement and annihilation

  but God will proceed to release his sheep from slavery , as it is written in Micah 7:15.

  you may read here

  and here
• 
  426

  One of the Governing Body had a stroke yesterday

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  on may 19th, theodore jaracz had a stroke.

  he's in very serious condition in the hospital.. that's all the information i have for now.. barb.

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  wantingtruth

  it seems you are overstrung...waiting for news..

  take a break ... and listen to
• 
  29

  Is Being Disfellowshipped or Disassociated All That Bad?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  most jws dread the thought of never being talked to again by a fellow "brother" or "sister".

  the thought of being shunned by your flesh and blood keeps many witnesses in the religion.. is df'ing or dissasociation all that terrible?

  ?.

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  wantingtruth

  megaflower said:

  " I DA myself and would do it again. Iam glad I took a stand. I did it for me,it gave me peace of mind."

  ###############

  I fully agree with that !