Posts by allelsefails

9

Was a GB memeber deleted for molestation?

by Albert Einstein in

some time ago, i read on the internet, that in late 70s there was a gb member (his name should be leo greenslee) who was accused of molestation of a little boy - son of a witness family.

after this was revealed, he was supposed to be removed from bethel to serve as a special pioneer out of new york and have died in 80s.. have you heard about it?.

albert.

allelsefails

Yep. Interesting research. Hard to prove exactly what happened. I believe his name is "Greenlees". just google "jehovah" "greenlees" and you'll get all the info you want. The young boy he molested has done interviews. There was also a GB member named Ewart Chitty who was removed. Apparently for being homosexual. And of course the Great Apostate - Evil Slave - Ray Franz. Good thing Jesus has total control of the congregation right? They are like stars in his hand.....LOL

421

70 years = 607?

by allelsefails in

70 years of captivity?.

i myself have always believed that when archaeology disagreed with the bible the bible must be right.

that is how i dismissed the idea that jerusalem was destroyed in 586/587 bce.

allelsefails

I left out something important. The only reason 607 exists inJW history is so that the "7 times" prophecy of Daniel can bring you forwrd to 1914. That is the real point. "7 times" has nothing scripturally to do with the gentile times or time of the end.

421

70 years = 607?

by allelsefails in

70 years of captivity?.

i myself have always believed that when archaeology disagreed with the bible the bible must be right.

that is how i dismissed the idea that jerusalem was destroyed in 586/587 bce.

allelsefails

70 years of captivity?

I myself have always believed that when archaeology disagreed with the Bible the Bible must be right. That is how I dismissed the idea that Jerusalem was destroyed in 586/587 BCE. Doesn’t the bible say that the Israelites were to spend 70 years of captivity? So when you start at the destruction of Babylon in 539 BCE – A proven date by WTS standards – this puts Jerusalem’s destruction at 609 BCE. But it took them a yearand ahalf to walk home so 607.

Is there a basis for 70 years of captivity or desolation? I understand the logical thought that “70 years” applied to the complete removal of people from Jerusalem. However the bible itself seams unclear on this point. Zechariah 1:12 indicates a period of 70 years tied to the destruction of the temple (586-516 – according to secular history). Jeremiah 25:11 shows a 70 year period associated with Babylon’s rulership over “these lands” which would include the first conquering of the region by the Babylonians (609 – 539 – according to some scholars).

It doesn’t really matter when the 70 years begins for JW prophecy. Here is the real question: Why do they think Daniel’s “seven times” prophecy has a fulfillment beyond Nebuchadnezzer’s seven years of insanity? I can find no evidence of this in scripture. It seems to me to be a miraculous prophecy that took place exactly as Jehovah prophesied thru Daniel. This renders the whole 607 – 586 debate moot. Why add to it by using it to try to determine the length of the “gentile times”?

Love to hear your thoughts.

11

607--1914 chronology origin and modifications summarised

by jeandeau in

i am interested in summarising how rutherford and the wts originally set forth the 607 (606) -1914 chronology.

this is hidden from witnesses today and only a sanitized "trimmed for easy consumption" version is taught to avoid "confusing" the faithful.

for thirty years the questions ate a larger and larger hole in my gut as a jw as it became more evident that the full truth was not being revealed to us for ulterior motives.

allelsefails

This is hard. Rutherford did not put the 606 - 1914 date out there - Russell did. At one time archeaology was convinced that Babylon was destroyed in 536 BC. That puts the destuction of Jerusalem at 606 BCE (70 years of captivity). The 1914 date is really based on measurements of the Great Pyramid. Russell was one the foremoste pyramidologists and zionists of his day. (Interesting to google). He used the 7 times of Daniel to back up the pyramid's prophecy of "the gentile times". That is 2,520 days/years from 606. That is 1914 (if you don't know what you're talking about - 0 year). The question no one could answer is this: "Why do JWs think Daniel’s “seven times” prophecy has a fulfillment beyond Nebuchadnezzer’s seven years of insanity?" This is a prophecy that Daniel gave about the King that miraculously came true. Why add to the scriptures to make it about the "Gentile Times"? I do have a copy of "Studies in the scriptures" if you would like any further info I could research it. Allelsefails - (like if all else fails try something that makes sense)

46

A LOOK INSIDE BETHEL LIFE, THE ORGANIZATION BEHIND THE NAME

by Bethelite Elder in

when i first came to bethel, the going reassurance was that if you stayed more than 5 years, you would be considered permanent.

many of the bethelites bought into the idea and stayed many years.

however, a few years back they had a test of faith.

allelsefails

Welcome to the forum. I'm pretty new here. I never went to Bethel, but the way ex-fulltimers are treated is disgraceful. I hope you will post your whole story and let us know you. Just ask if you have questions about how to use the site and see others posts/stories. All my Christian love to you. Allelesefails (Like when all else fails try something that makes sense!)

14

How many TOTAL members are here on JWN?

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

am i missing something?

maybe i am not looking in the right spot, but i would like to know how many members are on here.. am i allowed to ask for the amount of"active" members?

ha ha.. i would like to know though.. anyone?.

allelsefails

I think it depends on who has posted regularly for the last 6 months. If they haven't posted in 6 months then they are inactive. Don't even know who they are. Your irregular posts need some encouragement to keep posting, obviously yhey need some encouragement to keep posting "regularly". Sorry - I was Secretary for a while.

24

An elder I know was accepted to be an International Delegate -$9,000 for 2 people!

by BonaFide in

jw
friends

he is an elder, and he and his wife were "accepted" to go to south africa.

including airfare, hotel, food, general tours, it comes to $9,000.. have any of you experienced this or seen this before?

i was out of the country for some years, so i haven't kept up with prices of being a delegate.. so, if they were to go without the "international delegate" designation, would it still be $9000?.

allelsefails

Both my sons are going to go as "delegates" to international conventions. I loaned one of my sons the money to go $2,500 for 2 people - Going to Germany. But that is just airfare and hotel (hope they don't need to eat). They do not stay with somebody locally. They are trying to sell one of their cars to pay me back. I know I'm enalbling them, but if it makes them happy.... I love my kids unconditionally, if they want to be Jwitnesses, mormons, moonies, Catholics (ahhhh) I love them just the same. What's it to me? I don't believe in anything like that anymore. I did know someone who went to an ineternational convention w/o being "a delegate". If you show up and go they will let you in. It is like any other convention - no security. MOst of the cost is in the airfare - just like any vacation. Allelsefails

14

Did you come here on JWD/JWN because of congregation injustice?

by asilentone in

i did, but i have never told my story, i could not tell you my story here because it would be too revealing as to who i am.

if i did not experience like what i have experienced, i would probably avoid those damn apostate sites like this site!

well, i think it is a blessing for me to join this site because i have learned alot!

allelsefails

I have experienced a lot of injustice, but that is not what sent me here. I always thought "these are imperfect men, Ishouldn't be mad at Jehovah". It was when I examined doctrine that I went running. You know - actually read and studied the bible all on my own. This will probably give me away to any spies, but I don't care: A married elder in my cong wrote pornographic e-mails to a married sister telling her what he wanted to do to her (very explicit) We agreed as a BOE to remove him, but when the CO talked to us a few weeks later he suggested we be lenient (he never read what was written). And everyone immediately changed their vote (except me). The CO said to me "Is there anything we could help you with to make this unanimous?" I said no one who read the things he wrote could think he was qualified. Of course no one cared about my scriptural objection just the COs statement. A few years later this same elder hit on my wife and offered to run away with her when she left me. Then he told my sister (who is a bit "busty" - I admit uncomfortably) that if she was too warm in the hall she should take her shirt off! Again I recommended his removal and the other elders decided there was a problem with me. I didn't act fast enough. The CO (different one) did finally recommend his removal after my wife and sister made a stink. That's enough for now, but I hope you know your not alone. Injustice is built into any legalistic system, just like the Pharisees of Jesus' day. LOVE is the identifier of God's people. Not politics and legalistic Garbage. The JWs got 1 thing right: Religion is a anare and a racket.

13

Need help: JW friend links every NT teaching to 144,000 only

by whyizit in

you know what i mean: every time she reads a passage in the nt, she instantly applies it to the 144,000 chosen anointed ones.

even though there is absolutely no reason whatsoever to make that connection.

i have even asked how her gurus have made that connection biblically.

allelsefails

For me the most compelling response I have used is to center on the 1918-1919 "selection" of the FDS. Ask her to show you what teaching unique to JWs was "proper food" being dispensed in 1918. I use 9 points all central doctrinal things.

1 The "Last Days" started in 1799 and the 1800’s were the worst time period of all history

2 That Jesus had begun ruling in 1874

3 That the end was going to come in 1925

4 That Jesus should be prayed to and worshipped as well as Jehovah

5 That the Great Crowd were a heavenly class

6 That birthdays and Christmas were acceptable celebrations and displaying the flag was acceptable

7 Society used symbols and ideas from pyramidology and astrology especially in support of 1914

8 Strong Zionist support for a new nation of Israel in fulfilment of Bible prophecy

9 That the Faithful and Discreet Slave was not the anointed, but rather Pastor Russell

It would be way too long to put all the WT pub. quotes with each point, but I do have a word doc (7 pages) with 2-5 quotes for every above mentioned point. The thing I like about this approach is that no one can say it is apostate to quote Russell and Rutherford - even though they would both be apostates if they were around today. These quotes require no explanation they are up-front blatantly wrong according to JWs today. So If Jesus did not select them in 1918 then they have not been appointed over all his belongings and have no real authority. I find it easier to get someone to listen if you don't attack the individuals in the GB, but just undermine their claim to authority. Some will listen, most cannot.

PM me if anyone would like to be sent a copy of my research. Like I said it is just WT quotes, nothing original (most plagerized), but I would love to share.

You can't refute the idea of applying NT scrips to 144k unless the GBs authority is in question.

Thanks for your post. "Good luck " on helping your friend (Am I allowed to say that now?).

47

New Guidelines for this Forum - Please take notes

by BonaFide in

we are happy to inform you of some rule changes on this forum.

we do not want to give the impression they are rules, so we will use the term guidelines.

at present, some are using this forum to express their own opinion.

allelsefails

OOps I just got a call about my last post, but I might be OK because my dad is a long-time poster.