sd-7

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Posts by sd-7

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  20

  Conversation with 4 elders: A study in smear tactics.

  by problemaddict in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  bucket shop bill has a thread in which they are "counseled" for something, that ends up not even being true.

  instead of the elder who made the accusation apologizing to them, they are made to feel like they should appreciate his overexuberence.. it struck me that this is a common tactic.

  here is a story of my own.

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  sd-7

  Now that is a classic moment. Thank you for sharing this. Everybody needs to read this thread.

  --sd-7
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  23

  How would you summarize the basic message of the Watchtower versus the Bible?

  by Fernando in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  for me personally:.

  watchtower - don't sin, don't question, don't think, don't reason, don't leave, or god will kill you in hell the big a.. bible - all dysfunction aka the "bad news" has been legally defeated by the "good news".. (i believe we are therefore free to begin naturally and progressively transitioning from a primitive type-0 civilisation if and when we choose to and when consensus reaches critical mass.

  we will become a more advanced type-1 civilisation in the next 100 years according to michio kaku in "physics of the future".).

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  sd-7

  Watchtower--Follow the ones Jesus appointed in 1919, we're the only ones who preach and correctly understand the Bible, obey or die

  Bible--Follow Jesus, holy spirit helps you understand the Bible, anyone who preaches another gospel (like one involving Jesus returning in 1914) is accursed, obey or die

  --sd-7
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  44

  That's it......

  by whathehadas in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  this might be my last post.

  i've had quite a few things on my mind over the past few years, mainly my belief in god.

  i've tried to move on from the jw past but that's really being foolish.

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  sd-7

  I've struggled with the concept of finding a new 'normal' myself, bro. It took a lot of reading, a LOT of reading, to really get me to find a little more peace and perspective on my situation. It was therapy that probably got my mind thinking enough about myself that I could ask the questions I needed, but most of that was before I woke up, believe it or not. After, a lot of that was good friends I could trust. People who'd suffered and knew what it was to be part of this cult and what it does to you. Fact is, even though I'm not on here as much, these guys, you guys, are as close as I've gotten to having a new set of family and friends to fill the void.

  Maybe on some level, that's a shame. I wouldn't wish that on you, because there's a lot you probably have to offer to others who haven't had this kind of experience. I think a big part of finding normalcy is restoring your own self-image. Being able to look in the mirror and see someone more than just an ex-cult member or the pain or damage that caused. The more you question everything and look for answers, the easier it'll become to separate yourself from the cult and its mindset. I'd recommend some time with philosophy and science and even theological studies of Christianity if that floats your boat. Any big question you might have--it could be good to find a new set of answers, you know?

  It is tough. I, too, felt the pain with the news about Robin Williams. I can understand wanting to call it quits, because I've been in that place before. I get mad at myself for my mistakes and for things I'd still like to do differently in life as it is now. But it takes patience to find your way after something so earth-shattering happens. But you can find your way.

  As time passes, you'll get more in touch with your authentic self and be able to figure out what it is you want to do and be from where you are now. Don't compare yourself to people who have never been in a cult--or even people who have been in a cult. You're an individual and it's not a race. You have to fill your life with something other than 'I was in a cult'. That'll look you in the face each day most likely. I just saw a pair of guys wearing JW.org badges this morning. It won't go away, but it will get better. It may ebb and flow from time to time as something triggers the old pain, but you can manage that with time and experience.

  I wish there were easy answers I could give, but I'm not really the guy I'd point to as an example of how to get out of a cult successfully. I'm sure there are better folks here who have already said things you'll find more useful. I'm not in your neck of the woods, but I wouldn't mind it if you wrote me or what have you. I'm no jamiebowers, but...maybe I can be of some help.

  --sd-7
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  63

  pros and cons of anti depessants?

  by Crazyguy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  obviously i'm having ex cult issues, family still in and a wife that's all kokoo for cocopuffs as well as our marriage isn't good.

  i would like to leave her, she has never been the kind of wife i wanted.

  anyway the stress is getting to be to much, thinking about things all the time and its effecting my work as well as otherthings.

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  sd-7

  Well, I can only speak on my own experience. I was on Zoloft for maybe less than a year. The first thing you notice is this sense that certain parts of your brain have been turned down. You feel a bit detached from everything. A little like a dream state of sorts.

  The major side effect for me was that I had to make sure I was at home, ready to go to bed, because as soon as I took them, I was out cold for the rest of the night. And don't dare wake up until the morning either--it felt like an electrical storm was frying my brain when I did that once. Definitely do not take that stuff if you're going to be doing any driving or anything else that requires you to be alert after you take it.

  The other thing is that they do make you dehydrated, so it's best to drink a lot of water.

  But that's just my experience with Zoloft. I eventually just quit them cold turkey because I needed to stay alert on the road late at night, plus I couldn't afford to pay for them anymore. My head was buzzing like crazy a couple of days later, but I got through it with no trouble beyond that and never became dependent on them.

  I'd say, divorce is nothing a good comic book and a trip to the movies can't cure. But then, I've never been divorced, so I wouldn't know.

  --sd-7
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  52

  how to survive a three day assembly?

  by purrpurr in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  hi i have to go to one of these soon.

  i find it difficult enough to sit through a meeting knowing what i now know.

  how to survive a whole three days???!!!

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  sd-7

  From my own experience, last year when I went I just brought my iPod. I put on big blue Skullcandy headphones and the convention program became the irritating background to a seemingly endless collection of music. I brought my spiral notebook to write down whatever I was thinking, and that was that. If you need to keep up appearances, the smaller the iPod and earphones, the better, so as not to make it appear that you're listening to music and not the program itself.

  Or you could just not go. Combine 3 parts Pepsi with 1 part milk, plus chunks of bread or something, and you have some fake vomit you can pour into the toilet as proof that you're sick. Might want to add something with a bad smell to create a convincing vomit odor, and you're all set!

  --sd-7
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  55

  More JW bragging about the Landover, MD. convention. Please have barf bag at the ready before reading

  by AndDontCallMeShirley in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the following e-mail is circulating among jws about the international convention at fedex stadium in landover, md.

  note the all-too-familiar jw claims: everything they do (including the simple act of parking cars) is proof of jehovah'stm blessing, and everything wt did at the convention was the fastest, greatest, best ever.

  oh, and the never-fails-to-get-mentioned alleged 'persecution'/resistance from some unnamed authority who tried to get in watchtower's way and hamper the effort...but jws prevailed anyway (as always):.

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  sd-7

  reports are that it bought in $17,000,000 in revenue to the local area. I dont know the source of the reports though. Lol

  Gee, washington.org--DC's tourism site, was expecting $41 million to be brought into the area. Ah, well...

  Anyway, so people really all just took the Beltway, even people who know the area well enough to take Landover Road? That was just plain stupid. They could have at least suggested different routes to different congregations so they're not all trying to take the same Beltway exit.

  Maybe I should relate the experience related to me by a sister, as a demonstration of Jehovah's loving care. Apparently, her son, a 2-year-old, was left with one of her friends while she went to visit her mom elsewhere in the stadium, and he just wandered off. When she got back to her seat, her son was gone! She frantically informed an attendant, and the well-organized brothers quickly located her son and returned him only to her, and no one else. We can only imagine what would have happened had this small child wandered off at a worldly sporting event! Thankfully, he was returned unharmed, and once again, Jehovah's loving concern even for the little ones was shown. [applause]

  But it's always interesting to see how JWs always think that everything they do is done better than the outside world does the same thing. It's largely because they don't bother to do any kind of actual comparison, nor would they need to, since an appeal to superiority/authority is enough to convince the target audience anyway.

  --sd-7
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  21

  Thoughts on the new 'God's Kingdom Rules!' book

  by sd-7 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was feeling a little melancholy earlier this week and i decided to start reading wt literature again, just to see what was new and improved.

  and it seems that, as has consistently been the case, the more i read of the literature, the more i see that i made the right choice to leave.. the first chapter goes into explaining what the kingdom is, then it looks like they must've essentially cut and pasted from the recent wt study articles about the 'harvest' illustration and about the two groups of anointed = one generation, but there's a third group of anointed who aren't part of 'this generation' (but, i imagine, probably will be someday, i mean, if two groups decades apart in age can be part of one generation, why not three?).

  it's interesting, looking at it again after all this time.

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  sd-7

  I was feeling a little melancholy earlier this week and I decided to start reading WT literature again, just to see what was new and improved. And it seems that, as has consistently been the case, the more I read of the literature, the more I see that I made the right choice to leave.

  The first chapter goes into explaining what the Kingdom is, then it looks like they must've essentially cut and pasted from the recent WT study articles about the 'harvest' illustration and about the two groups of anointed = one generation, but there's a third group of anointed who aren't part of 'this generation' (but, I imagine, probably will be someday, I mean, if two groups decades apart in age can be part of one generation, why not three?). It's interesting, looking at it again after all this time. Just seeing how much butchering of scripture happens, I mean.

  Jesus himself explains the meaning of the harvest illustration. He says that the harvest is a 'conclusion of a system of things'--not the BEGINNING of a conclusion of a system of things. He also says the reapers are angels. Then very clearly, he's talking about doing a judging, not unlike at the end of Matthew 25. So how does the Watchtower suggest that the harvest work is done by humans? It flies in the face of scripture. What's more, it elevates the JWs to a status that is, well, usurping the role of the angels and the one who would be assigning them to gather the wheat. I would've thought that since they stopped teaching that the preaching work is not separating the sheep from the goats (that's still true, right?), that logically, it would be inconsistent for them to teach that JWs are or have been in any way involved in the harvest. Hmm.

  But the 'generation' discussion really highlights one big thing for me, and it called to mind my judicial committee as I was talking about this: the Governing Body is not just wrong repeatedly, but remains unrepentant in their attitude as far as making predictions about when the end will come. Even after being wrong 4 (probably more, but I'll lump the 'generation' stuff pre-1995 into one big error) different times, they still don't see it. Except that they do see it, if the late Ray Franz is to be believed. They need another date, but they need to avoid the risk of being too specific. Hence, a 'generation'. This also demonstrates that the Governing Body is very conscious of what they are saying and doing. They're not just sincere men trying to do the right thing; they are carefully crafting predictions like this on purpose because they hope it will generate more recruitment and more fear.

  It seemed like a strange way to end the chapter, considering how convoluted the concept is. The chart should get people to think--but if you can't see that you and your dad aren't of the same generation, well...I feel bad for you.

  Chapter 2 was as far as I could get before I had to just stop reading. I'm sure they probably said it in the Proclaimers book before, but reading that C.T. Russell was a modern-day fulfillment of Malachi 3:1 was just too much. Once you've read the literature from the 1914-1919 era...you just cannot, cannot believe that anything written then was fulfilling some kind of Bible prophecy. But it got worse as the discussion went on.

  They gave examples of Watchtower instructions/teachings and then went on to imply that basically, if the Watchtower magazine did not provide this sort of guidance, then Jesus would not have found any true Christians on earth when he returned in 1914. One can hardly imagine a more arrogant, presumptuous thing to say. It is to say, "Without us, without the Watchtower literature, Jesus Christ would have failed to preserve anyone as one of his followers." One wonders if they believe in Jesus Christ at all with a statement like that, because it sounds an awful lot like The Watchtower is more powerful than Jesus.

  Well, I don't have the book in front of me, so I can't post exact quotes--and I doubt you guys will read a thread this long anyway. But if I have time, I'll try to revisit this thread and post some quotes, particularly from Chapter 2.

  --sd-7
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  19

  Read any good books lately?

  by Berengaria in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  well, have you punk?.

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  sd-7

  I'm reading 'Speaker for the Dead' by Orson Scott Card. Pretty good stuff.

  I also sat down and started reading 'God's Kingdom Rules!' A stunning work of fiction, it captures the history of a hypothetical "true religion" with incredible detail.

  --sd-7
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  66

  Will the JW.Org Site make a difference ?

  by Phizzy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  it will obviously make a difference to how jw's obtain their literatrash, they will have to download and print it all themselves before long.. it will make a small difference to the dtod work, they will now refer even genuine questions and interest etc to the site, not taking the opportunity to "witness" on the initial call at all.

  this has been happening already to a degree.. the difference i am mainly interested in is the capture of new suckers in to the borg.. we will be able to see when we get 2014's figures, sometime next year, what the rate of increase was over the last ten years.. phizzy the prophet predicts that the rate of increase over the next ten years will not be significantly up.

  probably down, but certainly, i feel, not so different from the last ten.. should i be around in ten years to do so, i will wish to ask jw's:.

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  sd-7

  I was just perusing the site last night, actually. There was an article in one of the recent Study Editions to reassure people in areas where they cannot access JW.ORG that they are not 'spiritually malnourished' or getting less 'spiritual food' than people who can go to the website. Just like the many Questions From Readers articles, it demonstrated how dependent JWs are on the literature and how insecure/immature they are in their faith if this question even needs to be addressed. The old JW persecution stories would have you believe you can be sustained by a matchbox-sized page of the Watchtower or something while in a labor camp, but they're worried about being 'malnourished' because they can't access the website?

  --sd-7
• 
  13

  2014 New Release stuff you might want!

  by Atlantis in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  atlantis just rolled this stuff off the scanner and is eating right now, so i wanted to see if anybody wanted this junk.. 2014, what is the kingdom of god?

  (tract).

  https://www.sendspace.com/file/m3y1tg .

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  sd-7

  So I imagine the video "These Things Must Be On Your Heart" is on YouTube already, right? Well, you didn't miss much. A wife guilting her husband, a dad putting the burden of his own drunken manslaughter of his brother on his son, a worldly guy telling a JW girl he's okay with hooking up and gay marriage...a young JW who inconceivably ends up doing beats for a rap artist which seems completely implausible because the rap artist(s) are dressed like they're in a jazz band....

  So maybe that's 2014 stuff you might not want...

  --sd-7