Posts by lepermessiah

80

To Current and Former Elders

by Styxx in

i wanted to say a few things to current and former elders.

it was really a post by alltimejeff on 10/1/2009 that got me thinking about this and i address a few things that he says here.

but i dont want to single him out because i really think that he is typical of many, and he did in fact apologize for his actions at the end of his post.

As noted by many here, since 1995, when the amount of elders has dwindled, the challenge for the GB is how to tackle that problem. One solution was to appoint young men in their mid 20's. As has been noted, many pros for the GB, tons of cons for the congregations who have to put up with leadership from young men who stopped picking their zits a year or two prior....

ATJ - This is such a key point. I was on a body a few years ago, and there was a young Ministerial Servant who was pioneering and had just finished MTS school. His name came up for discussion as an elder.

I was totally against appointing the young man as an elder. He was (barely) 24 years old. He was a total born-in and was thus totally naive when it came to the ways of the world. This young man was very, very smart, but he lived a very sheltered life. I was appointed in my mid-20's and I had to sit in meetings that would make a sailor blush There was NO WAY I felt that he was ready to be an elder! Sure, he could give excellent talks, was a great speaker, etc....but what was he going to do when he was sitting on a committee dealing with serious personal issues? All he was TRAINED to do was either reproof or disfellowship - he was not equipped to ponder over such deep things and realize he was dealing with a REAL person across the table..... (Of course, even old, experienced elders often fall into the same catagory.)

The rest of the body agreed to wait to appoint him- for HIS sake. Sure enough, we got a letter back from the branch stating that unless there was an OUTSTANDING reason why not, he should be appointed immediately. Needless to say, he was appointed ASAP. The last time I saw the poor guy, he looked like he had been run over by a frieght train. Based on my experience and many others, I think elders age in dog-years!!!!

80

To Current and Former Elders

by Styxx in

i wanted to say a few things to current and former elders.

it was really a post by alltimejeff on 10/1/2009 that got me thinking about this and i address a few things that he says here.

but i dont want to single him out because i really think that he is typical of many, and he did in fact apologize for his actions at the end of his post.

lepermessiah

I am hoping & expecting for this poster to do a little backing off in post #2.

I am relatively new too - but I feel comfortable saying I hope Styxx posts back in this thread relatively quickly to respond to some of the very well-thought out posts here. Otherwise, his future posts will be looked upon rather skeptically (at least by me) I felt like Undercover when I first read it - as a former Elder I would tell Styxx to F.O.A.D., but I am curious why he felt so compelled not to "single out" Jeff and then blast him.

Most of us young men in the organization were prodded, pushed, and planned for these type of roles. Bethelite, Pioneer, MS, Elder, etc.....Those titles hold much weight in the Witness world. It means you are "spiritually" minded, it means you are "theocratic" and of course, it tugs at the emotions because everyone around you - family, friends, and others in the congregation are SO proud of you.

As a young man serving as an elder, you are thrown into a host of situations that you are not always prepared to handle. There are professional counselors who do not hear some of the terrible things that Elders have to deal with. Yes, there can be a sense of power and authority, but imperfect people are going to be prone to those things, despite their motives.

One of the reasons I quit is because I cared too much and got tired of seeing people dumped on and beat down by the "religion" part of the faith. I still look back with some decisions with regret, but not for too long since I know I tried to always have the persons' best interests at heart, even if that meant applying a WT rule that I no longer agree with.

Jesus' disciples obvious were very ambitious and zealous. Jesus had to constantly counsel them.The WT uses the world zeal often in reference to "reaching out" in the congregation.

Ambition and Zeal are very closely related - its a fine line to cross at times.

25

Hotel California - is this Eagles Album Single for Christians?

by JWoods in

it came on the car radio this morning, and reminded me that this was probably the big single of 1977 - just about the beginning of the end time for me with the jehovah's witnesses.. now, you might understand that as a doubting elder with many deep issues at hand (it was the ray franz era of disenchantment for many elders)...i never heard much from them about the lyrics.. however - listening to it today, i can see where a "good" dubbie might find it to be at least as demonized as the smurfs cartoons.. and yet, very ironically, looking at them then and now, i always viewed it to be a sort of pop-social commentary on the california celebrity scene.. stretching it a little, you could almost compare the traveler's nightmare experience to getting trapped into the jehovah's witnesses - thinking it was a safe haven but then finding out that "you can never leave".. "we haven't had that spirit here since 1959".

"in the master's chamber they gathered for the feast".... yes, i can apply a lot of this to the cult entrapment experience..

lepermessiah

And yes that includes Nana Mouskuori!!!! OOoooooo those glasses.

LOL! That was my Mom's favorite singer growing up - hahahaha.......

That along with:

Led Zeppelin

Rush

AC/DC

Hendrix

Black Sabbath

Ozzy

Metallica

Anything with a beat....................

Anything popular..........................

Anything heard on the radio........

ETC, ETC.............LOL

45

Confirmation on statement made at assembly this past weekend

by koolaid-man in

jw
friends

i received a message on my telephone voice mail by a person who attended a jehovah's witness assembly this past weekend.

i believe the assembly was in michigan.

the caller told me it was announced from the platform that if a person is not attending the meetings on a regular basis active witnesses should not be associating with them.

lepermessiah

if a person is not attending the meetings on a regular basis active Witnesses should not be associating with them

Hey, lets be really Christ-like and treat even those on the "fringe" like $hit!

Assimilate or ELSE!

13

A Statement in the WTS from 10/25/09

by lepermessiah in

there was a statement in the wt study yesterday that really struck me.. i believe it was in the box pimping the "keep yourself in big brother's love" oops...."keep yourself in god's love" book.. it was a simple statement but hit me like a ton of bricks - furthering my resentment toward the hateful and indiscreet slave.. it said something like ..."many people have left jehovah's love" and went on to mention conduct instead of doctrine being the cause.. it really got me thinking:.

1) doesnt god love unconditionally?

isnt that why he sent jesus christ forth?.

lepermessiah

There was a statement in the WT study yesterday that really struck me.

I believe it was in the box pimping the "Keep Yourself In Big Brother's Love" oops...."Keep Yourself in GOD's LOVE" book.

It was a simple statement but hit me like a ton of bricks - furthering my resentment toward the Hateful and Indiscreet Slave.

It said something like ..."many people have LEFT JEHOVAH'S love" and went on to mention conduct instead of doctrine being the cause.

It really got me thinking:

1) Doesnt God love unconditionally? Isnt that why he sent Jesus Christ forth?

2) Does the WTB$ feel they are greater than John 3:16? Doesnt God love the WORLD so much?

3) If all parents responded toward their children the way that the WTB$ represents Jehovah, we would all be screwed. Any mistake in conduct would be considered "leaving our parents". What does the lessons of David in the bible teach us? It looks like it takes a LOT for God to abandon a loyal but imperfect human who loves his/her creator, the same way a parent often has unconditional love even toward the "worst" of children.

I read Blondie's review of the article and Blondie said it best:

Leaving Jehovah = Leaving WTBS

I think it is so insulting toward God to publish such total garbage. The WTB$ makes God out to be this slavedriver who is never happy......

I have a REALLY hard time beliving that God loves only 7 million out of his BILLIONS of children on this earth.

In addition to that, many of those 7 million are SELF-RIGHTEOUS, hypocritical D-bags......

106

Russian JWs in Serious Trouble - about to be banned

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

although it has been leading up to this for a long time, it appears russia has made up their mind to get rid of "extremist" groups by banning them, and jws are pretty much at the top of the list.

the last few years under putin they have been giving them heaps of trouble.. .

i am not for bans as it usually backfires, but under the "new" admnistration it looks like hard-core responses are in order.

lepermessiah

Ray Franz = Trotsky

Thats SO true - thankfully Ray stuck around long enough to spread his message.......

106

Russian JWs in Serious Trouble - about to be banned

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

although it has been leading up to this for a long time, it appears russia has made up their mind to get rid of "extremist" groups by banning them, and jws are pretty much at the top of the list.

the last few years under putin they have been giving them heaps of trouble.. .

i am not for bans as it usually backfires, but under the "new" admnistration it looks like hard-core responses are in order.

lepermessiah

This is so interesting - it has been building for years.

I am suprised that the WTBS isnt loved in Russia - seeing as how the organization is run SO SIMILAR to the old Soviet style of government.

Governing Body = Supreme Soviet

Congregations - City Soviets

Elders, CO, and DO = KGB

CT Russell = Lenin

Rutherford = Stalin

Knorr = Gorby

Fred Franz = Rasputin

The comparisons are endless and frightening!

The Russian government is like any other though - they hate competition!

LOVE FOR STALIN = HAPPY NATION!

21

What do you need to do to get FIRED around here?

by lepermessiah in

seinfeld fans - remember the episode where george is so desperate to get fired by the yankees that he does all these things to defy the boss and still keeps his job?.

well, i have been going through the same thing at the kh.

i havent been to a thursday meeting in weeks, i am getting like 2 hours of field circus a month (just mailing it in while my fade progresses) i dont comment, most people know that i would rather not be there, etc...... so i go last night since it is the co visit, and my wife really wanted me to come.

lepermessiah

Seinfeld Fans - remember the episode where George is so desperate to get fired by the Yankees that he does all these things to defy the boss and STILL keeps his job?

Well, I have been going through the same thing at the KH. I havent been to a Thursday meeting in weeks, I am getting like 2 hours of field circus a month (just mailing it in while my fade progresses) I dont comment, most people know that I would rather not be there, etc.....

So I go last night since it is the CO visit, and my wife really wanted me to come. Sure enough, the minute I walk in, they ask my to do sound or pass a microphone! I told them no, I didnt feel like it.

I couldnt help but laugh since there are men in the hall who are doing a lot better than I am, and still do not have "priviliges"

I think my next step is going to be saying "You know, I really dont deserve these priviliges right now, so I think its better if you dont use me"

I just want to be left alone and be able to bolt ASAP after the meeting!!!

71

Graph from Dec 15 09 Wt on How to Apportion Your Time to Remain Joyful. Crazy....

by Hopscotch in

here is a scan from the dec 15 09 wt (study ed) with a graph of how a witness should apportion their time to remain joyful.. .

so according to this graph, to remain joyful a witness should spend 3 times as much of his waking hours in 'theocratic activities' as he should in secular work!

hopscotch.

lepermessiah

Sorry, ignore my Free Mp3 plug above - I clicked on the wrong thing - #$#@! Firewall at work!!

Here is the pie chart I meant to add:

Hello Brothers and Sisters,

After careful and prayerful review, we have revised the Pie Chart in order to provide more spiritual balance - as well as giving you an opportunity to tell us where to stick it!

Love,

THE GB

71

Graph from Dec 15 09 Wt on How to Apportion Your Time to Remain Joyful. Crazy....

by Hopscotch in

here is a scan from the dec 15 09 wt (study ed) with a graph of how a witness should apportion their time to remain joyful.. .

so according to this graph, to remain joyful a witness should spend 3 times as much of his waking hours in 'theocratic activities' as he should in secular work!

hopscotch.

lepermessiah

Hello Brothers and Sisters,

After careful and prayerful review, we have revised the Pie Chart in order to provide more spiritual balance - as well as giving you an opportunity to tell us where to stick it!

Love,

THE GB