Posts by DrJohnStMark

59

Atheists, Agnostics, Doubters: What made you disregard the Bible?

by DubR in

DrJohnStMark

For me the personality of the God of the Bible is the main reason for not being a Christian any more (if I ever was)... plenty of examples of that mentioned above by other writers. Thus, after reading the Bible a few times, I no more have reason to read it any more. I recently read the Apocrypha since they give some insight (and outside look) in what I used to believe in. Reading the Bible can be useful in helping someone to quit the JWs, so if somebody has not carefully read the Bible, I might recommend it for that purpose.

Another thing: There is too much unnecessary BS in the Bible for it to be inspired by anything (anyone) else but limited human experience. Some statements there are just plain wrong and, in addition, then there is lots of stuff like that I mentioned in the do-you-still-read-the-bible thread: "Jair, a Gileadite... had thirty sons that rode on thirty ass colts..." (Judges 10:3-4) and "Abdon... had forty sons and thirty nephews, that rode on threescore and ten ass colts..." (Judges 12:13-14). Nothing more than a fairy tale.

In my opinioin, most pages of the Bible are completely unnecessary and only a few of them have some artistic (which I cannot really appreciate since I do not understand the original language) or major historical value. So take your own Bible and a text-liner pen to mark the passages that are completely useless or apparently wrong. There is not much left after that.

You should ask the same question about the Bible and about the Watchtower publications:

If they have anything to do with Holy Spirit, why are they so terribly wrong and stupid?

22

How Good Was/Is Your Singing Of The Kingdom Songs?

by finallysomepride in

jw
friends

mine, this is self explanitory, i hated it & just moved my lips but nothing came out..

DrJohnStMark

My singing was bad and I did not usually sing, but for some years I played the rotten piano at the kingdom hall because there was no competent player available. It was a relief (not for the ears though) when they finally decided to use the tapes instead, I just no more wanted to 'watch those (interesting and) false notes'...

30

as a JW were you comfortable with this question?

by highdose in

a few times in the ministry i would find someone clued in who would ask the jw on their doorstep " so what your saying is, unless i join your religon god will kill me?

and everyone else who isn't part of your religon?

" now theres only one answer to that question as far as jw's are concerned but i never saw a single one answer that with a straight answer, mostly i suspect because they were so uncomfortable about being made to face the truth about their beliefs..

DrJohnStMark

I was never really comfortable with that and finally, as I have mentioned earlier, that was one of the main things that made my belief system collapse. At some point as JW I even had had an idea that the WT society might eventually see the book of Jonah have an unexpected completion... In this the point of view of also some of my older JW relatives was more close to Russell's thinking than to Jehovah Witnesses' thinking... my father sometimes read Russell's books along with the more recent WT crap. In retrospect, Russell's writings look so silly (I read them through a couple of years ago), but at least Russell gave some (unfounded) hope to almost every human being.

18

? about Satan and Heaven

by juci32 in

i have been thinking lately about how the jw's believe that satan was kicked out of heaven in 1914 after the war in heaven.. first of all, why did it take so long for jehovah to finally decide to kick him out of heaven from the time that he decieved and turned his back on jehovah in genesis?

why was satan allowed to have access to heaven in the between time up until 1914?.

also, if revelation is supposed to be a future event, why do the jw's use that event as "already occurred"?.

DrJohnStMark

I wonder how such a mighty spirit as Satan could be confined on this insignificant planet earth. And where is the limit, troposphere or higher? Gagarin saw no God up there but he did not tell if he met big S.

Also, if the WT teaching was true, would it then be easier for us to 'breathe' on the moon, because in the biblical sense the moon is part of the heavens? This might be a good reason to set up a colony there.

25

WTBTS: Star of Bethlehem = Satan

by sacolton in

christmas is almost here and it's time to discuss the watchtower belief that the star of bethlehem was, in fact, satan leading the magi from the east to jesus so that king herod can kill him.

i never understood why they believe this as there is no scriptural evidence to suggest the star was anything more than a celestial beacon by god..

DrJohnStMark

Wonder how such a mighty super-intellect as Satan could be so stupid. I bet Satan had a more direct way to contact Herod if he wanted to... like I can contact anyone I know by just pressing a few buttons on my gsm phone. Herod would not have shouted Jehovah's name to disconnect the call, would he?

100

To you what was the Watchtower Socity's biggest lie ?

by The Almighty Homer in

yes, what was the biggest lie that you can think of, that persuaded you to realize that they were not who they said they were ?.

for myself it would have to be the year they picked as the destruction of ancient jerusalem 607 bc.. i have an assumption this was done purposely to coincide correctly with making 1914 an a important pivotal date.

in human history, which by all factual evidence it was not.. unassuming and deceiving manipulation for self marketing purposes.

DrJohnStMark

White Dove: MILLIONS NOW LIVING WILL NEVER DIE!

There are (about five) millions soon dying who've never (really) lived.

Because of that and other lies of the WT soviety... oops... society.

16

Asperger's Syndrome

by Joshnaz in

jw
friends

my jw sister e-mailed me today, telling me she thinks her husband has asperger's syndrome.

she herself is bi-polar and has been diagnosed with post tramatic stress disorder.

i'm thinking jw's have alot of mental disorders, but i never heard of anyone with asperger's syndrome.

DrJohnStMark

Elsewhere: I suspect Asperger's Syndrom is very common in the WTS.

I would say, instead, that some of the characteristic behavioral patterns related to syndromes or disorders like Alexithymia or Asperger's or... (in alphabetical order just to start with) are in the WT world considered to be signs of christian maturity.

8

What is your world view now?

by Luo bou to in

jw
friends

taoism: shit happens.

hinduism: this shit happened before.

islam: if shit happens, take hostages.

DrJohnStMark

C.T.Russell: The divine shit of the ages.

J.F.Rutherford: Millions now bullshitting will never die.

F.W.Franz: Let shit be true.

N.H.Knorr: The shit that leads to eternal hangover.

17

Comparing Jesus and Santa

by AK - Jeff in

i do not have my watchtower cdrom installed on this box.

i recall a quote by the watchtower some years back that said in effect;.

"if you teach your kids about santa claus, and they find out it was all a lie, they might begin to think that what you taught them about jesus is also a lie.".

DrJohnStMark

I have nothing against pure faith per se, but I do have something against faulty logic... too many of us here have felt the consequences. From this point of view, it may be useful to compare some religious arguments, like the ones propagated by the Watchtower Society, with such as those concerning Santa Claus.

The question on whether or not there is historical evidence on Jesus Christ, should in the end be irrelevant for those with pure faith. But it is not irrelevant to the Watchtower Society. The desperate need of the Society to show 'evidence' on everything results from their need to be able to condemn everyone not believing them.

The argument by Paul in Rm.1:20 that "the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made" may have been reasonable 2000 yrs ago. Paul probably had not learned about evolution at school, so I wouldn't blame him much, even if by the present-day standards his argument is faulty.

In science (or in court) there is a generally accepted methodology to find evidence, in religion there is not. I cannot scientifically prove that a god does not exist. But then, for science that question is irrelevant.

I talk to Santa Claus once a year or so, but not to Jesus Christ any more.

17

Comparing Jesus and Santa

by AK - Jeff in

i do not have my watchtower cdrom installed on this box.

i recall a quote by the watchtower some years back that said in effect;.

"if you teach your kids about santa claus, and they find out it was all a lie, they might begin to think that what you taught them about jesus is also a lie.".

DrJohnStMark

The testimonies regarding Jesus are no more valid in court than those regarding Santa Claus.

People believing in Jesus or Santa Claus are often very sincere and they are often (like) children (Mt.18:3). But people not believing in Jesus or Santa Claus are no less sincere.