Posts by JeffT

26

Why Does the WatchTower Society INVEST in unethical enterprises?

by Terry in

investing in unethical enterprises.

in the ocean, big fish swallow the little fish while the big fish are swallowed by the even bigger fish.. below is an example of this principle.. .

a fellow named mccann donated 50k shares of rand cam engine corp. to the watchtower society.. rand cam engine corp. manufactures aircraft engines for commercial, recreational, and military clients.

JeffT

What Bartolomeo said.

There is a difference between RAND CAM and the Rand Corporation. The corporation is a non-profit research firm. RAND CAM is trying to market a new kind of engine, with no evidence of success that I can find.

I did some research on this the last time it came up here, and just took a look to refresh my memory. I'm not sure who came up with the design for the engine, or for that matter how the thing is supposed to work -- the available information reads like the ads for 200 mile per gallon carburetors they sell in the back pages of Popular Mechanics.

Some how some JW's in Oregon and British Columbia acquired the rights to the engine and set up RAND CAM to sell it. They donated 50% of the stock to Watchtower, but retained the voting rights for themselves. They no doubt got a big tax deduction for the donation, while ensuring they kept control of the company.

I believe, from prior research, that one or more of the JW's involved in this were DF'd.

15

JWs at Culture Fest

by peacefulpete in

the state university where we live has cultural festivals educating the public about art, food and music of the minorities in the community.

it is also an opportunity for some to generate a little income selling their wares and food.

the jws have successfully put up a booth right in the campus building and used it to actively proselytize and distribute literature.

JeffT

The State university

This. It's public property and keeping people off it is very difficult (as in I'm surprised they can do it at all). Apparently the school will let religions set up booths for non-religious purposes. As we know the WTBS will cheerfully lie about what it's doing.

I'd tell the administrative people there to ask if the JW's manning the booth are allowed to count the time toward their proselytizing quota for the month. Make him get it in writing. If they want to lie about it you can't stop them, but you can make them know you know/

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

JeffT

Kim, LMSA or anybody else that might know the answers to a couple of questions.

I was initially interested in AAWA and sent my contact info with a view to joining their organization. Then the "John Cedars" signature scandal broke and I decided I didn't want anything to do with them. From my business background, I knew he couldn't sign that form, and couldn't imagine somebody dumb enough to do so. So the question: Did the state (Arizona or New Mexico i think) come down on them so they changed the form, or did somebody see what was wrong and fix it?

Second question. In the US it is common feature of business contracts to specify a location for any court action. For example one of my last jobs was Controller for a company that raised money in Japan and bought apartments here. All our contracts specified that investor legal issues would be handled by Japanese courts. If it involved the building the US courts in Seattle would have jurisdiction.

Do Lloyd's contracts with Patreon and/or his employees and investors have similar language? If so, that would be a major hangup for his court actions. Just curious.

22

WTBTS investments

by enoughisenough in

i found this article, how be it from about 10 years ago.

https://clarencesisk.com/watchtower-investments/ i didn't even go to the end of the article, but assuming the writer knew of which he wrote, wt had/has?

stock in bot j&j and pfizer.

JeffT

I will take a longer look at these documents when I get a minute. My initial impression of the Henrietta Riley documents is that some time five to ten years ago that entity divested itself of some or all of the problematic stocks.

It is impossible to know if that was in response to criticism from places like this board or something else. The Watchtower has done a good job of hiding its money from any accountability.

When I was first becoming a JW I did a simple calculation. At that time the society was printing about ten million copies of every issue of the Watchtower and Awake, which they sold for 25 cents, essentially these cost free as they used ~~slave~~ volunteer labor, and magazines were paid for by the publishers when picked up at the hall. This works out to something north of a hundred million dollars a year.

Plus all the other stuff. When I asked an elder what they did with the money I got some blah blah blah about the world wide work. Fortunately I fifteen years later I left.

22

WTBTS investments

by enoughisenough in

i found this article, how be it from about 10 years ago.

https://clarencesisk.com/watchtower-investments/ i didn't even go to the end of the article, but assuming the writer knew of which he wrote, wt had/has?

stock in bot j&j and pfizer.

JeffT

Thanks for the information Atlantis. That is a more tangled than I thought.

22

WTBTS investments

by enoughisenough in

i found this article, how be it from about 10 years ago.

https://clarencesisk.com/watchtower-investments/ i didn't even go to the end of the article, but assuming the writer knew of which he wrote, wt had/has?

stock in bot j&j and pfizer.

JeffT

Retied accountant here.

This is not a tax return for the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. It is a form 990, the form used for non-profit entities. In this case, the Henrietta M. Riley Foundation. It is either a private foundation, or a trust treated like a Foundation. The Watchtower is a beneficiary of the trust, meaning it gets the income generated by the trust.

Irrevocable trusts are commonly used to pass on estates to children, or causes the grantor considers worth doing. I assume that MS Riley was some rich JW that got talked into creating this trust. One of the fun facts about this type of trust, is that the beneficiary has no control over how the funds are invested or managed, so long as the trustee is following instructions.

I suspect that in this case Ms Riley's trust document says something like "make money and give it the WTBS," and failed to specify that the trust not deal in things like the military or tobacco. From my recollection of the last time this came up there was more of that sort of thing listed. It is possible that the trustee divested some problem stocks without violating the trust agreement.

I may not be able to get any more information, but I'm going to try next week, just because I'm curious.

I have no doubt that the WTBS has engaged in some questionable practices. I don't think this is one of them.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

JeffT

"You're" not your.

Did he actually write this or did somebody transcribe it from a recording? Still, lack of professionalism. He should have had a handout of some sort with his bio and the song lyrics.

11530

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars

by Newly Enlightened in

original reddit post (removed).

JeffT

Just my opinion, but this is one more bit of proof that he isn't even trying to be professional about any of this. He's got an important gig tomorrow -- important because it's the first one in the attempt to rebrand himself as a singer/songwriter.

You only get one first gig, and you need to have it run perfectly. He's scheduled to go tomorrow and he's just now picking up the guitar for "the first time in ages?" Not how the pros do it Lloyd.

43

Sunday January 15 is my 76th birthday. I answer some of your questions.

by Terry in

jw
friends

happy birthday 2 me!!.

sunday is my 76th birthday and i know that you want to know how it "feels" to have outlived my usefulness, to have lost my natural beauty (being reduced to wrinkles and flab), and constantly walking into a room not knowing why i'm there.

you also are curious as to how i can continue to find a reason to live since none of my kids think my opinions have any possible value, most of my facebooks friends i wouldn't recognize if i tripped over them on my way into starbucks, and my monthly expenditure on bird treats exceeds u.s. spending on the military.

JeffT

Happy birthday.

I know the feeling, I'll be 72 in April. My kids are tired of hearing all my jokes. Again. At least my daughter appreciates the same music I do (Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Pink Floyd, Rolling Stones - you get the ideas). Family is everything for me.

Like you, Terry, I live for artistic exploration, in my case, novels. I presently have five for sale on Amazon and I'm writing number six.

I have lots of advice for everyone. The first piece: don't just believe what others tell you to believe, even me.

42

Have you ever been on a congregation picnic?

by LostintheFog1999 in

were you ever on a congregation picnic?

i was on several occasions.. the arrangements were often announced from the platform after the closing song and prayer by the last elder up on the platform.. sometimes it was included in the service meeting announcements as "on saturday we're meeting at 10.00am at the kingdom hall for field service, and after field service for anyone who wishes, especially for the younger ones, we will be having a congregation picnic meeting at the beach carpark on seaview road.".

well, according to the new elders manual you won't be hearing those words again.

JeffT

I'm a convert not born in, the fun social stuff in the seventies was a major factor in the conversion. The congregation (Pullman, WA) was relatively small and very close knit. We had parties and picnics frequently. We left Pullman in 1982 and I don't remember going to any social events at the two congregations we attended after that. Had my introduction to the JW's been at one of those later congregations I probably would not have converted.