Posts by HappyGuy

6

What if.... the JW's didn't have to turn in service reports?

by dissed in

jw
friends

when i was a youngin at bethel in the 70's, a bethel elder mentioned to our crew that they were discussing the possibility of ending service reports.

he wanted to know our thoughts and how could the elders and the wts monitor the preaching work if they changed the service reporting?

would the work go down without the monitoring?.

HappyGuy

Without the threat of being labeled "inactive" or "irregular", which of course the elder's wives promptly telll everyone in the circuit through the gossip mill that you are inactive or irregular, the vast majority of JWs would stop going in the door to door work.

I got almost all of my time in by talking to people heart to heart so it woudlnt' have affected me at all.

I cannot speak for elders, MS, or pioneers, I wasn't in any of those clicks, but for the average publisher who is just hanging in there every month with their 7 to 10 hours? Pretty much all of them would stop going in service altogether.

The WTBTS authorities should not be monitoring the field service work in any way shape or form.

Of course the GB is terrified that the rank and file's true dedication and motivation to the "preaching" work will be exposed without the threat of being marked for being irregular or inactive.

5

Salter called Rutherford a liar....WOW

by HappyGuy in

jw
friends

i had never heard of this letter before.

not sure how william salter was exactly.

someone high up in the organization at some point.. i didn't go looking for this, i was rooting around on doc bob's site looking or the baptism questions and i stumbled across this letter that salter wrote to rutherford.. he just comes right out and calls rutherford a liar.

HappyGuy

I had never heard of this letter before. Not sure how William Salter was exactly. Someone high up in the organization at some point.

I didn't go looking for this, I was rooting around on Doc Bob's site looking or the baptism questions and I stumbled across this letter that Salter wrote to Rutherford.

He just comes right out and calls Rutherford a liar. Not once but multiple times. WOW.

In talking about the socieity's financial situation Salter says:

And at the time I was relieved of my duties there was not only a large sum in the bank as customary but also over $25,000.00 in cash was lying in the Society's vaults at 40 Irwin Avenue and had for years, which could be used for the needs of the President or those whom he might designate in case of an international emergency - and the dear pioneers? Well, of course they could go hungry. Poor gullible friends!! My, were we not blind, and how blind the friends still are! And yet the annual reports tell of our great losses and how it is hoped the Lord will make it up. Well, it is said, "figures don't lie, but liars do figure."

Then in talking about the 1925 failed prediction, Salter says:

...i n other words, it is what the Lord speaks of as "false dreams" and He say He is against such and therefore I must be. Was the Lord please with our false dream concerning 1925 and the zeal of the friends in that connection? He was not. Was it a lie. It was.

Salter is my hero!

16

Do the "top" men in the WTBTS go in field service?

by HappyGuy in

jw
friends

i read in a letter from walter salter to j. f. rutherford that salter states that rutherford does not go in field service and salter admonishes rutherford to start going in field service so that he will "know what you are talking about".. i found this a bit surprising.

so, i want to ask anyone who knows the inner workings at the hqs.

do the top men go in field service?

HappyGuy

I read in a letter from Walter Salter to J. F. Rutherford that Salter states that Rutherford does not go in field service and Salter admonishes Rutherford to start going in field service so that he will "know what you are talking about".

I found this a bit surprising.

So, I want to ask anyone who knows the inner workings at the HQs. Do the top men go in field service? By top men I mean the Governing Body, the society president, treasurer,secretary, the board of directors?

If they don't go in field service do they count their time based on public lectures, writing books, etc?

22

Baptism

by Aeiouy in

so i was thinking about baptism today, and something that was said in my jc meeting a few months ago.

i was baptized at the ripe old age of 10. yes that's right, 10. that should be illegal.

what kind of 10 year old knows what they want to do for the rest of their life?

HappyGuy

I have an issue with JW baptism.

As far as I understand the purpose of baptism in the New Testament, it was an outward sign that a person was committing their life to serve "God" (whatever that means). The immersion under water was to signify that the person died to their former course of life, and the coming up out of the water signified that they were now alive in their new life, resurrected as it were. Something like that.

The WTBTS has changed baptism to mean that one is committing their life to obey the WTBTS. I got this question from DocBob's site. He says it is the latest version of the 2nd baptism question:

Do you understand that your dedication and baptism identify you as one of Jehovah's Witnesses in association with God's spirit-directed organization?

Looks to me like it is a contract between the baptism candidate and the Watchtower corporation that the baptism candidate is agreeing to obey the Watchtower corporation. Because if you read the literature of the Watchtower corporation it says that you can only be one of Jehovah's Witnesses if you follow the direction of the faithful and discrete slave which they claim is them.

That is the problem I have with JW baptism.

22

Baptism

by Aeiouy in

so i was thinking about baptism today, and something that was said in my jc meeting a few months ago.

i was baptized at the ripe old age of 10. yes that's right, 10. that should be illegal.

what kind of 10 year old knows what they want to do for the rest of their life?

HappyGuy

what were the questions when you got baptized? were they that you were showing by this outward sign of being immersed that you were dying to your forer course of life and giving a public demonstration that you were dedicating your life to serving God (or Jesus or Jesus God or God Jesus I get confused)?

Or was it the one where you say that you will obey the WTBTS?

If it was the first one then your relationship with God is between you and God and no man has any right to interfere in that. The Bible says that very clearly.

If, on the other hand it was the second one, then they have a problem because they change their doctrine so often it is difficult to know what you are obeying. And they entered into this contract (because of the way the questions are now worded it is a contract) by giving you false information to persuade you to agree to the contract. So, they have violated the contract.

But, yes you are right, contracts with 10 year olds are not binding anywhere that I know of.

101

Who was the God of Abraham?

by cameo-d in

any takers?.

HappyGuy

It's worth considering that The God, the one who was Jesus' Father and whom he prayed to, was not the same god the Jews had been worshipping all along.

What does this have to do with the trhead topic? I'm talking about who and what the creature known as Jehovah is. What Jesus did or didn't say so many years later has nothing to do with that.

101

Who was the God of Abraham?

by cameo-d in

any takers?.

HappyGuy

Inkie,

My intent was to show you that the words you speak regarding your description of the true God is false.

I am pointing out what the Old Testament says. If you are saying that the Old Testament is false, then that is a different issue. According to what the Old Testament says Jehovah is a scumbag.

Question: Ifone can trust the NT, which states that the OT is riddled with falsehoods, why would you "believe" the OT?

How do I know I can trust the NT? What proof is there?

Where does the NT claim that the OT is riddled with falsehoods?

Nevertheless, one cannot believe entirely the OT or the NT.

I never said I believe either of them. I was pointing out what the OT says about Jehovah. Since the OT is the primary source of information on Jehovah, according to the OT Jehovah is what I said he is.

Once can, however, believe the Christ when he speaks to you.

Well, if he wants to come down here and set me straight I'm guessing he has my number and he can call and set up an appoitnment. I'm 52 and Jesus has not spoken to me yet. I'm getting up there in years so if he is going to come and set me straight he needs to get on with it.

22

If You Could Shoot Hitler......

by metatron in

jw
friends

it's a classic sci-fi plot: you have a time machine and a snipers rifle.

do you go back in time and kill hitler?.

i can justify hitler but only because we now can see how central he was to events in europe.

HappyGuy

I would take out Widrow Wilson. Then no Versailles Treaty, no League Of Nations, then no Hitler.

Or, I would take out Lenin, then the communist counter revolution fails and the White Russian government succeeds. Again, no Hitler.

Or, I would take out the Confederate picket who shot General Stonewall Jackson. Then the Confederate night attack is successfull and the entire Union army is bagged and Washington DC falls and the South wins the war. Now you have no Obama.

British Foreign Secretary Lord Lansdown. Now there is no Anglo Japanese alliance. Japan does not invade Chin, Japan does not go to war with the United States in 1941. The United States sits out WWII and watches the Nazis and Communists exhaust each other and then waltzes in to pick up the broken pieces. The communists don't take over China, and the Nazis and the Russian communists are ousted by Allied forces.

Changing the world is easy, you just have to pick your targets carefully.

101

Who was the God of Abraham?

by cameo-d in

any takers?.

HappyGuy

Since abraham was from babylon, his god would have come from the babylonian pantheon. He liked human sacrifice.

Which was my point. Jehovah is a demon from an earlier mythology.

101

Who was the God of Abraham?

by cameo-d in

any takers?.

HappyGuy

Inkie,

Well now you insult me.

You, in fact, are like the scribes who wrote falsely concerning Jah. You too easily believe what you have been told by liars (religious leaders) and writers (scribes and writers of various publications).

I dont get my information from religious leaders. I DETEST religious leaders. I don't read religious publications. I HAVE read the OT hundreds of times from cover to cover. I have researched it thoroughly using interlinears and concordances and encyclopedias. So, I don't know what you are talking about here. Neither do you, you don't know me.

Now, if you are saying that the incidents described in the version of the OT which came to us from the dead sea scrolls is somehow a fake and this is not "god", well I can't do anything about that.

I am not talking about Jesus, I am talking about the demon who was called Jehovah. I don't know who Jesus was talking about, but that has nothing to do with Jehovah's behavior and qualities. The "god" described in the NT is not the same "god" as the demon Jehovah.

If you want me to take what the NT says about Jesus as "fact", then I must also be able to take the OT as "fact", you cannot have it both ways. The only proof you have for Jesus words is the NT. So, if you are saying "oh don't believe the OT, it is lies". You cannot then say "but DO believe the NT because IT tells us that it is the word of God, er I mean Jesus who is God but isn't God.