pirata

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Posts by pirata

• 
  17

  Where's BrotherDan?

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  where are you, brosephdanny?.

  hope i didn't tick you off on the true christian thread last friday.

  looks like you haven't posted since then.

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  pirata

  Black Sheep: Dan was parodying the GB's recent statements.
• 
  16

  Taking Notes at Meetings and Assemblies

  by punkofnice in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i was considering recently the value and content of talks by reviewing notes i'd taken.. it seems i've taken copious notes but the content was naff.

  not because i'd missed interesting bits but the talks were bland 'ministry' adverts.. the talks all seemed to be full of 'do more or god will murder you'.

  'feel guilty because you don't measure up.

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  pirata

  My family reviews the note in our family worship after the Assembly and Convention. There are sometimes many interesting points to be brought out and disgust... er.. I mean discussed.
• 
  35

  Do not let work get in the way of pioneering

  by life is to short in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the april 15th wt is strange and it just throws things in here and there that are kind of out of sort.

  i think it sticks in your mind more like hey i probably should pioneer when they throw things in that are kind of in left feild.. like this example on pages 16 and 17 it is talking about making decisions and in paragraph 15 it says "for example a congregation publisher might decide to pioneer.

  will he succeed?

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  pirata

  @Franklin Massey, Pioneer entitlement is encouraged by the organization:

  *** km 11/10 p. 4 Question Box - In What Practical Ways Can We Assist Pioneers ***

  Certainly our well-chosen words may encourage them to continue serving as pioneers. (Prov. 25:11) Could we adjust our weekly schedule in order to work with them in the ministry? When working together, we might suggest using our vehicle instead of theirs. And if we ride in their vehicle, perhaps we could offer a contribution to help cover their expenses. (1 Cor. 13:5; Phil. 2:4) We also demonstrate our loving support by showing hospitality and occasionally inviting pioneers to our home for a meal.—1 Pet. 4:8, 9.

  *** km 2/92 p. 7 pars. 5-6 Showing Support for the Pioneers ***
  5 Everyone Can Help: Publishers can help by making themselves available more often to work with the pioneers. Pioneers enjoy the company and support of the other publishers. Perhaps you can arrange to work with the pioneers once a week or twice a month. Material things can be shared with the pioneers, and this generosity is much appreciated by the pioneers.—Phil. 4:14-19.
  6 Families can do much to assist their members who are pioneering. Often, household chores can be rearranged to permit one or more family members to pioneer. One sister with three children works two days a week. Her sons help out by caring for the shopping and doing work around the home. The daughter helps with the cleaning and cooking. Since her graduation, she too has begun pioneering, alternating workdays with her mother. Such cooperation within the family enables more to pioneer and brings blessings to the family.
• 
  25

  Kingdom Interlinear = apostate literature?

  by brotherunsure in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anybody else come across jdubs that have never heard of the kingdom interlinear translation?

  i noticed this artcle http://www.soundwitness.org/jw/kit_part1.htm and i've found when i asked witnesses about it some never heard of it and other's had heard of it but didn't have one and didn't know if they were still in print and one got all weird and suspicious saying "well what do you want it for?".

  when i called the watchtower and asked if it was still in print the guy had to put me on hold and look it up somewhere, he didn't know off the top of his head.

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  pirata

  If Fred Franz had read the above article, we may never have had the NWT. I guess he was special.
• 
  25

  Kingdom Interlinear = apostate literature?

  by brotherunsure in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  has anybody else come across jdubs that have never heard of the kingdom interlinear translation?

  i noticed this artcle http://www.soundwitness.org/jw/kit_part1.htm and i've found when i asked witnesses about it some never heard of it and other's had heard of it but didn't have one and didn't know if they were still in print and one got all weird and suspicious saying "well what do you want it for?".

  when i called the watchtower and asked if it was still in print the guy had to put me on hold and look it up somewhere, he didn't know off the top of his head.

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  pirata

  The Kingdome Interlinear and Emphatic Diaglott are still standard order items, at least in North America.

  A recent article Do you need to learn Hebrew and Greek doesn't really encourage the use of them, though:

  *** w09 11/1 pp. 20-23 Do You Need to Learn Hebrew and Greek? ***
  Do You Need to Learn Hebrew and Greek?MOST of the Bible was originally written in just two languages, Hebrew and Greek. The writers who used those languages did so under the guidance of God’s holy spirit. (2 Samuel 23:2) Therefore, the message they recorded can be described as “inspired of God.”—2 Timothy 3:16, 17.
  However, the majority of people who read the Bible today do not understand Hebrew or Greek. Rather, they need to use a translation of the Bible in their own language. You probably need to do the same. Since these translations do not claim to be inspired, you may have wondered, ‘Can I fully understand the message of the Bible while using a translation, or should I try to learn Hebrew and Greek?’

  Factors to Keep in MindBefore answering that question, you need to keep several factors in mind. First, just having a knowledge of ancient Hebrew or Greek does not in itself miraculously make someone more inclined to understand the message of the Bible. Speaking to the Jewish people of his day, Jesus said: “You are searching the Scriptures, because you think that by means of them you will have everlasting life; and these are the very ones that bear witness about me. And yet you do not want to come to me that you may have life.” (John 5:39, 40) What was their problem? Was it a lack of understanding of Hebrew? No, they knew the language well. However, Jesus went on to say: “I well know that you do not have the love of God in you.”—John 5:42.
  Similarly, the apostle Paul told Greek-speaking Christians in the ancient city of Corinth: “Both the Jews ask for signs and the Greeks look for wisdom; but we preach Christ impaled, to the Jews a cause for stumbling but to the nations foolishness.” (1 Corinthians 1:22, 23) Obviously, then, just speaking either Hebrew or Greek was not in itself the key to accepting the message found in God’s Word.
  A second factor is that although some people today speak modern Hebrew or Greek, these languages are significantly different from the Hebrew and Greek that were used to write the Bible. Most Greek-speaking people today find it a challenge to understand Biblical Greek correctly. This is because new words have been added to the language, replacing older terms, and many words that have survived have different meanings. For example, the word rendered “beautiful” at Acts 7:20 and Hebrews 11:23 means “funny” in modern Greek. Additionally, there have been extensive changes in the grammar and syntax of the language.
  Even if you were to learn modern Hebrew or modern Greek, it would not necessarily mean that you would understand the Bible more accurately in its original languages. You would still need to rely on dictionaries and grammar books to show you how these languages were used when the books of the Bible were first put into written form.
  A third factor is that learning a new language can be a very difficult task. Although it may at first be relatively easy to learn a few phrases in another language, it may take years of constant effort before you will be able to understand the subtle nuances of that language. In the meantime, the old adage may prove true, A little knowledge is a dangerous thing. How so?

  What Is the Meaning of the Word?Have you ever been asked by someone learning your language about the meaning of a particular word? If so, you know that it is not always easy to give an answer. Why not? Because a word may have several meanings. You may have found yourself asking the person for an example of the word in a sentence. Without that context, it may be difficult for you to determine which meaning of the word may apply. For example, you may be asked the meaning of the English word “iron.” This one word can have different meanings in different contexts. It could mean a type of metal, an instrument for pressing clothes, or a golf club. In another setting, it could refer to shackles or even to a dietary supplement. When describing an action, it may mean to press or smooth clothes with a heated appliance. When used in the expression “iron out,” it takes on a completely different meaning, that is, to resolve a problem. Which one is the correct meaning?
  A dictionary may provide you with all the possible meanings of a word. Some dictionaries even list these meanings in order of common usage. But it is the context in which the word is used that will help you determine the specific meaning. To illustrate: Suppose you had a little medical knowledge and wanted to find the cause of certain symptoms you were experiencing. You could consult a medical dictionary. It might tell you that in 90 percent of cases, your symptoms mean one thing, but in 10 percent of cases, they indicate something completely different. You would need much more knowledge before you could arrive at the correct diagnosis. Similarly, the fact that a word has a certain meaning in 90 percent of cases does not help you if you are reading an important text where a secondary meaning of the word is used. You need to know more about the context before you can understand the word.When it comes to studying words found in the Bible, you also need to know the context in which the word appears. For example, the original words that are usually translated “spirit” can have various meanings, depending on the context in which they are used. At times, they can be accurately translated “wind.” (Exodus 10:13; John 3:8) In other contexts they refer to the life force found within all living creatures, both humans and animals. (Genesis 7:22; Psalm 104:29; James 2:26) Invisible heavenly creatures are also described as spirits. (1 Kings 22:21, 22; Matthew 8:16) God’s active force is called his holy spirit. (Genesis 1:2; Matthew 12:28) The same word is used to designate the force that causes a person to display a certain attitude, disposition, or emotion, as well as the dominant mental inclination manifested by a group of people.—Joshua 2:11; Galatians 6:18.
  Although a Hebrew or Greek dictionary may list these various meanings, it is the context that will help you to determine which meaning is the appropriate one. This is true whether you are reading the Bible in the original languages or using a translation in your language.

  Is It Wrong to Use a Translation?
  Some have made great efforts to learn Biblical Hebrew or Biblical Greek or both. Even though they are aware of the limitations of their understanding, they take pleasure in being able to read the Bible in its original languages and feel that all the effort was worthwhile. However, if you are not able to do that, should you feel discouraged and give up in your search for Bible truth? No, not at all! There are several reasons for this conclusion.
  First, it is appropriate to use a translation of the Bible. In fact, the writers of the Christian Greek Scriptures, or so-called New Testament, often made use of a Greek translation when quoting from the Hebrew Scriptures. (Psalm 40:6; Hebrews 10:5, 6) Although they spoke Hebrew and could have quoted from the original Hebrew Scriptures, they obviously were comfortable with using a translation of those verses that was more widely available to those to whom they were writing.—Genesis 12:3; Galatians 3:8.
  Second, even if a person can understand Bible languages, he can read the words of Jesus only in translation. This is because the Gospel writers wrote down in Greek what Jesus originally said in a form of the Hebrew language. Any who feel that the ability to read the words of Jehovah’s faithful ancient servants in their original languages confers some kind of special wisdom should consider what that implies. The fact that Jehovah inspired the preserving of the words of his greatest Servant only in translation—in a language widely understood at the time—indicates that the language we read the Bible in is not important. What matters is that we read its inspired message in a form that we can understand and respond to.
  Third, the “good news” contained in the Bible was to be made available for humble people of “every nation and tribe and tongue and people.” (Revelation 14:6; Luke 10:21; 1 Corinthians 1:27-29) In harmony with this, the overwhelming majority of people today can learn God’s purpose from a copy of the Bible in their own language without having to learn another language. In many languages a number of different translations are available, leaving the reader with a choice.

  So how can you make sure that you understand the truth found in the Bible? Jehovah’s Witnesses have found that a topical study of the Bible, taking into consideration the context, is a useful way to understand the message found in God’s Word. For example, they take a particular topic, such as “Marriage,” and look up the verses that refer to that topic. In that way, they allow one part of the Bible to explain what another part means. Why not take advantage of the free home Bible study course that Jehovah’s Witnesses offer to all? No matter what language you speak, God desires that “all sorts of men should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of truth.”—1 Timothy 2:4; Revelation 7:9.

  [Footnotes]
  Some sections of the Bible were written in Aramaic, a language closely related to Biblical Hebrew. Examples of this are found at Ezra 4:8 to 6:18 and 7:12-26, Jeremiah 10:11, and Daniel 2:4b to 7:28.
  It should be noted that some dictionaries and lexicons of Bible words merely list how the word has been translated in a particular version of the Bible, such as the King James Version, rather than independently defining the meaning of the word.By the time of Jesus Christ and his apostles, all the books of the Hebrew Scriptures could be read in Greek. This translation came to be called the Septuagint and was used extensively by Greek-speaking Jews. Most of the hundreds of direct quotations from the Hebrew Scriptures that are found in the Christian Greek Scriptures are based on the Septuagint.
  It is believed that the Gospel of Matthew was originally written by the apostle Matthew in Hebrew. However, even if that is the case, what has been preserved until today is a Greek translation of the original, possibly made by Matthew himself.
  For a discussion of the different styles of translation and how to select an accurate translation, see the article “How Can You Choose a Good Bible Translation?” in the May 1, 2008, issue of this magazine.[Box/Picture on page 22]
  The Septuagint
  Greek-speaking Jews in the time of Jesus and his apostles made extensive use of the Greek Septuagint. This is a translation of the Hebrew Scriptures into Greek. Not only is the Septuagint noteworthy because it was the first known attempt to translate the Holy Scriptures into another language but it is also impressive because of the size of the translation project. A group of translators started work on the Septuagint in the third century B.C.E., and the work was completed by others over a hundred years later.
  The early Christians were quick to make effective use of the Septuagint to prove that Jesus was the Christ, the promised Messiah. So effective were they that the Septuagint began to be viewed by some as a “Christian” translation. This led to its losing popularity among the Jews and resulted in several new translations being produced in Greek. One of those translations was produced by a Jewish proselyte named Aquila in the second century C.E. When describing this translation, one Bible scholar refers to a “quite unexpected feature.” Represented by ancient Hebrew characters, the divine name, Jehovah, appears throughout Aquila’s Greek translation.
  [Credit Line]
  Israel Antiquities Authority
  [Pictures on page 23]
  It is important that we read the Bible’s inspired message in a form we can understand and respond to
• 
  2

  Where is Tonky?

  by Nebeska Nada in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  does anybody know?

  i miss her.... .

  .

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  pirata

  She last posted here a few weeks ago. We have been eagerly been waiting for an update!
• 
  88

  So I asked my female coworker what she was doing this weekend............

  by miseryloveselders in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  but her reply made me so very envious.

  you know my mother always would tell me, "wordly people aren't really happy.

  " as a kid that always bugged me because i figured if people are laughing, smiling, and generally having a good time, they must be happy.

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  pirata

  Misery, you are not married. What keeps you in?
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  28

  MORE LIES FROM THE MAY WATCHTOWER STUDY EDITION

  by Hairyhegoat in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the path of the righteous ones is like the.

  bright light that is getting lighter and lighter.

  until the day is firmly established, states.

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  pirata

  This is the reason they have printed that (from the preceeding article "O the Depth of God's Wisdom!", pg. 23):

  * Evidently, there is no typical or antitypical olive tree.Although natural Israel did produce kings and priests,
  the nation did not become a kingdom of priests. Kings
  in Israel were prevented by law from becoming priests.
  Therefore, natural Israel did not serve as a typical olive
  tree. Paul is illustrating how God’s purpose to produce
  “a kingdom of priests” is ful?lled in connection with
  spiritual Israel. This updates what was published in the
  August 15, 1983, Watchtower, pages 14-19.
• 
  39

  May 15 2011 WT - study edition out

  by just n from bethel in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i don't really care to download it and review it and see how it's the same old same old - but i do like to read up on others doing it here.

  :) i'm a lazy leach like that.. so - get to it guys.. www.jw.org.

  edit: haha- i said 2001 in the title - meant 2011.

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  pirata

  In brief:

  First few articles on families, husbands being the head, wives being submissive, doing the family worship, and children setting spiritual goals and turning down worldly enticements to pioneer.

  "Oh the Depth of God's Wisdom" on pgs. 21-23 presents a retraction of a typical/antitypical application of the olive tree illustration and it's application to the 144,000 (with respect to previously published information in the Watchtower, August 15, 1983, pg14-17 article 'A Productive Olive Tree'.). Freddy Franz is not going to be happy.

  Followed by "Following Christ, the perfect leader". Of course our following Christ's leadership means being submissive to his anointed "brothers". Suprisingly, the article does not mention the Governing Body directly. They do the usual damage control surrounding a "new light" article by stating "Another way to cooperate with Christ’s “brothers” is to have a positive attitude toward any refinements in our understanding of Scriptural truths as published by “the faithful and discreet slave.”

  Concludes with the article "Complete Trust in Jehovah inspires confidence" which examines how David trusted in God and applies it to things like: trusting in Jehovah means being loyal to Jehovah which includes how we treat disfellowshipped family member.
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  57

  Why would abandoning 1914 mean they are not chosen by God?

  by InterestedOne in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've read here that if the wt admits 607 is wrong or if 1914 is wrong, the logical result is that god did not choose them as his org.

  can someone explain to me how that logically follows?.

  couldn't they just say, "we have received new light on that, have learned that we cannot give a specific date (like how they abandoned 1935), but look, we adhere to the bible more strictly than anyone else, we strive to 'keep the cong clean' more than any other group, etc., so therefore, we must be chosen by god as his only org.

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  pirata

  Biblically, the 70 years prophecy in Jeremiah refers to the time of Judah and the surrounding nations servitude to Babylon which started to happen around 605BCE or so (607 BCE is close enough). If the 70 year prophecy was reinterpreted this way, they could keep their 1914 date by dating the "Gentile Times" at the beginning of servitude to Bablyon, unshackle the beginning of the prophecy from the destruction of Jerusalme, and accept the fall of Jerusalem as 587BCE. But I don't think they'll ever do that because Don Cameron has already published that 70 year interpretation, and thus would be another obvious not-inspired-by-holy-spirit new light... then again most JWs don't read "apostate ideas", so maybe they could get away with it.