Why do they think Daniel’s "seven times" prophecy has a fulfillment beyond Nebuchadnezzer’s seven years of insanity? I can find no evidence of this in scripture. It seems to me to be a miraculous prophecy that took place exactly as Jehovah prophesied thru Daniel. This renders the whole 607 – 586 debate moot. Why add to it by using it to try to determine the length of the "gentile times"?
Allelsefails,
Determining the length of the gentile times is easy. How do we know? Because Jesus identified them for us in the Gospels. Where would we go to find this out? Well to the same prophecy in Matthew and Mark that Luke was writing about when he used the expression gentile times. Why then was this missed and such unsupportable dates like the WT and others applied to them? Because for some reason we cannot read or think for ourselves. And few notice that the Gospel writers did not always quote Jesus exactly but interpreted what he said for the readers. This is why they do not seem to match. But they do match in fact if we consider the audience for which such Gospels were written and they give a much different answer. I have discussed this many times on this forum but simply put Matthew, Mark, and Luke side by side and you should be able to see the answer.
Luke 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. 21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. 22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people. 24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Mark 13:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: 15 And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: 16 And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. 17 But woe to them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 18 And pray ye that your flight be not in the winter. 19 For in those days shall be affliction, such as was not from the beginning of the creation which God created unto this time, neither shall be. 20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect’s sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.
Matt 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:) 16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains: 17 Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house: 18 Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes. 19 And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. 22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.
The verses look somewhat different but they are all talking about the same thing and that same future and final event that some like the elect look forward to. And they all actually discuss such gentile times, how they go from bad to worse and identify their beginning. So yes, as you said: "This renders the whole 607 – 586 debate moot." The many books and articles written about such gentile times are nothing more than a distraction. Nothing like reading the wrong material to get confused and stay that way like many witnesses do.
Joseph