Posts by JosephMalik

29

JESUS CHRIST -- I AM WHO I AM

by UnDisfellowshipped in

(exodus 3:13) and moses said to god, behold, when i come to the children of israel, and shall say to them, the god of your fathers has sent me to you; and they shall say to me, what is his name?

(exodus 3:14) and god said to moses, i am who i am: and he said, thus you shall say to the children of israel, i am has sent me to you.. (exodus 3:15) and god said moreover to moses, thus you shall say to the children of israel, jehovah the god of your fathers, the god of abraham, the god of isaac, and the god of jacob, has sent me to you: this is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations.. (john 8:24) i said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins: for if you do not believe that i am, you shall die in your sins.. (john 8:28) then jesus said to them, when you have lifted up the son of man, then you shall know that i am, and that i do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me, i speak these things.. (john 8:53) are you greater than our father abraham, who is dead?

and the prophets are dead: who do you make yourself?.

JosephMalik

Just look at John 8:58, Jesus used "I AM" as a Name or Title for Himself, and then the Pharisees wanted to murder him for blasphemy because He was claiming to be God!

Undisfellowshipped,

No! All one has to do is read the texts to see that this is a simply a response to their question. There is no connection with Exodus whatever. Besides the Greek text of John is not related to the Hebrew text of Exodus. Check a Septuigent and see how they translate Ex 3:14 into Greek. Our Lord did not say I am the Being (ego emi ho ohn) which is specific and used in the Septuigent not general as the simple I am (ego emi) used in John. Even the King James does not capitalize the phrase.

57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham? 58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Verse 58 simply responds to the question in verse 57. The Verily, Verily, is a Jewish idiom that indicates an absolute truth is now being uttered. And that truth is that He existed before Abraham was. Thus the I am is simply a historical fact and reference not a name. It indicates a prior existence already established in John 1:1. You will find additional information on such use in Beyond Trinitarianism found at http://localsonly.wilmington.net/jmalik/ There is no smoking gun here such as you indicate in your comments.

P.S. I just noticed that Ginosko argued well and the anger that the Jews displayed by such comments does not support your view. After all they were wrong and their error does not a truth make. You will find all this discussed in my document on the trinity.

Joseph

Edited by - JosephMalik on 30 August 2002 1:22:41

Edited by - JosephMalik on 30 August 2002 1:33:50

29

JESUS CHRIST -- I AM WHO I AM

by UnDisfellowshipped in

(exodus 3:13) and moses said to god, behold, when i come to the children of israel, and shall say to them, the god of your fathers has sent me to you; and they shall say to me, what is his name?

(exodus 3:14) and god said to moses, i am who i am: and he said, thus you shall say to the children of israel, i am has sent me to you.. (exodus 3:15) and god said moreover to moses, thus you shall say to the children of israel, jehovah the god of your fathers, the god of abraham, the god of isaac, and the god of jacob, has sent me to you: this is my name forever, and this is my memorial to all generations.. (john 8:24) i said therefore to you, that you shall die in your sins: for if you do not believe that i am, you shall die in your sins.. (john 8:28) then jesus said to them, when you have lifted up the son of man, then you shall know that i am, and that i do nothing of myself; but as my father has taught me, i speak these things.. (john 8:53) are you greater than our father abraham, who is dead?

and the prophets are dead: who do you make yourself?.

JosephMalik

Undisfellowshipped,

This was a waste of time. It all means nothing. The words used are self explanatory. Each verse must be understood in its own setting and not word matched as if the same thing was meant in all of them. Such words are also translation dependent and useless for the purpose of identification.

Joseph

Edited by - JosephMalik on 29 August 2002 9:0:32

24

ONE-WITNESS POLICY

by UnDisfellowshipped in

jw
friends

this is, i believe, a very important scripture for jehovah's witnesses to read -- because it proves that in the mosaic law, there was a one-witness policy for rape!.

i want to give a huge thank you to "nanoprobe" for pointing this out on another thread!

i think everyone should ask the society about this scripture!.

JosephMalik

undisfellowshipped,

You do not need all that. The answer is simple. When dealing with a crime the two witness rule does not apply. Scriptural laws have their limitations and must also be understood in this overall context, notice:

Col. 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: 15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: 16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: 17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

All Governments, good or bad were created by Him and for Him to maintain order until His Kingdom is established here in their place. The scriptures clearly state: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, (rulers with authority) and that are in earth, (common man under their control) visible (local and near) and invisible, (remote and far away as in Rome) whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: Everything described here is earthly and human and since such heavens belong to the Christ, avoiding them and their jurisdiction is unscriptural. Such authority includes the Church that exists along with such heavens and earth. So to your point and to some others that see this but cannot see the biblical involvement here is the scriptural precedent some are requesting. but again the WT has distorted such texts and their meaning so as to render such verses useless. Therefore the texts under discussion must be understood within this overall context as well and many answers have actually hit around this very point. The WT seeks to avoid this clear scriptural command by diverting attention away from it.

Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. 2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5 Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. 6 For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are Gods ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. 7 Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour.

A scriptural rule that Paul welcomed in his behalf.

Acts 25:10 Then said Paul, I stand at Caesars judgment seat, where I ought to be judged: to the Jews have I done no wrong, as thou very well knowest.

Joseph

39

The Last to be Resurrected :-(

by Lefty in

jw
friends

of course i know that many of you here do not believe in the bible and its promise of a resurrection.

some of you do not even believe in a creator.

but those of you apostates that still do believe in a resurrection back to life, you would no doubt agree that not everyone of those who are resurrected will come back to life all at once.

JosephMalik

That's sure a strange interpretation you have there. Revelation 20:5, 6 shows that those who will rule with Christ participate in what you agree is called "the first resurrection." Unless there is a resurrection that follows, it shouldn't be referred to as being the "first" one?

Lefty,

The revelation is a symbolic book and your view is more literal. In symbolic language this resurrection is symbolic of having come to life or justification. In fact this is stressed in this revelation. This does not happen for the nations until after the final test. The holy ones come to life at the time of their resurrection so their justification is first. Yet in this same chapter a few verses earlier we see the nations already in existence so where did they come from. After all the nations of Matt 25 are the sheep of the world so how is it that we see all the sheep of the nations and the holy ones together? I have not missed the point here, the Watchtower has.

Joseph

39

The Last to be Resurrected :-(

by Lefty in

jw
friends

of course i know that many of you here do not believe in the bible and its promise of a resurrection.

some of you do not even believe in a creator.

but those of you apostates that still do believe in a resurrection back to life, you would no doubt agree that not everyone of those who are resurrected will come back to life all at once.

JosephMalik

you would no doubt agree that not everyone of those who are resurrected will come back to life all at once. That means that someone will have to be first and someone will have to be last. Guess who those will be that will be at the rear of the line.

Lefty,

I do not see it. Can you prove this point first instead of taking it as a given? From what I am seeing in the texts, all resurrection will take place at the same time. If there is any delay then it is a minor one of no consequence. There is no such thing as two resurrections or an early resurrection. The first resurrection is one of quality and justification not first in time.

Joseph

Edited by - JosephMalik on 27 August 2002 22:31:39

37

A Rumor Bout Farkie

by comforter in

jw
friends

i hurd that farkie gut a thanking problem.

he cannot thank fur heemself.. is that true?.

comfy.

JosephMalik

Comforter,

But ya gotta givim qwedit becuz he postsalota gudstuf.

Joseph

4

Dont hunt worthless things

by happy man in

jw
friends

.

km .

sept , have this issu on side 8.. there i can read that if we putt out things from jw publikaitions on the net, we are breaking the law .. is this so, someone can tell, perhaps it is diffrent laws in diffrent countrys.

JosephMalik

this must be an important issu, in Km they say if you do this it is ato break the law of copyright.

is this not the truth?

Happy Man,

No, as I explained. Some people simply quote or reproduce material without comment and so are not using it fairly. They could simply ask, can you pick out the lies in this article and this would be fair use. But as I explained they are trying to scare you since they are not honest men.

Joseph

4

Dont hunt worthless things

by happy man in

jw
friends

.

km .

sept , have this issu on side 8.. there i can read that if we putt out things from jw publikaitions on the net, we are breaking the law .. is this so, someone can tell, perhaps it is diffrent laws in diffrent countrys.

JosephMalik

No, you are not breaking the law. Not if you use it as a refernce source which you are refuting and not if you do not publish the entire publication. Just quote from the parts that matter to you and respond with your comments. This is fair use and legal. The WT quotes from other publications all the time. They just want to scare you into shutting up.

Joseph

Edited by - JosephMalik on 25 August 2002 11:43:35

48

DISPROVE THE FAITHFUL AND DISCREET SLAVE

by minimus in

jw
friends

one of the most ingrained things for long time witnesses to change their viewpoint on is the fds.

i believe that due to the constant information at the meetings, conventions, publications and elder's talks, the doctrine of the faithful slave is pounded into everyone's heads.once a person sees the misunderstanding of this teaching, it's easier to critically see the wrongness of the watchtower.

can you suggest easier, less complicated rebuttals to this doctrine?

JosephMalik

Farkle,

Thanks for the support.

The Jerusalem thing was true also, but to say the apostles were wrong for years desite holy spirit being visited upon them or Christian Jews in Jerusalem and nearly everywhere else did not know what they were doing sounds crazy. And this went on for over 20 years at least. But it is true. It was not so different then and now. The fact that our Lord had to select Paul from among the opposers in order to represent Him in the office of Apostle should have opened some eyes but not the Watchtowers. Jesus will pick people from such sources when necessary just as he is using all of you in His service. Truth is stranger than fiction.

Joseph

Edited by - JosephMalik on 25 August 2002 9:24:13

48

DISPROVE THE FAITHFUL AND DISCREET SLAVE

by minimus in

jw
friends

one of the most ingrained things for long time witnesses to change their viewpoint on is the fds.

i believe that due to the constant information at the meetings, conventions, publications and elder's talks, the doctrine of the faithful slave is pounded into everyone's heads.once a person sees the misunderstanding of this teaching, it's easier to critically see the wrongness of the watchtower.

can you suggest easier, less complicated rebuttals to this doctrine?

JosephMalik

Minimus,

Well for one thing, the Jerusalem Congregation on which this GB was patterned was not faithful. It was dominated by James and many apostles who kept the LAW covenant. The apostle Paul who made two visits to Jerusalem for the express purpose of correcting them was nearly killed by James who demanded Paul take vows once again in the temple.

Only the Master can identify this slave as faithful or evil. So the slave is simply disciples good or bad living together in the world represented by all the churches in existence. The identification and judgment of them will not be done until He comes again. Since this has not yet occurred, their claim to be such is false. It is that simple.

Joseph