Posts by laverite

do you remember as a child or teenager that every time we preached and asked when it would stop the answer would be: "till jehovah tells us it is no longer necessary"?.

the amount of literature is dropped... there are no old bibles... they sell all kind of keylocations all across the globe etc etc etc ... all money is getting centered to one spot one way or another.. also... if shit is gonna happen worldwide (maybe a "normal" world war or something) it is actually not a strange thought that one day soon they may announce something like the following:.

laverite

It's all about busy work, keeping them obedient, and CONTROL.

36

I was not only just not invited, I was sent an uninvited letter..seriously?!

by freedom2bme in

jw
friends

here is my introduction letter.

my jw and biological sister is getting married this weekend and 3 weeks ago i received a letter actually uninviting me to this showy display.

i was stunned to say the least.

laverite

OTWO wrote: " Maybe others help will be a bit better." Not likely. OTWO nailed it.

Freedom2beme: Welcome! There's some good advice here. I couldn't possibly improve on anything OTWO wrote. Reread his post. Truly excellent advice.

50

Lying to children

by jwfacts in

jw
friends

zac's first tooth just fell out, and so people are telling him that the tooth fairy will come with money.

zac asked me if the tooth fairy is real.

i am at a loss as to what to say.

laverite

Paranoia agent wrote: "Buy a book on child psychology that is taught in tertiary education, or try google scholar for peer review articles on parent child relationships."

Thanks for the tip, but as a tenured professor of psychology, I have that covered quite nicely already. Sorry to say that you were wrong in your post.

To reply to a question by telling someone to buy a book, rather than explain your claim with empirical evidence is beyond flimsy. You made some broad claims, offered no evidence whatsoever, and when asked about that, you reply by saying buy a book. Nice.

Cult Classic wrote: "Make believe and fantasy has its place in the development of kids. It's not a bad thing. Most kids will seek/figure out the truth in a reasonable time." Your reply was this: " cult classic: psychological studies have said the exact opposite, what are you basing that on?" To claim that psychological studies say that make believe and fantasy do NOT have a place in child development is NOT true. No such studies exist. And to claim that children will not seek out for figure out the truth (e.g. separating fact from fantasy) is equally ridiculous. Total rubish.

It's quite rich that you asked for Cult Classic to back up statements with evidence (e.g. asking what are you basing that on?). Yet, when you were asked basically the same thing you reply with buy a book.

50

Lying to children

by jwfacts in

jw
friends

zac's first tooth just fell out, and so people are telling him that the tooth fairy will come with money.

zac asked me if the tooth fairy is real.

i am at a loss as to what to say.

laverite

JW Facts -

I came across this poem by the Russian poet Yevtushenko as a beginning first year undergraduate. It really hit home with me. I had only just had my "Aha!" moment discovering the real truth about The Truth TM . I felt angry and betrayed that I had been lied to for so long by family, "friends" and the Society. I will never forget that time in my life, and this poem became part of that. The poem may be taken at face value (which I prefer), or it may be a more symbolic criticism or both. As the reader, I relate to it best when I take it at face value. I have copied that poem below in case you are interested in reading it, if you haven't already come across it.

At that time in my life, I couldn't imagine ever telling a child any kind of lie whatsoever or even withholding truth from them. As a parent, I have felt very strongly that my children deserve to be told the truth. Of course, this needs to be done in developmentally appropriate ways. And, as far as lies about Santa, the Tooth Fairy, etc., I have become a little less rigid and a bit more flexible.

I realize that these constructs are structured into our culture, into children's experiences at school, etc. At preschool or school, children cannot help but be exposed to these "lies." I decided, for a number of reasons, to go along with the Tooth Fairy, etc. These reasons were mainly for practicality and also because it's just plain fun for the kids.

I word(ed) things carefully. When asked about Santa being real, I might tell a four year old that he is "real in our hearts." As they continue to sort real life from fantasy as they grow, they realize pretty soon that you are wording things a certain way and what that means -- in fact, they will ask outright about it! One of my children is still young enough to "believe" and the others do not feel they were lied to. They even express appreciation for how it was handled. Bonus: by not raising a three or four year old to be a party pooper (telling everyone the Tooth Fairy and Santa aren't real -- we didn't make enemies with the other parents and families. Also, because of the way things were worded and handled, the kids figured things out by the time they asked outright. So there was no big upset over finding out that Santa isn't "real." It was just natural, comfortable and it worked for our family.

Good luck sorting through what you want to do. Here's the poem I mentioned above:

Lies

Telling lies to the young is wrong.
Proving to them that lies are true is wrong.
Telling them that God's in his heaven
and all's well with the world is wrong.
The young know what you mean. The young are people.
Tell them the difficulties can't be counted,
and let them see not only what will be
but see with clarity these present times.
Say obstacles exist they must encounter
Sorrow happens, hardship happens.
The hell with it. Who never knew
the price of happiness will not be happy.
Forgive no error you recognize,
it will repeat itself, increase,
and afterwards our pupils
will not forgive in us what we forgave.

Yevgeny Yevtushenko, 1952

50

Lying to children

by jwfacts in

jw
friends

zac's first tooth just fell out, and so people are telling him that the tooth fairy will come with money.

zac asked me if the tooth fairy is real.

i am at a loss as to what to say.

laverite

Paranoia agent - what psychological studies are you referring to? Cult classic made an excellent point. What empirical evidence have you read that leads you to think that what cult classic wrote is not correct?

63

I made a huge mistake

by KariOtt in

jw
friends

its been a tough 6 months for my jw hubby and myself.

next saturday is our anniversary.

i wasn't sure we would make it with the turbulance of the last 6 months.

laverite

perfect1 - how is that weird? I make it a habit of buying gifts for myself.

9

OTWO, Careers and Life Changes

by laverite in

jw
friends

otwo, .

i keep thinking that after you retire from your current field (it's fire fighting, i think?

), you will still be very young and able to have a full second career.

laverite

JWDaughter -- I agree with you completely. It IS enough giving for one lifetime. And, OTWO really deserves that beach "career."

89

An Elder Reads CoC !!

by TTATTelder in

i have recently joined the site.

i was just appointed an elder this summer.

i started discovering the ttatt (the truth about the truth) last year after putting a few things together myself concerning the leadership and then doing some research online.. i really enjoyed jwfacts.com, jwsurvey, and others.

laverite

CoC is a lovely book indeed. Welcome!