Posts by ihadnoidea

36

4 Suicides I Am Aware Of This Year, Why Elders, COs Are Not Competent To Handle These Matters. (Life Or Death, Your Choice!)

by AvocadoJake in

jw
friends

i would like to relate with the first suicide that took place this year, this was more than seven months ago.

this person was deeply distraught and was talking about killing themself.

the conduct of this person started to escalate (deep depression with morbid thoughts.

ihadnoidea

56

Effects of the Evolution Theory

by mankkeli in

effects of the evolution theory.

in the early 19th century, religion and science enjoyed a fairly amicable relationship.

just two years before the origin of species was published, biologist and harvard professor louis agassiz wrote that the living world shows premeditation, wisdom, greatness and that a major purpose of natural history was to analyze the thoughts of the creator of the universe.. agassiz viewpoint was not uncommon.

ihadnoidea

I do not know why I am commenting here, but I guess I would like to hear a nice conversation about Evolution vs ID/Creationism. Even if Evolution is false (I personally agree with Evolution), creationism or intelligent design are not by default the winner. They also need proof (And I might be tempted to believe them if given this proof). I always ask myself why would an intelligent loving God create viruses, evil bacteria, and parasites? Even if it was some sort of population control, is there not a better way then subjecting creation to pain, torment, and then death. These things are not some recent addition either, they recently discover the malaria parasite goes back 100 million years (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/11/111102125650.htm). That is not the only evil, how about asteroids, earthquakes (cause by the "design" of the earths surface), volcanos, and naturally occuring forest fires? To me, creationism/ID leaves to many questions.

13

When is it time to fully open up to a spouse

by ihadnoidea in

jw
friends

recently my very active jw wife has been more critical of the wt and some of their stances.

she has particularly been critical of topics that hit home to some of the things going on in lives of our families.

i am still going through the motions as an active servant, but i am mentally out.

ihadnoidea

Recently my very active JW wife has been more critical of the WT and some of their stances. She has particularly been critical of topics that hit home to some of the things going on in lives of our families. I am still going through the motions as an active servant, but I am mentally out. I am wondering when do I fully tell her I do not believe in the org anymore. When do you get enough vibes to open up? I am really thinking now that she would be receptive to an honest discussion of the WT and the Bible, but I could also be seeing what I want to see. I could be very wrong, and mess things up. What was some of the signs that told you to open up fully?

I should also describe what I mean by opening up. I have had discussion on some doubts I have, but the discussion is usually very one side (really more of a lecture rather then a discussion). Usually I present a doubt and then I am given a wait on jehovah speech. I then stop talking for fear of raising any suspicions.

24

Past Organized Attempts to Level the Playing Field with WTBTS

by Band on the Run in

i am new to jw dissidents.

a couple of weeks ago i created a post asking what attempts have been made in the past to organize some opposition.

personally, i don't feel it would be fruitful to challenge the wt first amendment benefits.

ihadnoidea

I agree with everyone here that its probably best with education, but I noticed you said you were a lawyer in another thread. I was wondering, could the WTBTS be sued for keeping the flock book secret? Considering that every JW will will be judged by that book, it does not seem right that only elders have access to it. Now, I know they could argue that the watchtower and awake cover the same topics, but they do not go and spell out what exactly is a DF offense vs a minor sin in great detail like that book does. It really is more like a rule book, the rule book you will be judged by.

Another question, related to the above. Could some one challenge the disfellowshipping arrangement on the basis of being judged by a secret rules book they never saw? Kind of like being fired from a job due to a rule that was never disclosed to you.

21

Surprised reaction

by truthseeker1969 in

my brother who attends meetings was at the hall when they were explaining the "generation" new lite.. he said he was stunned when a rumble went through the congo which he said sounded like "oh here we go again" and then laughing.. the brother sittig next to him said 'what next" and after the meeting a lot of people were mad that instead of leaving what they do not know they re-invented it.. elders were being surrounded by people asking them to explain it.. this happened a few weeks ago but there is also alot of anger at the "mentally diseased " comment made by the gb as people view it as an outright attack on family members.

i think i smell trouble.. he is not one who shuns and told the elders that until they show him where jesus said shun then he will continue to talk to me.. one elder told him that if he persists in talking to me then he could be brought before a committe to which he told him "it would be your funeral".

so me thinks they are truly in a panic!.

ihadnoidea

I still go and have not seen such a visible reaction at the hall I attend. In my area I think the mindset of going along with the slave has even gotten stronger for all the older ones, and some of the younger adults. Probably due to the recent uptick in articles focused on the topic of obeying the slave. I have had only 2 conversations where a witness had a reaction something like, "when are they going to change that teaching on generations next, chuckle" or "well that is the current thought, but we do not really know". Those comments have a subtle admission of the fact that they do not really know what they are talking about. Still I have also had conversations with a lot of witnesses saying things like, "see we are not in darkness like all the rest of mankind, such light". I think the topic of evolution and science are having a greater affect then these doctrinal points. A lot of youth are going through school being taught these topics, and then at the family study get misinformation & misquotes. Some youth are seeing through this hence all the recent articles focused on these topics. It maybe also affecting younger adults too. I love the fact that we are having a campaign in july using the "Was Life Created" brochure, maybe a few discussions with people at the door will stir a few to research evolution more.

18

Confirmation Bias

by allelsefails in

i've read a lot of crap in my life (not just wts) and i have finally found the phrase to describe almost every religious wrting i've read.

"confirmation bias" affects how jws look at historical facts, how dems and repubs look at economic facts, or how all people look at information presented to them.

i still go to meetings every once in a while to make my wife and my boss feel better about me, but sometimes i can't believe how idiotic some things are.

ihadnoidea

I think to a degree we all are affected by confirmation bias. I think though the org takes it to a whole another level by controlling the information you can even evaluate.

I am not sure if this qualifies as a confirmation bias, but will mention anyway. People will often use certain Bible scriptures to say that Bible is scientifically correct (in there interpretation), and therefore from God. Yet, other religious books are scientifically correct at times too. For example, Hinduism has the age of the universe at 19 billion years which is close to estimates given by modern day scientists (Google hinduism 19 billion for a reference). I think those same people would dismiss that other religions are correct scientifically at times, yet still use that talking point on the Bible as a defense to it being from God.

13

WTS Quotes on Evolution

by sizemik in

the official wts website has a short article entitled .

is evolution compatible with the bible?.

http://www.watchtower.org/e/20080101a/article_01.htm.

ihadnoidea

I actually almost yesterday started a thread on that exact article. It unbelievable on many levels. I find it also ironic that they use the tactic of labeling evolution a religion. Hello, you guys are a religion too. So what are you saying religion is not based on evidence? If so, what about you guys?

I also find it unbelievable how they paint the evolution scientists motives.

Teachers of evolution are often motivated, not by the facts, but by their own desires—perhaps a desire to be accepted by a scientific community in which evolution is orthodox doctrine.

First, would not a scientist want to prove evolution wrong and appear even more wise then the other scientists? Is that not the whole point for a scientist. To continue discoverying new things, even if it proves earlier thought wrong. And as a added benefit be rewarded with even more prestige if you do.

Second, from my own personal experience I know that if you ask a random JW to explain evolution, 99% will get it wrong. So who is motivated to fit in to a community really? The scientist who examines both sides? Or the JW that only examines one side because they want to continue as part of the community and not be shunned by there family if they dare question the thoughts on evolution. I use to be in the 99% myself, its not there fault. Its all this ill informed anti-evolution propaganda you are bombarded with that you never would dare learn about the subject.

29

Why can't you ask questions?

by ihadnoidea in

i know that some will disagree on this, and say you can ask questions.

yet, i ask you to honestly think what would happen if you openly started asking questions on jw doctrine or evolution.

likely you would be made to feel like i did below if you started asking these questions to other jws.. .

ihadnoidea

I know that some will disagree on this, and say you can ask questions. Yet, I ask you to honestly think what would happen if you openly started asking questions on JW doctrine or evolution. Likely you would be made to feel like I did below if you started asking these questions to other JWs.

I grew up in a family that were JWs for a few generations. I was raised in the JW ideaology from birth, and had only a view into the world around me in small fragments. I really think this is the reason that I never had any questions my entire life on JW doctrine, evolution, or the Bible. Everything seemed to make total sense in my limited view. Yet, when I became witness to certain things both in the congregation and in my personal life I started to have some questions. In addition, a householder sparked some additional questions for me. Unfortunately, I found out right away that there is no open forum for asking questions available to JWs inside the org. I found that having questions is conflated with being spiritually weak or being an apostate. Because of this I felt guilty for even asking questions. They caused me to stop asking questions, but not forever. I started having questions again, but this time I decided to research my questions in the publications. I will admit that sometimes my question had reasonable answers in the JW publications, but alot of my question were not answered in the publications. Since I still have questions after reading diligently the publications it raises the question, why can't I ask questions openly? Why do I hit a road block, possibly even being called an apostate if I do?

Note: To avoid distracting from the main question, I will not post any of my questions in this thread.

61

JWs and the Family Unit - Calling Maze to defend assertions

by Retrovirus in

in the thread about the wt in russia, maze made the assertions below.. .

jehovah's witnesses as an organization acts as a protection to the family unit.

andthe lie that jehovah's witnesses ruin families is apostate poison.. to aviod derailing that thread, i ask maze to defend them here.. my experience is that the jw religion destroyed my brothers' marriage.

ihadnoidea

I am not looking to totally take a side in this debates, but I am of the opinion that religion in general can be used as another way to divides people including families. If its not race, culture, or the part of the world you live its belief or religion people often use to create "us" and "them" divides. When everyone is part of the same religion, lets say in this case being a Jehovah Witness everything maybe great. In fact, the time shared together doing something probably will bring people closer. Having some moral guide too may not hurt either. The problem is when it becomes a dividing line. I think some Jehovah Witnesses will use it as a dividing line, and create a hostile environment. In these cases the WT will do more harm then good. I am thinking this guy has a good situation, so he is defending what he is experiencing. My question would be does the Jehovah Witness faith actually better at keeping people married then other faiths? I do not think you can support this assertion with any marriage statistics. So if your situation is good, maybe it has less to do with your faith and more to do with other factors.

7

Went to the special day assembly

by ihadnoidea in

jw
friends

it was mostly same old information.

the theme was seeking refuge in jehovah.

the part that really only stood out to me is the one knock they took toward education.

ihadnoidea

Yep, you are preaching to the choir. I think the world is changing too. I think education will becoming more of a requirement as time goes on. People need to be more specialized compared to times past.

@PG There was about the same amount of people as last year. There was a mix in age groups hard to tell a trend, but I would say it skewed older in general.