Posts by MeanMrMustard

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

That depends on your point of view and how you interpret the story.

Doesn't matter. Pick one.

God doesn't lie any more than God tells the truth. To do claim such things is to make God in the image of humans.

That's word salad. Utter nonsense.

To do that is to make an idol out of God.

More obfuscatuon.

Remember these are just stories.

So? It's just a story then. IN THE STORY, the character of God, completely fictional, lies.

NRSVue and similar translations it just reads "you will surely die." No mention of a "day." So where is the lie? They did die, right?

No. There is an implied causal relationship, such that if they had refrained from their action, they would not have died. You have turned the verse into no more than a phrase such as: "do not eat from it or the sun will rise tomorrow."

Unless you offer a different definition of "die" .....

Or did Adam and Eve ever exist? Does God exist?

If none of them exist, did anyone lie?

Yeap. In the story God lied.

The boy who cried wolf is a fictional story. Are you saying he didn't cry wolf because we cant point to a real boy crying wolf? Good lord.

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

So...

In conclusion, even if the story is borrowed... err... stolen.... err... culturally appropriated, it's still God lying about the fruit.....

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

A baby goat rather than a child. Although…

The point there was really that it is an inconsistent list of commandments

Maybe not... if you consider back in the day when you didn't have a knowledge of good and evil, well, God might decide throw in one of the old commandments for good measure. We already know (from new manuscripts) Adam probably had some goat issues.... Kinda like a "Oh and by the way, don't do this... the first guy had some trouble with it, but you should know better since the whole tree thing.... but I'll say it for good measure".

You know, its like getting a superman cape from the costume store and it says "doesn't actually make you fly" on a warning label. You just know someone did something dumb in the past...

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

‘don’t boil a kid in its mother’s milk’

This does seem like a reasonable requirement though...

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

@KOW:

Were you able to read the new manuscript, recently unearthed, that I had no hand in creating, documenting further interactions between God and Adam? I pasted the translation on page 6 of this thread.

Since you view these stories as a way of communicating deeper truths, not to be taken as literal history (a view I share), what sort of lesson do you see in the new manuscript text?

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

Jeez Jeffro - the dude says he actually hates you. Wow. I mean, wow. What did you do to him?

He loves me though. I'm definitely in the "everyone else" category.

52

What would happen if the religion just straight out gets outed as bad? The ORG admits to it and all the members get told to disperse

by Starlight.vee in

like the org just gives up and comes out saying that all of what they are saying is untrue and that there is no armageddon, nothing.

how do y’all think the the members still in it would react?.

there be a mental health crisis i perhaps.

MeanMrMustard

Isn't this question kinda like : "What if all our cats turn to unicorns and solved world poverty by knitting quality jeans?"

2908

It's been a long 9 years Lloyd Evans / John Cedars (continued)

by Simon in

jw
friends

uh oh, looks like the mega thread gave up the ghost, so while i investigate / fix it just continue the discussion here .... it's been a long 9 years lloyd evans / john cedars.

MeanMrMustard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9HBTcgECQQ

64

Ages of each user here?

by ukpimo in

jw
friends

i'm interested to know the age demographics here.

it must be significantly different to other exjw forums.

it would be a damning report for watchtower if most of us appear to have left for decades.. you don't have to mention your exact age, you could always say "in my 50s".. i am in my 70s.

MeanMrMustard

Would you also like my home address, phone number, full name and SSN?

299

Who told the first lie?

by nicolaou in

this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?

god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.

in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.

MeanMrMustard

Just had an interesting interaction with a Rabbi online.

I've never started a post with that statement. Congrats.

...the pericope is a dramatization of the superiority of humans over animals in their "being like God". This elevation has the consequences (cost) of self-awareness (nakedness) and acute sense of mortality (day you eat you will die). Rather than being a 'fall' in fact it was a celebration of human intelligence and psychology while acknowledging our mortality.

I agree.

There are stories like this in indigenous groups everywhere.

Yeap.

No argument from me.

But there are two categories of Bible readers: those that think Genesis is literal history, and those that do not. Clearly it's less insane to not think of it as actual history.

But if you do.. well, there's a lot of internal problems with the story.