" informing us that the organization is set to rake in millions upon millions from the sale of the Watchtower buildings so "they can move upstate". "
It just doesn't sound like a christian witness that they should be proud of.
Listener
JoinedPosts by Listener
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New York Tourist Crap Highlights The Watchtower buildings in Brooklyn
by steve2 inwell i'm a day shy of having spent one week in new york - my first time.
what a dazzlingly vibrant and noisy city - one that never sleeps.
new yorkers rightly proclaim this metropolis as one of a kind.
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NEW UK BETHEL - START SAVING
by St George of England ina letter was read tonight at the meeting with this information.. apparently, three years ago the gb authorised the uk bethel to consolidate all the uk resources.
so far over 300 sites have been looked at but more information will be forthcoming.. in the meantime we can work to this end by saving so that we can contribute to the new facility.. also skilled and unskilled trades people can register for volunteer work, collect an application form from the secretary.. to me it seems like they are going to move out of london (mill hill, bittacy hill etc), get a cheaper area, pay for the new facility with donations and free labour.
they will then sell all the high value property and probably send the money to the us.
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Listener
They can now be considered as the Watchtower Building & Tactic's Society.
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hello. pls help. getting married soon. afraid i won't be happy because wtbts said so.
by seasickbumblebee inalshello.
i'm a practicing jw.
finally decided to create an account to see whether you could all help me.. so i am engaged to this wonderful wonderful man and in three months time we'll be married.
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Listener
I don't know the article that you're referring to but they should be adhering to the principles stated in their shepherding book, although I do recall there was some new light on viewing pornography but they've become less strict in this area, not more.
I am so sorry that you are feeling the way you are. It would seem that you are really worried that you haven't been specific when you first confessed, is this your issue at the moment or is it something more?
There is probably no real need for concern. You confessed to the elders something they believed was wrong and of a sexual nature and they counselled you. It only happened once and was clearly not a d/f offence. As elders they need to remind you that you can't do this again and they will be checking up to see if you do or not. It is just a warning.
It is no good to let this eat you up, this should be one of the happiest times in your life. If you have to, go to one of the elders who was on the JC and tell him you weren't being totally upfront about the description of your activities, you were embarassed and you thought there was no difference between the sin of your breasts being touched and other forms of foreplay (I forgot about that word but it is sufficient to use to describe the incident). Tell him how terrible you both feel and want to just put it from you but something you read made you think that you needed to clarify this. It would be helpful if you brought him a copy of a Watchtower article that lumps these two sins together.
Be very particular in which elder you choose to speak to, preferably one who is elderly, old fashioned and compassionate. It may be that he is too embarrassed to go into further details and will agree with you and leave it at that. He may also see how this has truelly affected you and your own feelings have been in such a state that you are repentant.
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I'm thinking about going back
by Corboy101 ini have been out for 22 years.i was raised as a jehovahs witness.
i was baptized in 1986 but soon after left the religion.
theres a whole lot to the reasons why i left, but i left.
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Listener
You mentioned that you have a number of non JW friends. If you become a witness you will find that this is greatly discouraged and if known, you will likely be counseled about it Watchtower 73 5/15 "To illustrate, in a congregation certain ones may fail to heed the Scriptural warning concerning worldly associations, perhaps even “dating” an unbeliever. (1 Cor. 7:39; 15:33; 2 Cor. 6:14) They may do this though counseled often regarding the matter. The elders, from the platform and otherwise, may even have emphasized the Bible’s counsel and warning against such conduct, not, however, naming the individuals involved. What then? Then, if approached and invited to share in such worldly association by a member of the congregation, the ones approached would ‘mark’ such a one as “disorderly” in this regard. They certainly would not want to associate with him in his course. In some cases, parents might find it necessary to instruct their children to restrict their association with certain young persons in the congregation who may be showing themselves “disorderly” in such ways. Elders, of course, would be careful not to use such ones in any exemplary capacity."
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My first experience at KH
by InChristAlone inthank you to all of you who commented yesterday.
no doubt you gave me an accurate description of what to expect.
when i first walked in, i was greeted by the jw who calls on my house.
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Listener
Thanks for the detailed post InChristAlone and for the opportunity to ask you some questions.
"The focus of the entire talk and WT study seemed to be on taking in an accurate knowledge of God...but not about knowing or experiencing God. To me, this is huge."
You often hear from members on this forum that when sitting through meetings they feel something is missing and this is probably what it is. I can't understand how we could truelly appreciate God's love if we focus too much on taking in an accurate knowledge. Unfortunately, this is why the org feels a great need to keep pumping out new publications and have grown their organization on this basis.
I wondered how many people were at this meeting and roughly a break down of ages? In particular the numbers of say 20 to 30 year olds?
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This is well worth remembering
by The Quiet One inhttp://www.theguardian.com/uk/2001/oct/08/religion.world?view=desktop.
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Listener
This was a resolution made by JWs at assemblies around the world and published in the Watchtower 1963 10/15
"This Resolution stressed that Jehovah’s witnesses recognize that the one true God is Jehovah, that the Bible is his written Word, that Jehovah God is the Sovereign of the Universe, that men and nations have set up the United Nations rather than surrender to the sovereignty of God’s Messianic Kingdom, and that though nations have given idolatrous worship to that political image, this Jehovah’s witnesses refuse to do. The Resolution showed that radical governments have been formed, but that “We, as witnesses of God, the Source of life, will maintain our Christian steadfastness and have no part in such radical movements, but will hold fast to our Christian neutrality toward all radical and other types of human government over earth.” It stressed that the nations are being led by invisible wicked spirits to Armageddon, but that “we will not march with them to Har–Magedon, for we refuse to fight against God Almighty and his kingdom.” Jehovah’s witnesses, it was resolved, will continue to declare to all the ‘everlasting good news’ concerning God’s Messianic Kingdom"
They stated that they would have no part of it.
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had another conversation with my wife this morning
by Crazyguy inshe was getting already for service so i asked her "how do you do it?
" "how do you still go and do all this spiritual stuff now that you know that my research and letter to bethel shows that the jw religion denies us the messiah"?
she got all defensive and disagreed again with what i wrote to bethel and then i had to step in and tell her that its "its them that teaches that we don't have a mediator in christ and were not under the new covenant".
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Listener
You are making her think otherwise she wouldn't need to go to the elders for reaffirmation. It will be interesting to find out what she has to say after speaking to the elders.
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Branch Organization Manual! download .....
by notgoinback inas my second post on this forum, i want to share this with you guys!
this is the official branch organization manual (updated 2003) of jehovah's witnesses:.
http://jhonlemos.files.wordpress.com/2011/07/branch-organization-watchtower.pdf.
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Listener
The manual is so detailed, I wonder how the apostles managed in Jesus' day.
It is obvious that being considered a pioneer means everything to some JWs -
...."Just because a person is old is no reason to put him on the infirm list. If an older pioneer who develops health problems is willing to transfer to the publisher ranks, there is no need to encourage the individual to become an infirm pioneer. Rather, the infirm list is a provision only for those who desire to remain on the pioneer list, feeling they would be taking a backward step if they adjusted to the publisher ranks, or who have had a heartfelt desire to serve always as regular pioneers."
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hello. pls help. getting married soon. afraid i won't be happy because wtbts said so.
by seasickbumblebee inalshello.
i'm a practicing jw.
finally decided to create an account to see whether you could all help me.. so i am engaged to this wonderful wonderful man and in three months time we'll be married.
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Listener
"does intimacy even sex before marriage ruin it all?"
As a general question, the answer is no, unless you want to listen to what the Watchtower has to say about it then the answer is likely to be yes.
The Awake states this 71 5/8
Petting often leads to a lack of respect for each other, guilty consciences, venereal disease and unwanted pregnancies.
It doesn't matter what we say because your fiance has already stated that the Watchtower states you will lose respect for each other. Because he believes what is told to him in the Watchtower, this is very likely to happen. He will feel there is something wrong with him and he is not feeling guilty enough if it does not happen.
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hello. pls help. getting married soon. afraid i won't be happy because wtbts said so.
by seasickbumblebee inalshello.
i'm a practicing jw.
finally decided to create an account to see whether you could all help me.. so i am engaged to this wonderful wonderful man and in three months time we'll be married.
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Listener
This is from the elders book and is kept strictly out of view by a JW, which means you will not be able to show it to him.
Passion-arousing
heavy petting
or caress ing of breasts on numerous occasions be tween individuals not married to each other. If such conduct occured on a few isolated occa-Sions, especially between two persons involved in a courtship with the intent to marry counsel from two elders may suffice to handle such mi nor uncleanness. The elders should inform the coordinator of the situation. However; if the conduct occurred on numerous occasions
and the actions escalated in gravi ty and frequency, it may constitute gross uncleaness with greediness, requiring judicial action Their \.vrongdoing may constitute brazen conduct if they give evi dence of a disrespectful, insolent attitude toward God's laws.
For example the individuals rnay
have no honorable intentions of pursuing marriage.
Sorry about the format.
You're in a dilema and I think you are right. It sounds like the problem will eat away at your marriage if you do get the courage to go through with it and you should seriously consider the advice you have been given on this thread.
If he goes back to the elders to confess about the whole incident, in theory and according to their guidebook the matter should be treated just the same as if he had only been touching your breasts. But now the problem is that he was not honest in the first place and these elders can be a very odd bunch in their thinking. Notice how the above says that their could be action if the person shows an insolent or disrespectful attitude? They could consider they you both contrived to hide information from them as being very disrespectful. You just don't know with these guys.
But it is likely that what he did was wrong and you took part in it will always be remembered with a guilt feeling. This is what is taught in the Watchtower
Watchtower 81 11/1
An engaged Christian couple who were soon to be married let their guard down and engaged in “uncleanness.” (Gal. 5:19) Looking back, the young man admitted: “Most of the time we had a chaperone. But those few times we didn’t hurt us.” Other youngsters later thanked their parents for being strict and carefully monitoring their entertainment, for they remained chaste and entered marriage with no regrets or bad memories. If your child’s intentions are honorable, he should not resent your godly discipline, for it is “the way of life.”—Prov. 6:23.
Do you want to live with a person who has regrets and bad memories about a situation that was driven by your sexual attraction and how likely is that going to affect your future sexual relationship? It is one of the great joys of being married.
You've got to ask yourself why you couldn't sort this out together and why it had to be taken to an elder? More importantly, why have the elders not been clear on the matter in their discussions with you both? If they didn't mention anything about touching genitals then you could take it that it didn't matter in your situation because, as the article above shows, both heavy pettying and touching the breasts are treated the same.
What you could show him is the article in the 2006 7/15 Watchtower
"Suppose an engaged couple indulged in passion-arousing heavy petting on numerous occasions. The elders might determine that even though these individuals did not manifest a brazen attitude characterizing loose conduct, there was a measure of greediness in their conduct. So the elders might take judicial action because gross uncleanness was involved. Gross uncleanness might also be appropriate grounds for handling a case involving a person who repeatedly makes sexually explicit telephone calls to another person, especially if he was previously counseled about the matter."
Do you notice how it talks about 'numerous occassions'? The writers are very specific at times in what they say, if they were to include a heavy petting session which happened only once, they would have said so.
If he is supposed to be the future head of your household then why didn't he do some research on the matter or ask someone discreetly? Now he is imposing his conscience onto you and his behavious is seriously affected, especially if he is getting depressed about it, as you say. It has taken you to do some research on the matter.
This brings me to another problem. If he knew or the elders knew that you had posted on an apostate website about the matter, even though it was looking for advice, their could be serious consequences for you.