Posts by Retrovirus

216

Religious Reform

by Maze in

as a bible based organization, how do feel jehovah's organization should be reformed?

the answer is quite simple in christendoms churches:.

1. reject false doctrines like the trinity and 'all christians go to heaven' and use of images in worship.. .

Retrovirus

how do feel Jehovah's Organization should be reformed

Hello again, Maze!

I'll ignore thefact that your post is actually about bashing other churches and just answer the question.

It doesn't matter much that the Watchtower B&TS (which you haven't shown to be "Jehovah's Organization") teaches inconsistant and demonstably wrong doctrine, except when lives are placed at risk.

The level of control by entirely fallible men is a concern, but there will always be those who want external reassurance rather than to think for themselves.

The real problem is shunning. Not disfellowshipping - any church can break ties with a non-conforming member - but SHUNNING.

Breaking up families over beliefs is wrong. Teaching intolerance of the beliefs of others is wrong. Using affection within family and between friends as blackmail is wrong.

If you have "the truth" and God's protection, why do the beliefs of others need to be feared?

Jehovah's Witnesses adhere to God's Word

Yeah, sure. The bits that suit the GB at the time anyway. God is love and Jesus did not shun anyone.

Retro

70

I'm new to the whole JW religion - Can someone please explain the basics?

by Jackals in

i recently began a wonderful relationship with a guy who also happened to be a jw.

i have learned alot about him and how the religion effects his life and now i am interested in learning more about the religion - but from a beginners' point of view.

could anyone give me an idea of the basic beliefs and practices of jws?.

Retrovirus

Hi Jackals,

Welcome! I'm another non-jw with friends and family in.

Suggest you read the "best of" threads for a start.

Basically this is a high-control religion, and it's hard for believers to behave authentically.

Good luck, Retro

23

Another newguy here

by shakyground in

jw
friends

hmmm where do i start?

well, i have been lurking on here for about 6 months.

i was raised around the witnesses all my life.

Retrovirus

Welcome!

As a non-jw all I'll add is that we cannot find peace and security in an organisation, each of us needs to follow our own path. Even the wt agrees- at least until the path leads away from the org!

Best wishes, and keep researching.

Retro

43

Astounded Newbie Here...Waves Hello

by mummatron in

jw
friends

all i can say is "wow!

" in the 10 years i've been out i had no idea that forums like this existed.

a tad naive-sounding for someone with a background in it, i know, but it's taken me this long just to feel comfortable enough to type 'jw' into google.

Just worn out

by EmptyInside in

jw
friends

i thought it best i stay a lurker.

it's just right now, i'm going through some doubts and just plain discouraged.

sometimes, trying to do everything just wears me out, and i feel like i'm suffocating.

Retrovirus

EmptyInside, you made me cry at work, Dammit! That was such a sad first post and I'm so glad things are better for you now.

As a non-jw but with a less than ideal upbringing and attitude, I felt very empty inside too at a few points of my life, and also despaired of things improving in the future. In one of those times I started "studying" with jws at the instigation of my SIL. I couldn't believe, but tried to, so they would keep visiting.

But good times came as well as bad. It's strange; when my jw ladies called after stopping the regular "studies" they clearly expected me to feel abandoned. That triggered my self-reliance and things started to turn around. Now that I'm more comfortable I can see how hard their life is with low incomes, illness and the many calls on their time. Depression can make me very self-centered.

A pity they can probably never really be my friends, but there's all the rest of the world, and everything to learn and do.

Enjoy the freedom and be happy.

41

World Destruction

by Maze in

i remember an alternative song released in the 1980's.. .

nothing has changed since then for the better, only for the worse.

will humanity bring the world to a permanent end if divine intervention wasn't a factor to take into consideration?

Retrovirus

Proof for the main point of the OP - a song.

Maze is asked

Tell me Maze, when in human history (not the mythical Garden of Eden) were things better than today?

and dodges the question by replying

There's more evidence for creation than mythical ape-men

From Maze's previous post, which at least was an attempt to address "World Destruction"

These signs of the last days have dramatically intensified in the 20th century. It's only been in the 20th century that we've had the technology to “ruin the earth"

Except that the Biblical word - erets - means earth in the sense of "ground", not "world". Thus every time a yard is laid with cobblestones the "earth" is ruined. No need for advanced technology.

If you really believe your strained interpretation, Maze - hope you don't drive a car.

3

Do you find JW's have a way of getting in your head & you can't shake it?

by InterestedOne in

jw
friends

i have a jw acquaintance whom i do odd jobs for because we supposedly became friends a few years ago.

we became acquainted before i knew about her worldview.

when i do odd jobs for her, sometimes in passing she will make not-overtly-religious-but-still-jw-type comments that make my skin crawl, but i don't respond.

Retrovirus

Hi InterestedOne,

I know the feeling well. Learning to be appropriately assertive yet not bossy will take me a lifetime, I think!

Your friend knows she is right (has "The Truth" ) and therefore whatever she tells you is beneficial and all you're allowed to do is agree. So she is on a win-win (either you agreed and her belief is validated, or she "gave a fine witness" but you couldn't accept it because Satan asserted his power).

So, see, you are not conversing or exchanging ideas. She'll put her biassed spin on whatever you say or do.

That leaves it up to you. Some possibilities:

1. Raise a question that the jw belief cannot answer (How can we know that Christ chose the org in 1916 or whenever is a good one) . Until she gives a definitive answer to whatever question you pose, just smile and remind "you know you haven't answered my question and that's why I think differently".

2. Counter a subject switch or "wise counsel" with a hurt, bewildered look and ask "Did I say that? How did you understand that from this?" "Could we get back to the point, please?"

She may still end the "friendship" or limit contact, and may still deduce that she was persecuted for her religion. Just remember - it wasn't a friendship; if she could say anything and you could not, you were being used. And that in jw-mode, there is no logic to anything she says or believes. None of this prevents you from enjoying life in your own way.

All the best, Retro

116

I've Decided That It'll Be Best For Me To Return To The Kingdom Hall.

by Philadelphia Ponos in

jw
friends

after carefully evaluating the my current life situation, i've come to the conclusion that returning to the hall will be best for me.

i simply just don't fit in with the rest of the world.

i don't drink, smoke, have sex, go to clubs, listen to worldly music, watch movies, or gamble.

Retrovirus

Thanks, PP, now that I understand I'd agree with the majority here. Making friends is not easy for us all; I'm an introvert myself.

However, what Morbidzbaby said is very true. After many months of "studies" and converstaion, I regarded the jw ladies who visited as friends, but I was dropped as soon as they decided that I didn't make the grade, and it hurt.

So I'd say, take the harder road, join groups that share an interest with you - sport, hobby, education, whatever, and build your relationships slowly but steadily.

Best of luck however you decide, Retro

116

I've Decided That It'll Be Best For Me To Return To The Kingdom Hall.

by Philadelphia Ponos in

jw
friends

after carefully evaluating the my current life situation, i've come to the conclusion that returning to the hall will be best for me.

i simply just don't fit in with the rest of the world.

i don't drink, smoke, have sex, go to clubs, listen to worldly music, watch movies, or gamble.

Retrovirus

PP, I'm confused.

When you started to post, you were planning to return to the jws in about a year. So, is this a continuation or have you changed your mind back and forth since then?

Not that there's anything wrong with changing your mind.

Also, knowing what you do about the governing body, could you go out in field service and try for new recruits?

Best wishes in any case, Retro

43

Is there no hope? (daughter getting baptized)

by camicia in

i'm really distraught about the fact my 23 year old daughter is ready to abandon a potential career in writing where her talent lies, and become a jehovah's witness.

i banned the study being held in our home, but it only hurt my relationship with my daughter, who screamed at me "i pay to live here and i'm not hiding, you're sabotaging my relationship with god!

" so i gave in.

Retrovirus

Welcome, Camicia!

I'm a non-jw with some friends and family in, and I remember how worried my children were that I even had discussions with jws.

It sounds like your daughter is attracted to the wt for emotional reasons (hell, perhaps everyone who opts in is). In this case opposition would be futile, even counter productive, and I know they teach new studies to be prepared for "satanic attacks" on their progress.

Perhaps you could just ask her questions, as if you were really trying to understand the religion. If you look at Black Sheep's posts, he has a lot of good ones. JWfacts is also very helpful.

Try to engage her with discussions and activities she enjoys, and will not have as a baptised jw. As a mother myself, I know you will work to keep close to her, and will be there for her even if she does take the dip. It sounds as if the has some doubts but is willing to ignore them, and this may not always be the case.

She is lucky that baptised or not, you are there for her, whatever she believes. This cannot be said for her jw "friends". I hope she realises this soon.

Good luck and keep in touch! Retro