Thanks, Old Goat, for sharing these details. The only "history" of the organization's early years I've read was the 1975 Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses and we all know how unreliable and biased it is.
Quendi
Posts by Quendi
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141881
by Old Goat inrachael de vienne is one of the authors of a separate identity, an exhaustive history of the watch tower's early years.
this is from her personal blog:.
http://wardancingpixie.blogspot.com/.
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G.B. TALK URGING CHILD BAPTISM!
by The Searcher inthe introduction & conclusion to this video is in german, but david splanes' words are loud and clear in english - get your kid baptized asap!.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h33pwdsuvlq&feature=youtu.be.
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Quendi
In answer to your query, problemaddict, I would say that while Samuel certainly served at the Shiloh tabernacle, no account was made of what his duties actually were. I doubt they involved more than doing chores around the place such as cleaning utensils and some groundskeeping. The duties of the priests and Levites were carefully outlined in the Law of Moses giving the most important jobs and duties to them. As a young boy, there would have been only minor things for Samuel to take care of. We are not told how long Samuel remained in Shiloh, either. He evidently had other interests in life and eventually married and fathered a family himself. So it wasn't as though he lived like a monk in some kind of isolation from others. He did serve as a prophet and judge in Israel for many years but he did not fill the latter office until he became an adult and not as a child.
As for Jesus, he was simply asking questions and being involved in some good give-and-take with the learned men in the Temple. When his parents ordered him to return home with them to Nazareth, he did so without a demur. He didn't refuse or otherwise give them any trouble. He was only twelve and he behaved like a twelve-year-old, albeit one with outstanding abilities. It's interesting to note that his parents did not conclude they should leave him behind in Jerusalem to pursue some other religious interests. In neither case were these boys expected to make a life-changing decision about their service to God or taking on duties that would have been too great for them to handle. Thanks for your question because we need to think about how to answer the Governing Body's folly on this issue.
Quendi
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2
Another Higher Education Faux Pas
by msecodo inat a recent special assembly day in casa grande, there was a talk about youths and the choices in life that are set before them.. .
during the talk, there was an interview of three people - two young girls (ages 13-16?
) and an older brother (age 969?).
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Quendi
I'll bet very few in the audience looked that far into the circumstances of these three people. The case of the structural engineer is particularly intriguing. I'm sure the speaker for that part did not ask the follow-up questions that would have revealed his post-secondary education, the money he made in his profession, or his further plans in it. That would have made too many think about their own futures, wouldn't it?
Quendi
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15
They may not pass the plate around like other churches, but they do mention contributions a couple of times
by Legacy inso i went to the international convention.
nice.
the org.
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Quendi
I attend the Metropolitan Church of the Rockies in Denver and yes, the collection basket is passed around. But we know where the money goes: the food bank the church runs; funding a shelter for homeless LGBT youth; a ministry for men in prison and other worthwhile community projects. By contrast, all the money collected in a local kingdom hall goes either to the branch office or world headquarters. None of it stays with the local community. I gladly contribute to my church now in confidence that the money is indeed going to causes I want to support and every penny is accounted for. Contrast that with the WTS which orders that congregation accounts be audited quarterly but issues no report to the congregation other than to say that 'everything was found to be in order.' What a crock!
Quendi
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69
G.B. TALK URGING CHILD BAPTISM!
by The Searcher inthe introduction & conclusion to this video is in german, but david splanes' words are loud and clear in english - get your kid baptized asap!.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h33pwdsuvlq&feature=youtu.be.
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Quendi
My experience as a high school teacher tells me that the entire concept of child baptism is not only wrong but insane! That experience showed me how young people lack the maturity to make the harch choices in life on their own but need the guidance and wisdom of their elders in many cases. It is as clear as glass that these men on the Governing Body not only have no experience working and living with young people, but have entirely forgotten what their own childhood and youth were like and about. We don't allow children to make up rules governing their own homes such as what food to eat, what bills to pay or what schools to attend, yet the WTS says they should be coerced into making the life-altering decision to be baptized as one of Jehovah's Witnesses!
The WTS cites examples like Samuel serving in Shiloh and Jesus talking to the learned men in the Temple as proof that children can get baptized. But as other posters on this thread have stated, this fallacious logic can easily be refuted by thinking people. Therein lies the problem. Witness adults have abdicated their own responsibility to think, ceding that to the WTS Governing Body. If the adults can't do something this basic, it should come as no wonder that their children are coerced into making bad choices.
Quendi
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51
Are JEhovah's Witnesses reaching out to the Gay community ?
by Watchtower-Free in.
apostate & ex-jehovalarious meme collection.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/jwmeme/.
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Quendi
I suppose it must have been nearly fifteen years ago when I received an interesting request from a woman in the congregation I really loved and respected. She wanted me to go on a return visit with her in a neighborhood in Boulder, Colorado that had multi-million dollar homes. I said yes, and as we pulled up to the house she gave me some background on the call.
"Quendi," she said, "the reason I want you to go with me on this call is because this house is owned by a gay couple. I have met both men and they are two of the nicest people you would ever want to meet. One of them is a lay minister who serves elderly people in some of the nursing homes here in town. We've been talking about hellfire and he is interested in some of the scriptures I've been sharing with him. I want you to come because I believe that NONE of the other brothers in the congregation will treat these men with the respect they deserve but I know you will." We subsequently had a nice call and this man and his partner were on my list of return visits until they moved away.
That experience has stayed with me even now almost ten years after being disfellowshipped for being a gay man. At that time, nobody in the congregation knew that I was gay. But this woman, who was very intelligent, kind-hearted and perceptive, had somehow divined that I was. She never talked about this with me, but always treated me with great affection and respect. She has passed away now and I think of our friendship as one of the few positive aspects of my life as a Witness. I believe the deeply entrenched homophobia she saw in the organization distressed her and was something she did not agree with. I was honored by her confidence in me and cherish the memory of our friendship. She never talked about my sexual nature with anyone else and that was another sign of the respect and regard she had for me.
But she was a rarity among Witnesses, the majority of whom would sooner spit on a LGBT person than reach out in any kind and/or loving way. I have come to believe that one reason for the Governing Body's unrelenting homophobia is that some of them are gay men themselves and are filled with self-loathing and self-hatred. They project those feelings on the membership, some of whom are dealing with the same issues themselves. As for the rest, since they believe the Governing Body are really spirit-anointed men, they fall into line and parrot what they hear and read. As we have discussed elsewhere, these are the hallmarks of a cult, and so we should not be surprised. Jehovah's Witnesses will never reach out to the LGBT community unless it is with a sledgehammer. To expect anything else is only to deceive oneself.
Quendi
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56
Kicking the "Gay Habit" at the IC
by breakfast of champions inheard from a reliable source that this was part of friday's program.
they even interviewed a "former gay man" who "kicked the gay habit".. evidently kicking the "gay habit" is difficult, not unlike quitting smoking or avoiding sugary snacks.
the persons who related this to me found the whole thing to be laughable at best, but honestly seemed quite disturbed by it (which is good!
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Quendi
Outrage, disgust and contempt are some of the feelings I have upon reading about this latest assault against LGBT people by the WTS at this IC. Yet there was a time that I would have been in total agreement with these sentiments--and I'm a gay man. For many years I was convinced that the WTS was God's organization and so its take on any subject was in line with divine standards. That meant for years I suffered the self-loathing and low self-esteem many LGBT people have. I didn't flush that out of my life until I made the decision to leave the Witnesses for good and all some years ago.
As for the man who claims to be free of his former sexual attractions, he's lying to himself and to his audience. He may have convinced himself and others that he is no longer gay. He may even marry a woman as further proof that he will never desire sexual contact with another man again. But as I pointed out to my judicial committee, all such "experiences" are nothing more than fairy-tales, and they have all the reality those stories do. That doesn't mean they have no effect on others. I wonder how many gay and lesbian youths were listening to this talk and were filled with false hope. How many older adults came away from this session thinking that their sexuality was nothing more than a bad habit that could be kicked just like smoking? On the other hand, how many others will find their despair grow and come to believe that since God has not answered their prayers for a cure, they must be worthless and that suicide is the only solution left?
I have long maintained that the WTS has the blood of many LGBT people on its hands. I told my judicial committee that suicide is the third-leading cause of death among young American men aged fifteen to twenty-four. How many of them were gay cannot be known, but we can be sure they make up a large segment of these victims. I asked the committee how many of these were young male Witnesses. They gave me no answer, but the looks of dread on their faces said it all. Despite this grim reality, the WTS has chosen to continue to spread its malicious and uniformed propaganda about this very sensitive and serious topic.
Since leabing the Witnesses, I haven't entertained any notion of returning. Threads like this one have only strengthened that resolve because I know that would be the equivalent of an emotional and spiritual death sentence. At the same time, I have enormous empathy for those still trapped, particularly gays and lesbians who only see the darkness deepening the longer they remain associated with this execrable cult. I hope they will find the will and courage to get out and lead the lives they were meant to lead and, if that is their choice, with a loving partner who will give them unconditionaland unqualified support. I was fortunate enough to have found such a man and am all the better off for it.
Quendi
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That does it ! I'm leaving ! ! !
by Billy the Ex-Bethelite inleaving the university with my degree!.
exams are finished and it's just a matter of days before i walk.. i was certainly stressed about doing this.
i'm older than my classmates and armageddon was sooooo close!
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Quendi
A belated congratulations to you, Billy, and best of luck for all your future endeavors! I was also a "non-traditional student" when I returned to college. In fact, I was old enough to be father to many of my classmates as well as being older than some of my professors. It made my graduation that much sweeter since I was an old dog who learned new tricks. Anyway, I'm extremely happy for you.
Quendi
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28
Disfellowshipping and reinstatement
by Lynnie inso i was visiting my older cousin who has been out of the jw's for many years but is still favorable.
to the whole nonsense and seems to be on the fence still after 35 years and she asked me "have you ever.
thought about going back?
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Quendi
Several factors played roles in my current status with Jehovah's Witnesses. I was disfellowshipped in 2005 and spent five years seeking reinstatement only because I wanted to have contact with people I loved and cared for. I have no immediate family in the organization so I couldn't be blackmailed that way. I refused to grovel before the judicial committee but instead constantly put them on the defensive with questions about WTS theology and policy. I was learning TTATT as well, and realized that I had no reason to embrace Witnessdom again. TTATT also made me realize that JWs are a cult and so are completely unhealthy for my mental, spiritual and emotional health.
The last straw for me was having the committee chairman tell me, "Quendi, we know it's been five years since you were disfellowshipped, but we still need more time to make a decision about your case." That was when I abandoned any and all further efforts to return. I have been much better off for doing so. A judicial committee is invested with the power to make or break people. Many elders serving on them revel in this and apply that power with all the delicacy of a sledgehammer. I know that not every elder is that way, and there are some committees which actually try to help the Witnesses facing them, but far too many are composed of corrupt men who are as guilty of other sins and crimes as the accused they have put on trial.
When I told my committee that the Society's own statistics showed that only one in three of those disfellowshipped or disassociated ever returned to the organization and that as a schoolteacher I knew this was a failing grade in anyone's book, I was given an angry and frustrated silence as an answer. I said this, not to convince them of anything, but to show that I was not going to be intimidated. Indeed, I was the one who intimidated them, and I will admit it gave me a fiendish pleasure to watch them squirm as I stabbed them again and again with quesitions they couldn't answer or situations they couldn't address. I don't doubt they don't miss me at all. They have never contacted me about returning even during their yearly review of who among the disfellowshipped should be reached out to. I'm glad because it means I don't have to deal with these cowards ever again.
Quendi
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What would be your favorite job if you could do anything.?
by new hope and happiness inon the basis that most of us realise the w.t wasnt really the best " job" or way to spend our days, it would be fun to find out what people would really have liked to have done with there lifes and if this is still possible.
or maybe its not even a very realistic ambition just a dream.
in my dreams i stay at home all day and make a living from being a professional artist.maybe i need a phycholgist?.
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Quendi
Fortunately for me, I started pursuing my dreams while still a Witness. Now that I'm out, I am still doing my own thing. First, I went back to college in my forties and got degrees in geography and mathematics. I then became a high school math teacher. I did some other things but have returned to teaching which I have come to realize is my true calling. I'm in my late fifties now and have enjoyed teaching more than I ever thought I would. Yes, it's wonderful having summers free, but what is far more rewarding is having the impact on young lives that teaching allows.
I am also going back to other interests with real gusto as well. Photography, writing and the study of the classical guitar have given me great joy. I think being middle-aged gives me a perspective on all of these which have enhanced my experience with them. I will return to writing my novel Magic Squared over the summer and want to put a great deal of effort into the classical guitar. That is a fascinating instrument and I find that I actually have some natural talent and real ability with it. As for the photography, I'm experimenting with both film and digital formats and learning much. I want to purchase a DSLR in the fall and I can't wait to explore the incredible options it will open to me.
I am glad that I have remembered what George Eliot wrote: "It is never too late to be what you might have been."
Quendi