Posts by DesirousOfChange

43

Members of congregation know it’s not true

by Mikejw in

we have lonely old folks and even some not so old.. they know the gb are not who they claim to be.. but they stay in the congregation because they are lonely.

i wonder what percentage of jws this is the case, i would guess a lot.

.

DesirousOfChange

they said “ it is better to be wrong & inside the Truth than to be “right outside “ it ….

I recall a brother -- not sure if he was an elder at the time but he was eventually until he resigned and only would agree to be a MS -- who commented that even if it was found to be all wrong it was still the best way of life for him, as he would likely be dead if he had continued on in his former lifestyle.

I do think that is possibly all true. He had been quite the carouser and shit disturber as a young guy. But he was now a wife & father and a sincere guy. IDK why he decided he no longer wanted to be an elder, however serving as a MS was OK. Perhaps it was the "judging" others thing. Or, maybe he actually came to know that it "is all wrong" but he wanted to stay with the Blue Pill.

43

Members of congregation know it’s not true

by Mikejw in

we have lonely old folks and even some not so old.. they know the gb are not who they claim to be.. but they stay in the congregation because they are lonely.

i wonder what percentage of jws this is the case, i would guess a lot.

.

DesirousOfChange

And probably because of the community of friends it gives them.
Being a JW you are able to make "instant" friends by the dozens. ALL other JWs are your friends, and that's especially if you are a "prominent" brother or his wife or children. Then all the average JWs want to be in your company or presence. It helps even more if you are well-off financially.
When you leave (or are tossed out), the first thing you learn is that they all were "conditional" friends. We all quickly discovered that. Secondly, you learn that it is not that easy to make REAL friends. It's something that requires great effort. You have to be a friend too. And, you have to be a person or have something about you that attracts others to want to be in your company. It just is not "automatic".

6

What is your experience with conversations outside jw.org

by Gorb in

jw
friends

i write many times how good it is to be pomo for me, my wife and children.

feeling better then ever.

jw family accept this status.

DesirousOfChange

It's for me difficult to choose the dept of the conversation.

Start by asking about them and their family and their interests. And obviously ask about whatever is involved in the venue you are at the time -- Theatre? Sports game?

I love politics, but that has become very divided here lately, but you usually can determine which side of the topic they favor and if it's your flavor too, then share thoughts. If they're on "the other side of the aisle" then stay clear of issues.

38

unbaptized boy having priority over women

by enoughisenough in

i was thinking about the male children ( even unbaptized ) being placed ahead of the sisters.

; and i thought the jw were raising a bunch of misogynist.

would these kids not feel more important than their mothers let alone other women.

DesirousOfChange

DoC……are you using the words “grooming”, “young”, and “boys” on purpose?

Vidot, I am NOT suggesting that there are immoral intentions. The terms certainly apply however. The announcement addresses young teens and younger males (that's young boys), and they definitely are "grooming" them for future use as MS/elders and likely they have in mind the potential free labor these young guys provide to them (Bethel, building projects, disaster relief for insurance funds) as they grow up IF......they remain in The Troof. Thus WTS needs them to stay interested and be involved and to feel good about doing so

At this point, the only young guys who’d aspire toward positions in a repressive ultraconservative church are so unskilled and socially crippled, they have virtually no other life prospects.

Yes, I know of the "socially crippled" JW kids, but that simply is not the case of the majority here in our (Midwestern USA) area. Unskilled, yes -- but trainable, capable. Many of the youth here have entered good-paying skilled labor jobs -- perhaps as self-employed, but also for large commercial contractors and via apprenticeship schools. There is this trend now outside of the JW bOrg crowd as well as within the JW ranks. A person choosing a skilled union career can earn nearly $100K. They earn as much as teachers and nurses, without the resulting college loans. There has long been a shortage of people going into the "trades". That is changing. They receive good wages, good family health insurance, and good retirement benefits (are you surprised young JWs care about that?). And yes, there are those going into the janitorial business that get ridiculed here but that are demanding high pay and evidently getting it. I guess not many are willing to clean toilets. (In fact, it's not easy to find anyone willing to work.) These young couples are posting pictures of their new homes, new cars/trucks, new boats, and their vacations, cruises, etc. that we couldn't do when we were young JWs in our day. It's a good economy. They will suffer if a recession hits unless they also stashed away some money, but so will everyone else.

25

Would there, or would there not be, lawsuits if they took away the blood transfusion ban?

by VerdadTJ2 in

jw
friends

i have heard or read, many times by many exjw's, that the org does not remove the blood transfusion ban because it would be crippled by the resulting lawsuits the minute that "new light" was made official.i am not a lawyer, but i would like to know what legal opinion lawyers have on that.on what legal basis would there be a lawsuit?

"i am suing the watchtower because my relative died because of a rule they had but no longer have"?am i missing something?.

DesirousOfChange

When AIDS was new, I think many JWs were "smug" (if that's the right word) about how their "spirit directed" policy against blood transfusions had "protected" them from contracting this deadly disease by abstaining from blood.

Today, I think most JWs are more aware of the deaths from refusal of blood transfusions than any "benefits". The evidence of this, IMO, is that nearly ALL of the JWs I assisted with their "blood card/documents" agreed to accept any of the "blood fractions" that WTS permitted per their "conscience".

When WTS/GB saw the New Light on JWs accepting "blood fractions" (or EPO or any product previously prohibited) then SHAZAM! they ALL HAD A SUDDEN REVERSAL OF THEIR PERSONAL CONSCIENCE.

Likewise, if WTS/GB saw New Light and determined that transfusions would be a "personal conscientious decision" that would NOT bring them negative consequences, the VAST MAJORITY would "change their contentious position" on accepting them in an emergency.

38

unbaptized boy having priority over women

by enoughisenough in

i was thinking about the male children ( even unbaptized ) being placed ahead of the sisters.

; and i thought the jw were raising a bunch of misogynist.

would these kids not feel more important than their mothers let alone other women.

DesirousOfChange

I was thinking about the male children ( even unbaptized ) being placed ahead of the sisters. ~ OP

Just check out the Announcements for July as posted by Atlantis.

https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5166373920047104/2024-07-july-147-announcements

Review the qualifications for young baptized males (early teens or younger). They are grooming them for future MS, etc.

Apparently, WT HQ has determined that getting these young people (I mean boys) involved in Cong activities will keep them interested in future goals/positions.

46

August WT: DF'ing renamed "Removed." AKA: GB re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic

by WingCommander in

jw
friends

so: the mystery has been clarified as to more "new light" / clarifications of decades old doctrine and procedure.

august watchtower has finally been leaked.

disfellowshipping?

DesirousOfChange

And this is the case now. Instead of a genuine backing away from harsh and unkind rules, they are only lessening them in the minimum sense that they think can persuade governments that they have changed.

Wednesday meeting of GB: What else do these effing politicians expect? It's not like apostates and persistent sinners and exJWs are being burned at the stake like the Church tradition centuries ago!

22

August issue is now up on JW.com

by ozziepost in

just a heads up that the english version with the changed cover is now up on jw.com.. i haven’t yet read it but if any you have the time i’m looking forward to people’s insights.. in the meantime i must find a red 🍷.

cheers,.

ozzie (of the ‘is he still here?’ class ).

DesirousOfChange

I don't see how this is supposed to soften their position with governments that condemn them for this. All they did is soften their position on sinners

Let's hope that it fails to change the opinions of said government officials.

19

So a JW can date an unbelieving person...

by silentbuddha in

but the entire congregation is not to be informed or mark the person.

the only repercussions are that the individual who is aware of it can decide to "mark" them and not go to the local club or bar with the individual, but they are still obligated to go door to door in the ministry with them, and even speak to them at the kn as if nothing is wrong and not feel obligated to tell anyone else?

this is crazy.. so they are also basically saying that a person can carry on a romantic (but none sexual) relationship with an unbeliever and still go out in service and participate in meetings?

DesirousOfChange

D of C, where in the publications does it say a person could be disfellowshipped for "continuing a relationship with an unbeliever." I can't find that, and I could use it in a conversation with a relative.

I recall that the situation fell under "loose conduct" in the past. A blatant disregard for God's standards to "marry only in the Lord". After reading Viviene's comment, I'll admit the guy may not have finalized his divorce -- just do not remember. He was an MS. The application was made by the WT Service Dept.

To go for it now, it could likely be "brazen conduct" (since they changed the Bible).

Of course, now there is no DF, so doesn't matter. A local case here the former elder has been online hooking up for over 3 months and filed for divorce and still no judicial action.

Should be fun to see how all these changes (and Pretend Changes") work out in the real JW World.

46

August WT: DF'ing renamed "Removed." AKA: GB re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic

by WingCommander in

jw
friends

so: the mystery has been clarified as to more "new light" / clarifications of decades old doctrine and procedure.

august watchtower has finally been leaked.

disfellowshipping?

DesirousOfChange

By now I suspect everyone here has seen the video of the WT lawyer speaking to the Canadian Court regarding disfellowshipping, and how it ONLY changes "spiritual association" with family members while the relationships remain unchanged in all other ways.

WHY DON'T THEY (WT) JUST DO THIS?

Why all the cunning and lying about changes that are not real and thinking they're going to trick the Secular Authorities? JUST MAKE IT AN INDIVIDUAL CONSCIENCE MATTER. Most diehard JWs will follow tradition and shun dissenters and WT won't have to LIE about it all.