Posts by stillstuckcruz

23

Im new and curious

by SushilLuffy in

stillstuckcruz

Not much to add here but this statement from their publications is imporatant:

*** w86 4/1 p. 31 Questions From Readers ***
Approved association with Jehovah’s Witnesses requires accepting the entire range of the true teachings of the Bible, including those Scriptural beliefs that are unique to Jehovah’s Witnesses. What do such beliefs include?

That the great issue before humankind is the rightfulness of Jehovah’s sovereignty, which is why he has allowed wickedness so long. (Ezekiel 25:17) That Jesus Christ had a prehuman existence and is subordinate to his heavenly Father. (John 14:28) That there is a “faithful and discreet slave” upon earth today ‘entrusted with all of Jesus’ earthly interests,’ which slave is associated with the Governing Body of Jehovah’s Witnesses. (Matthew 24:45-47) That 1914 marked the end of the Gentile Times and the establishment of the Kingdom of God in the heavens, as well as the time for Christ’s foretold presence. (Luke 21:7-24; Revelation 11:15–12:10) That only 144,000 Christians will receive the heavenly reward. (Revelation 14:1, 3) That Armageddon, referring to the battle of the great day of God the Almighty, is near. (Revelation 16:14, 16; 19:11-21) That it will be followed by Christ’s Millennial Reign, which will restore an earth-wide paradise. That the first to enjoy it will be the present “great crowd” of Jesus’ “other sheep.”—John 10:16; Revelation 7:9-17; 21:3, 4.

------> There are MANY MANY MANY teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses(of which are no mentioned here), all of which must be accepted without question. If you do not accept even one of these, you are dimissed an "apostate" and shunned. You are not under as much pressure if you are not baptised. So while you have the opportunity, do research....before it's too late.....

O! And welcome!!! We look forward to hearing from you :)

43

The gun is the SHUN: the JW's who no longer believe but cannot leave!

by Terry in

the insidious bind the watchtower religion places on their members is unconscionable.. holding family and friends "hostage" as an extortion strategy may be their most potent weapon of enforced conformity.. .

in effect, like an armed criminal who points a gun at you and threatens "your money or your life", the watchtower leadership.

holds the power to separate dissenting members from those whom they most cherish.

stillstuckcruz

Indeed!!!! Everyday I am mentally worn out with what my future will look like and what I will finally say to my parents when the news of my "apostacy" comes out. I am always wary of what I say and how I say things around my family for fear I slip up and unveil my cover. Its truly a terrible feeling...knowing that I am a complete farse.

The Shun Gun is constantly looming over my head and the only thing that stops me and many others from jumping ship at the first chance we get.

As M*A*S*H said: " the JW rug has been yanked from under them"......along with everything and everyone that goes along with that. It's incredibly difficult for a born-in to do so as they often have nothing else but what's in borg. Once that's all gone, they fall apart. The organization would have you believe that those who are doing terribly in "the world" are failing because they "left Jehovah"...but that has nothing to do with it.

I'm done rambling because I'm just getting depressed here :)

31

Talking Points for when Witnesses Come to your Door

by truth_b_known in

jw
friends

a few weeks back i came home from work and found the latest copies of the watchtower (armageddon fearmongering) and awake!

(social media site nonsense) lying on the counter.

it was obvious witnesses had stopped by the house.

stillstuckcruz

It's difficult because they are prepared for so many different kinds of people. Those rules you mentioned are difintely ones I would try to follow. I agree that picketing and other "attacks" only push they closer to the Borg and do nothing to help anyone. Being rude towards them in FS yields the same "persecution" effect.

It's also difficult because you cannot presume to know to much about them otherwise they may suspect something of you. I suppose bringing up different topics with the phrases:

"I have heard that...."

"I was curious about Jw's and did some research and found out that...."

"I have been reading the literature left with me over the years and noticed that...."

----->That at least allows you to seem curious while still remaining aloof and showing that you will not just accept whatever they say.

Some good topics for discussion are:

-Disfellowshipping and shunning policy

-methods used by the Society to uphold 607BCE(i.e misquotations)

-flip flopping doctrines

-Being God's channel of communication yet not inspired nonsense

-The distaste for those who leave the religion

----------http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/rhetorical-fallacy.php

At least those are topics that are not directly towards their doctrine and more towards their methods as a religion. Those are ones that I would choose to discuss with them

47

Can anyone prove that birthday celebrations are forbidden by God?

by FaithfulBrother in

i know that there is no mention of any birthday celebrations in the bible besides the two which were celebrated by non-believers.

and it just so happened that on each of these events, someone died (one non-believer and one believer).

but does it mean that just because the bible mentions these two events, that all birthday celebrations are forbidden?

stillstuckcruz

I know that whenever I have brought up the fact that is not expressly forbidden or even discussed, I have also been met with the argument that birthdays "glorify and individual instead of God":

*** lv chap. 13 p. 151 par. 11 Celebrations That Displease God ***
11 Besides rejecting birthday customs on account of pagan and spiritistic roots, God’s servants of old likely rejected them on principle as well. Why? These were humble, modest men and women who did not view their arrival in the world as so important that it should be celebrated. (Micah 6:8; Luke 9:48) Rather, they glorified Jehovah and thanked him for the precious gift of life.

--->This Friday I plan on celebrating my very first B-day. 21 years old. However, I do not think of my being born as of such grand importance that I celebrate it for that reason.

EVERYONE, no matter who your are....has a birthday. If birthday's were only celebrated by the rich, kings, and president's, then that claim might have some relevance. But the fact that EVERYONE(besides JW's) celebrates their bdays shows that everyone is not a bunch of non-humble, immodest people, but a simple custom and tradition that is observed.

As others have pointed out, the Awake mentioned:

A main concern is, not what the practice meant hundreds of years ago, but how it is viewed today in your area.

----->I don't know anyone who practices astrology or any of the so-called "pagan customs" attached to bdays. I think they just like to seperate themselves from "the world" by having their own unique sets of rules.

49

Another day, another apostate. Here's my story.

by I Want to Believe in

been lurking for a bit, and feel safe enough now to tell my story (condensed).. i'm a third-generation born-in, but my parents were inactive for most of my upbringing.

this means i got the worst of both worlds--no worldly friends (home schooled all but grades 2-3), no witness friends (since we never went to the hall except for memorial), and a generally isolated upbringing in a tiny, tiny town.

needless to say, my emotional, social, and personal growth were stunted.

stillstuckcruz

Welcome "I Want To Believe"! I know how difficult it can't be to completely let go of JWs because of my own situation, as can most of the others here. Have you given Crisis of Conscience a read? Or Steven Hassan's books? They are a great help if you still have any guilt or other negative feelings about leaving.

Again....WELCOME!

12

Jesus Edition (April 1st) Now up on JW.org

by LostGeneration in

skimmed it quickly, fairly boring.

no bloody jesus on the stake for the cover, looks like a jw with a beard.. available here for download http://www.jw.org/.

stillstuckcruz

Another example of public vs private WT's:

(pg16)--1.What does Christian baptism mean?

Baptism is a request for a good relationship with God. So, a Christian should be baptized, not when a baby, but when he or she is old enough to learn about God and become a disciple of Jesus. (Acts 8:12; 1 Peter 3:21) We become a disciple of Jesus when we learn and do the things that he commanded.—Read Matthew 28:19, 20.

In the days of Jesus’ apostles, many people took action without delay to learn about God and Jesus. For example, when one man learned that Jesus’ death had opened theway to salvation, he immediately became a disciple. Today, many sincere people have chosen to become Jesus’ followers.—Read
Acts 8:26-31, 35-38.

----->If read behind the scope of reality, it might read something like this:

1.What does Christian/JW baptism mean? Baptism is a request for a good relationship with God's organization...Jehovah's Witnesses. So, a Christian/JW should be baptized, not when a baby, but when he or she is old enough to learn about God and become a disciple of the Watchtower Society. (Acts 8: 12; 1 Peter 3:21) We become a disciple of Jesus when we learn and do the things that the Watchtower Society commands.— Read Matthew 28:19, 20.

In the days of Jesus’ apostles, many people took action without delay to learn about God and Jesus. For example, when one man learned that Jesus’ death had opened the way to salvation, he immediately became a disciple. Today, many sincere people have chosen to become Jesus’ followers. If you are not aware already, to become a disciple of Jesus, one MUST become one of Jehovah's Witnesses to recieve said "salvation"—Read Acts 8:26-31, 35-38..... The rest of non-witnesses will perish in everlasting destruction....

(Simply put)

Also on pg16:

2.Why was Jesus baptized?
Jesus was about 30 years of age when John the
Baptizer dipped him under the water of the Jordan
River. Jesus’ baptism represented his decision
to do God’swill for him. (Hebrews 10:7) Thiswould
include his laying down his life as a sacrifice for the
sins of humankind. Even before he came down from
heaven to live on earth, Jesus had always loved and
obeyed his Father, Jehovah.—Read Mark 1:9-11;
John 8:29; 17:5.

---->Maybe theyl stop dunking so early.....HA!

(pg 20) The following is a typical conversation that one of Jehovah’s Witnesses might have with a neighbor. Let us imagine that a Witness named Karen has come to the home of a woman named Samantha.

Is It True That You Do Not Believe in Jesus?
Samantha: My pastor says that Jehovah’s Witnesses do not believe in Jesus. Is that true?

Karen:Let me assure you that we do believe in Jesus. In fact, we believe that exercising
faith in Jesus is vital to salvation.

----->BWAHAHA! Read the entire "conversation" that is supposedly "typical". The only thing "typical" is that it is a conversation you would hear that a convention demonstration....NOT at the actual door!

------->"We believe that exercising faith in Jesus is essential to Slavation"(Not fixing the typo....in fact...I think I came up with a new terminology. :)).GB.....I think you left out a few "keys" for "Slavation".

26

Signs From God?

by What Now? in

not sure about the rest of you that are mentally out, but every now and again i still have those moments where i think "ok god, if this is in fact the true religion and the organization is right and i'm on the wrong path, send me a big, glaringly obvious sign that i can't ignore.. .

anyways, this past sunday my husband and i just did not feel like going to the meeting.

we weren't in the mood to sit through it.

stillstuckcruz

My issue with so-called "signs" is that there are far too many of them. If, for the sake of the argument, what you experienced was a "sign" then God certainly leads people all over the place. People feel spiritually led to MANY, MANY different religious groups and cults. Supposed "signs" lead them to these groups and if they leave that particular group or whetever it may be, any sheer coincidences are attached with some monumental significance that they should return.

My personal view is that if they are all signs....God doesn't have a clue what he want people to do. But I personally don't attatch any significance to them.

"it's human nature to see patterns in what are otherwise natural coincidences at best. When you were ever on vacation for the first time in a new city, did you drive by a kingdom hall and notice it? How many other churches though did you drive by and notice that you still remember? Probably way more than kingdom Halls, but you never noticed them and certainly didn't remember them, because you didn't attach any meaning to them. It's simply what I call selective awareness."

^GREAT explanation 'just n from bethel'!

81

Gave 5 JW's Something to Think About at a Starbucks Today

by flipper in

jw
friends

i was having coffee at a starbucks located in a supermarket chain in one of the towns i work in my business .

while sitting there doing paperwork , what looked like 3 elders on their field service break sat at a table no more than 4 feet from me .

after eavesdropping it was obvious they were elders as they were talking about the c.o.

stillstuckcruz

Latest WT study edition, Apr. 15th, 2012. Page 12, paragraph 17:

Consider just one example of the good that can come when a family loyally upholds Jehovah’s decree not to associate with disfellowshipped relatives. A young man had been disfellowshipped for over ten years, during which time his father, mother, and four brothers “quit mixing in company” with him. At times, he tried to involve himself in their activities, but to their credit, each member of the family was steadfast in not having any contact with him. After he was reinstated, he said that he always missed the association with his family, especially at night when he was alone. But, he admitted, had the family associated with him even a little, that small dose would have satisfied him. However, because he did not receive even the slightest communication from any of his family, the burning desire to be with them became one motivating factor in his restoring his relationship with Jehovah. Think of that if you are ever tempted to violate God’s command not to associate with your disfellowshipped relatives.

^They are really beefing it up now. What's more incredible to me is how so many are unaffected. My mother and a wonderful brother were sitting in the car the other day. They were discussing how my aunt hasn't spoken to her daughter in 20 years how awful that was...how could someone do that to their own daughter. All I could do was sit there in complete shock. How could they not realize the obvious hypocrisy. My mother would be just as willing to shun me for 20+ years if it meant staying loyal to the organization. It's unfortunate their not alone.

My DA letter is going to be very long, most of which will likely cover disfellowshipping and it effects.

Great job Flipper! Hopefully you causes some gears to start turning in their heads.

18

Did you DF yourself on purpose?

by Evidently Apostate in

jw
friends

lately i have been thinking about saying something apostate to my elder father in law.

he is an uber witness and actually believed that god interveined and saved him when he had a heart attack and kept him alive, until he told me that and i asked him why jehovah allowed jws in nazi concentration camps to suffer horribly and die but he loved an alcoholic more than them.. i havent been to a kh in 6 months or in service in years.

i grew a beard and basicallyhe avoids talking to me.

stillstuckcruz

Like glander said, I'd rather go out, in effect, saying "you can't fire me because I quit."

Whenever I leave the organization, I refuse to be kicked out. It will be known that it was my choice to leave, not the other way around.

8

I used to wonder

by crmsicl in

jw
friends

when i was a jw i often thought... why was being in the "truth" so hard (to live it and do all the sh!t) and why didn't it feel good and why wasn't there any real good results (as far as recruits).. just sayin.

stillstuckcruz

One of the things I pondered about was why one had to slave for the WT for so many years(perhaps 70+) to survive armageddon, and others could come in a day before Armageddon and recieve the same "salvation".

So much of it doesn't actually make sense until you see things from an outside persepctive. :)