Posts by LFitzwater

5

Article in Texas on JW abuse coverup

by LFitzwater in

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http://www.wfaa.com/vwilliams/stories/wfaa021126_am_jwabuse.4677c910.html .

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LFitzwater

http://www.wfaa.com/vwilliams/stories/wfaa021126_am_jwabuse.4677c910.html

41

Two witness rule IS A MAJOR PROBLEM

by LFitzwater in

it may not be the main problem or the only problem and i do agree that this needs to be treated as a criminal issue, but let me give you a very good example of why it is important for a problem like this to also be taken care of congergationally.. my father in law dan fitzwater sr has now been taken care of criminally.

( no thanks to the wts) he is in prison for child molestation.

he has been abusing children for a very long time, but he is only serving a short time in prison.

LFitzwater

In response to PLMKRZY, they have shunned the victims of Dan Fitzwater for coming forward and speaking out. They have not been "officially" DFed, but they are treated as such by the congergation.

When the first victim, Dan's step-daughter came forward (for the 2nd time) she was not a member of the congergation. She was removed from the home by social services because of the abuse when she was 15 (the first time she came forward) and she never became a baptized JW. They treated her as if her word meant nothing because she was "worldly". They simply did not believe her. When others in that hall came forward that were not active members because they could not stand to attend meetings where their abuser was the congergation overseer and 1 of only 2 or 3 elders, they were dis-counted as well. Becasue they were ignored, a little girl in the hall was abused. That family was active and in good standing at the time of the abuse. Because the child tried to kill herself 2 years after the abuse had occured, it was brought to the attention of the authorities. The family was treated very badly within the congergation and they did not believe her either. The Elders said that this was a "disturbed" little girl. I guess that was their excuse to not believe her. OF COURSE SHE WAS DISTURBED!!! AN ELDER HAD MOLESTED HER! The family has since been shunned as well and went on to sue the WTS. They ended up settling out of court.

I stepped forward to try to get something done to Dan in the congergation and was questioning why things were being handled as they were (I was in another congergation in FL at the time) and I was DFed for "apostacy" because I was questioning Jehovah's org and I was a danger to the congergation.

Strange how they saw me as a danger and did not see Dan that way!

Laurie

41

Two witness rule IS A MAJOR PROBLEM

by LFitzwater in

it may not be the main problem or the only problem and i do agree that this needs to be treated as a criminal issue, but let me give you a very good example of why it is important for a problem like this to also be taken care of congergationally.. my father in law dan fitzwater sr has now been taken care of criminally.

( no thanks to the wts) he is in prison for child molestation.

he has been abusing children for a very long time, but he is only serving a short time in prison.

LFitzwater

Welcome Bruce! I want to thank you for coming here and admitting and apoligizing for your small part in enforcing WTS policy. That is what most of us have wanted from the begining. If all the elders would do the same as you we would not have taken this issue to the level it is at now. If the WTS would have stood up and had the guts you do to admit they were wrong and apoligize and REALLY changed they would have saved themselves a lot of trouble and us a lot of EXTRA heartache. I really do appriciate that you have realized that to do as they directed was wrong. I hope that this trend continues as the truely good elders (and I do believe there are good, but misled elders) out there start to realize what is going on. Thanks again for stepping forward and standing up for what is right.

Also, someone asked if I could post that letter from the WTS regarding 2 witnesses. I do not have a scanner, but I think I sent a copy to Bill Bowen. He may be able to post it. I think it was posted somewhere at one time.??? I will work on that.

I also found out that I was misinformed on my father-in-laws release date. I heard Dan Fitzwater was to be released in Feb, but that is just when he is up for parole. His actual release date is set for August 2004. I don't believe he will make parole because he has to admit to what he did and apoligize as a condition of parole. He was already passed up once because he would not admit to doing anything wrong. So at least it is further than I thought. I was having real issues because I thought he was getting out in Feb. It brought out a lot of horrible feelings that I just am not ready to face. I wish he was there for life!

Laurie

41

Two witness rule IS A MAJOR PROBLEM

by LFitzwater in

it may not be the main problem or the only problem and i do agree that this needs to be treated as a criminal issue, but let me give you a very good example of why it is important for a problem like this to also be taken care of congergationally.. my father in law dan fitzwater sr has now been taken care of criminally.

( no thanks to the wts) he is in prison for child molestation.

he has been abusing children for a very long time, but he is only serving a short time in prison.

LFitzwater

The WTS is the one that messed up. They themselves stepped in the middle of this case and THEY decided not to DF Dan. I have a letter from the WTS AFTER Dan was convicted and in prison. It is in response to my husbands question as to why Dan was not DFed. They said because there were not TWO witnesses. Like I said this was AFTER he was convicted and 4 people not only testified in court under oath but also had reported their allegations to elders.They meant 2 witnesses to each incident.

Laurie

41

Two witness rule IS A MAJOR PROBLEM

by LFitzwater in

it may not be the main problem or the only problem and i do agree that this needs to be treated as a criminal issue, but let me give you a very good example of why it is important for a problem like this to also be taken care of congergationally.. my father in law dan fitzwater sr has now been taken care of criminally.

( no thanks to the wts) he is in prison for child molestation.

he has been abusing children for a very long time, but he is only serving a short time in prison.

LFitzwater

It may not be the main problem or the only problem and I DO AGREE that this needs to be treated as a criminal issue, but let me give you a very good example of why it is important for a problem like this to also be taken care of congergationally.

My father in law Dan Fitzwater Sr has now been taken care of criminally. ( No thanks to the WTS) He is in prison for child molestation. He has been abusing children for a very long time, but he is only serving a short time in prison. This is mostly because some of his victims are past the statute of limitations to prosecute. He has never been DFed for his crime against children. To the many JWs that knew him and could not imagine him guilty of this crime, a DFing may have helped. But the elders and WTS stood behind him because they did not have 2 witnesses to EACH incident (4 people testified at the trial that they were abused by him). The elders alledged that the ones that had accussed him did so to hurt "Jehovah's Org". I believe that it is because he was not DFed that many rank and file think he is innocent. They truely believe if there was proof that he did this the elders SURELY would have taken action. 10 people wrote to the judge in Dan's sentancing saying that they did not bvelieve Dan did this and they would STILL trust their children with him. When Dan leaves prison and goes back to these people they will protect and shield him from the law and they will allow their children to be alone with him. If he had been DFed I truely feel that these ones would have 2nd thoughts about Dan's guilt or innocence. I know that it is sad and pathetic to think that people put that much stock in the elders actions or inactions, but that is the way it is. And as long as people put that much trust in the elders decisions I think it is VERY important to get that policy changed.

Laurie Fitzwater

7

I Just don't understand....

by LFitzwater in

i have read some of what is being said about the ray franz/bill bowen incident.

i did not read the first post by bill bowen and only came to know about it recently, but from what i have read things are blown out of proportion.

the mistake that i think that is being made here is that this seems to be a bill vs ray fight.

LFitzwater

I have read some of what is being said about the Ray Franz/Bill Bowen incident. I did not read the first post by Bill Bowen and only came to know about it recently, but from what I have read things are blown out of proportion. The mistake that I think that is being made here is that this seems to be a Bill vs Ray fight. Well, guess what? Neither of them are God's. Neither is perfect. Why are we expecting them to be? Why does this continue to be an issue? From what I understood, Bill was sorry for the way things were said and believes Ray to be a good man.

I am so grateful that Ray Franz did the right thing and left the WTS and wrote books that have helped thousands of people. I would not have endured being ousted from the WTS the way I was if there had not been something there to help me see that it was ok because it was not "the truth" anyway. I am eternaly grateful to Ray.

I am also grateful that Bill Bowen had the courage of his convictions to stand up and say enough! of this rotten child abuse policy. When he started I am sure he did not know how big this would get. Many of us had talked about the problems of abuse before, but he made it an organized effort. He got the publicity we need to get things changed. He also helped MANY that were hanging on as witnesses see that there are some REALLY big problems with the WTS. Bill did not do this alone. He had a lot of help. But he got it started. I am eternaly grateful to Bill.

BUT, THE BIGGEST ISSUE TO ME IS THIS: Now we have people arguing that child abuse is not a bigger issue amoung JWs than it is elsewere sothey believe that Bill and Silentlambs have no cause to make a big deal of it. BULLSH*T! That is the biggest load of crap I have ever heard! Lets put aside whether or not the problem is bigger with JWs than other religions. In fact, lets just say for aguements sake (though I don't believe it) that the problem is less prevelant amoung JWs. Does that make the issue less important???!!!!! Isn't it true that one child hurt by a bad policy is one too many??! I am not a Catholic and therefore I have no info on abuse amoung Catholic's other than what is on the news. I am not and have never been a member of another religion. I HAVE been a JW and I DO know about the problems there FIRST HAND. I have a VERY dear friend who was abused by her "annointed" step-dad for many years. I was told BY THE ELDERS that they could not help and that I was not to go to social services. I was 15 and I listened to the elders. Bad policy prevented this from being reported to the authorities. She was sexually & physically abused for 3 years after that. I could tell you several other stories. I personally know 8 people now that were abused by 3 different elders or "annointed".

If I were a member of another religion that had a bad policy on abuse I would be vocal about that. But I happen to have been raised a JW and am VERY vocal about the bad policies of the WTS. Let us not get consumed in a stupid argument. Let us each fight for whatever cause has affected us the most and let others do the same.

Many have been hurt by the blood policy.Others have been hurt by the shunning. Whatever the cause, just because they focus on that, don't accuse them of not caring about child abuse. (I think that is where Bill made a mistake. Ray focused on other things) Let us all pull together and understand the hurt we have each been through and try to support each other. I know that it is not reasonable to think we will all agree all the time, but it just seems silly to let our focus turn to some stupid statements that have been made by imperfect people. Lets move forward and focus on the important issues.

Just my thoughts, for what they are worth.....

Laurie Fitzwater

55

WTS Secret Police

by Pleasuredome in

heres a story of what happened to me at a district convention this year.. an unbaptised publisher and i travelled to wolverhampton district convention in england.

this wasnt our district but id been on holiday and had missed my own district convention (how unspiritual of me).

so me and this friend decided to go to this convention and was also hoping to meet a friend there.. on the saturday morning we were delayed in traffic and we eventually arrived at 11.30am, paid our 3 for parking (i wonder if they had the use of car parks for free?

LFitzwater

I know this to be true, although I did not know to what extent. At one of the last conventions I went to, one of my teenaged brother came. He was 6'2 and white with a shaved head. He was not baptized, but was trying to get back into the 'troof.' He looked like a skin head, though he certainly was not! He was stopped by SEVERAL people and asked who he was and why he was there. He was followed a good portion of the time and he was getting mad. He finally said "look, my name is C*** G******* and I am S***** G********'s son. I am here with her. I have been a JW my whole life and I am trying to do the right thing by being here. I would like you to stop following me and leave me alone." He then came and told my mom and myself what happened (he had been telling us all day about his encounters and we observed this happening although NO one would approach while we were standing with him) and he said he was leaving, which he did promptly.

I was shocked and felt that they had just pushed him away. I wonder how many people that happens to.....

Laurie Fitzwater

24

Top 10 points proving JW belief is false.

by mamashel in

jw
friends

i need some really good points to prove to my husband once and for all, everything i have learned so far is right.

we were talking again last night, and he actually for the first time said he would look at the information that i have found.

i have the coc book, and i dont want to throw a whole bunch of stuff at him at one time.

LFitzwater

The Blood Issue! It is simple and VERY obvious. Go to the blod sights and show how many hundreds of changes they have made. You can even get articles off the AMA web site. My point was if they are going to say NO BLOOD, then they should mean NO blood. If they had the courage of their convictions they would not be allowing so many blood products to be used.

And of course my point was always that they did not have blood transfusions in the bible times so we can't use the bible to decide they are a sin. The idea that blood is sacred is because it represents SACRED life. Would not God want the symbol to be used to save the actual sacred life?

Just a thought.

Laurie Fitzwater

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