does anyone remember a few years ago when the society supposedly made a rule about kingdom ministries, that only publishers putting in service time were supposed to have them?
well, about 3 years ago, i went to a bookstudy, after being inactive for awhile and trying to go back to meetings, anyway, one of the elders saw a kingdom ministry in my bookbag and asked me," where did you get that "?
i told them an elder had given it to me.
Jurs,
They handed you crap. There were tons of unbaptized children in our Hall and they all had there own KM. I think this is a control thing on an individual and congregational level..like it has been said, it is a club. Another control factor to make you feel in or out. Loving and united, huh?
Lindy
does anyone remember a few years ago when the society supposedly made a rule about kingdom ministries, that only publishers putting in service time were supposed to have them?
well, about 3 years ago, i went to a bookstudy, after being inactive for awhile and trying to go back to meetings, anyway, one of the elders saw a kingdom ministry in my bookbag and asked me," where did you get that "?
i told them an elder had given it to me.
This is hardly new. I was DF years back, in 1977. I was reinstated in 1978. It took me almost 2 friggin' years to get a K.M. One of my pioneer friends would make a copy of hers and give it to me. The literature servant told me that they are only given so many copies and if new ones come in, or as in my case, come back, then they don't get any until the order is adjusted. I guess no "new" order was put in for almost 2 years, huh? I saw plenty of new ones and others get theirs before I got mine. It was noticed by many but nothing was done.
As far as Wachtowers and Awakes from the KH, that is not new either. When I started to become inactive about 8 years ago, I had to "renew" my order a couple times and make a big stink to get them. I have now been out for 6 years as a "drift-away". I still get the mags in the mail though. A sweet younger sister comes and renews my subs every six months. So far, anyways.....
Lindy
someone mentioned the jude quotation of the non-canonical book of enoch recently and i noticed the latest wt (9/15/01) article on enoch addressed this.
i also found a 98 reference to this which suggested that enoch was actually written after jude, a stance which they seem to have abondoned.
in fact, the whole thing seems like a very typical post-franz, 'we don't know, ok. stop asking us stupid questions' kind of response.
"The Book of Enoch is an apocryphal and pseudepigraphic text. It is falsely ascribed to Enoch. Produced probably sometime during the second and first centuries B.C.E., it is a collection of extravagant and unhistorical Jewish myths, evidently the product of exegetical elaborations on the brief Genesis reference to Enoch. This alone is suffucuent for lovers of God's inspired Word to dismiss it."
Okay, the critical thinker may want to know: Where they get the source of information that states the above. WHO says it is an apocryphal and pseudepigraphic text? WHO says it is falsely ascribed to Enoch? Is PROBABLY produced sometime between the first and second century BCE? Probably? Probably is not a certainty is it? Would new research and new, possible hidden, evidence prove otherwise? WHO were these men that sat around and decided back in the olden days which text to accept and which to throw out? What were their motives for such choices? Political control? Religious control? Control over the poor and weak? Control over women, over youth, over the masses in general? Etc?
Tell me WHERE I can find this information so that I can see if it is reasonable by today’s standards of reason and thinking. Were their choices back then archaic now? Is there any new evidence to make the choices different today?
I read the book of Enoch and I have read several other texts considered "out" by the old antiquated standards. There is some interesting stuff in these texts that most people don't know because they are automatically excluded by most religions. Shoot, there are tons of people out there that don't even know that these texts even exist for them to look at because they are intentionally kept from their eyes. How convenient for the religious leaders of today to say that just certain writings rule when the people do discover they were written. It keeps the status quo doesn't it? We wouldn't want people making informed choices would we? Money and power for these "holders of truth" would go right down the drain!
Just my opinion from my own reading and my own experiences in life. I will now step down from my soapbox.
Lindy
a side of relief for me but angry for what happened after the announcement of my disfellowship from the wts.
i urged my mother not to attend because of the emotional trauma and agony you experience.
she's diabetics and any emotional let down can cause her serious problems.
You recieved good advice from Farkel. Many others here would tell you the same things.
I tell you that the best revenge of all is to lead a very happy and productive life from here out. They never expect that. They wnat you to be as miserable as they are on the inside, if they are good at hiding their misery, that is.
Get into all the things that you could never do before because you were a JW, and that deep down you'd have loved to do. (Not the garbage debased stuff, unless of course, that really is your hearts desire. lol)
You're bitter and angry now and it has it's place, but use those emotions for the good, not for the destruction of self. Use those energizers for moving on and moving on better than any JW would.
I hope that your Mom feels much better physically this morning. It is scary when your parents are ill. Remember though, it was her choice to go, and she was aware of the possible repercusions, and she went anyway. I question why she went. Years ago when my brother was DF and my Mom was younger and in good health, she didn't go and neither did I. Usually the person being DF, or their family don't show up for those announcements. So don't feel guilty for that in any way, if you are.
Wishing you all the best.
Lindy
well y'all, i leave the board for a few days and everything pops out.
lots of interesting stuff and no time for me to read and answer anymore.
nice going...(sarcastic grin) timed it just right to get few comments from me, dinnin ya?
My dearest COMF,
I ain't to edjurcated yet, so don't shiver your timbers to much. LOL
Love ya, and don't know what I would have done without your support over all these years. Thank you....
Lindy
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Sweet Tina,
Thanks honey, I appreciate that you appreciate..glad you returned too. Ain't living, the real living, just grand?
Lindy
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Lisa, love,
Thanks for missing me...nice to know someone is wondering about me once in a while, 'cuz I wonder about me all the time. Hehe. After the first week of class closing today tho', I feel a bit brain dead. But it seemed that everyone there, including the instructors, were keeping me good company. Just have to get back in the groove. Ya ya!
Lindy
i got an unsolicited email from a dub recently.
she read my stories at free minds and recognized one of the characters.
my brief reply was taken as an excuse to question me about the possibility of my returning to the jws.
Now lookie here, Mommie, you are begining to scare me, tell that f'in alien to get the hell out of you...
Kidding aside, you are something else.
Your crazy SIL
i got an unsolicited email from a dub recently.
she read my stories at free minds and recognized one of the characters.
my brief reply was taken as an excuse to question me about the possibility of my returning to the jws.
Mommie,
You already know that I love you dearly, and you already know what I am about to say. You are healing and getting stronger each and every day. Man, have you come a long way baby!!
Love and hugs,
Lindy
yesterday alanf posted an excellent parody of wt propoganda.
the thread was very interesting and a debate was underway as to whether he was way off base and just saying things out of hatred, or if there is some basis to think it's a possiblity, scary thought.. i have no intention of re-starting or starting a debate at this time (ok who am i and what have i don't to venice, jk hahhaha).
i simply would like to share my insights on the jw attitude toward apostates.. when i was a dedicated jw and had been asked that question by alan, 'would you kill apostates if the wts told you too?
Hi Ven,
I have to agree with you. When my own brother was DF many years ago, I was extremly upset that my Mom even talked with him, let alone sat down and ate with him and freely associated with him. She was smart. She used the excuse that my Father was not a JW and he was the head of the household so she could have my brother over. I was so gung ho on this that I even tried to get the brothers involved in "doing something about it!" I was terrified that if we didn't shun him, he would not come back "in" and he would die at the big A. But that is how you are taught. You shun and turn people in because you are told that if you don't you are unworthy of God's love and the fear of the Big A and not getting into Paradise looms over you. Never once during that time did I question such practices.
In the "good ole JW days" of my time in, apostates were the lowest things on the earth. The Society has the brs and strs thinking that the there simply isn't any thing more evil and slimmier, and more hated by God than Satan. We used to joke about running them over on the way out of the summer conventions while they stood there handing out tracks to us as we drove slowly by. Christian, huh? The hate for "apostates" and who they were was ingrained in us. That way no one would ever listen to one if they are a good JW, or take their literature and thus would never be "led" astray...heaven forbid. That is one way that the Society uses to rope and tie the flock that is now in their "keeping", among many ways.
When my niece was DF she was told that she was as good as dead if she was to continue to practice her gay life style. The elders told her so in their meeting with her. Loving huh? Broke her heart that these men who had shown her such love as a pioneer for many years, now turned on her and condemned her like a mad pack of dogs. By that time though, I had seen the "light" and was there to help her and give unconditional love.
it has been awhile since i posted this article here.
but with all the newer ones here, not to mention the new ones lurking, i would like to post it again.. it is an article i wrote last year, which i have received great response to.
i hope it might help you too.. you can find it at http://beam.to/truthquest .. there is a link right on the main page.. all my best to you!.
Hi Freepeace!!
Nice to see you! I think about you and hope you and your lovely wife are doing well. I made it to my second semester in college. Made the dean's list last semester. I couldn't have done it without the support from you, your e-mails, book and the support of all the friends I have now on here and on H2O (old board)!! Thanks guys, you all know who you are and I love ya all!! My girls were the best in getting me going and making me get through it all too. It is fun going to school along side your kids, at least in my case.
BTW, I am taking oral communication this semester, and I think of you and others who can do all that speaking, so I know I can too. It is only 3 speeches, and one group speech, so how bad can the 5-7 minutes each be?
We never know how we affect each others lives and I just wanted you to know you affected mine in a most positive way. Thank You!!
As Always,
Lindy (Antique, in case you don't know who the heck Lindy is!!)
well, i'm getting closer and closer to turning my life upside down and breaking away from my 43 years of conservative living.
any risk experiences out there?.
the risk i want to take is leaving banking, living a much more bohemiam life, maybe work as a waiter or bartender or something, go to school, travel, work on my furniture art, write, read, live.. aaaack.
Joel dear,
In my opinion, take the risk. I haven't taken the big risks that others here have taken, God bless them, but I took a big risk for me. Going to college as an older adult. Two semesters in, and I wish I had had the guts to do it years ago. I held myself back with al the standard excuses. Risk taking is scary, obviously. But it seems that when it pays off, it pays off pretty nicely. I don't see why you shouldn't do your hearts desire. The ho-hum life will always be there if you need it. I come from the bohemian life geneticaly. I heard my Grandma led the lifestyle greatly and was a very, very happy woman. I was always sorry she died before my time. I think I would have loved her and she would have made sure that I escaped the Borg much earlier.
Live life, my sweety, it is all you got!
Lindy
