i found this:.
worldly celebrations such as christmas - ks91-e p.95 (it appears celebrating birthdays is not a reason to be disfellowshipped.
ks91-e is the pay attention to yourselves elder's book, right?
I found this:
Worldly celebrations such as Christmas - ks91-E p.95 (It appears celebrating birthdays is not a reason to be disfellowshipped
ks91-E is the Pay Attention to Yourselves Elder's book, right? Well I can't find that on page 95 in that book! WTF?
i have just thought of a way to leave jehovah's witnesses using information from the new shepherd the flock of god book.
it's quite simply: rebaptism.
here are the steps:.
Has this worked for you, Black Sheep? Also, If Daniel still reads this... you say that Jehovah removes his spirit from a congregation with a person who is leading a double life... how could a loving God punish others for the actions of others???
my dad's story: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/222141/1/i-need-help-de-converting-my-dad-my-dads-story.
i can't do it, because i'm afraid i'll get labeled as an apostate and get shunned.
i'm sure you understand.
My Dad's Story: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/222141/1/I-need-help-de-converting-my-Dad-My-Dads-Story
I can't do it, because I'm afraid I'll get labeled as an apostate and get shunned. I'm sure you understand. =(
I would greatly appreciate if you could do this. You could pretend to be one of his old return visits and looked him up in the phone book or something. Act interested in the Bible and then say, "Well, you know, I've been interested in JWs for awhile, so I looked some info up on them and found this... is this accurate or not?" Something like that. Or if you are a seasoned apostate, you would know how to do it. xD He is a curious person and will talk to you for awhile I'm guessing if you do it that way. If you do it right with just the plain facts, then I think he can turn. You could also ask him why he believes the Bible is true and point out every so called "evidence" he has. Because he always thinks he's right and the society is perfect. Wouldn't even admit the society made a grammical error. O.o
Google Voice offers free calls to US, so you could do that if you don't want to use your minutes, you could also pick our area code if you want to create another Google account to do that. Up to you, I'd just appreciate it if you can talk to him!
Please PM me if you want to do this and with any questions please post here. Thank you so much!
hi guys, i saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/de-conversion-where-are-you.
i've experienced them all and now i'm at 7).
when i was at a 6) i didn't care and figured my dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but i asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth.
Anyone?
hi guys, i saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/de-conversion-where-are-you.
i've experienced them all and now i'm at 7).
when i was at a 6) i didn't care and figured my dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but i asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth.
Well tbh, I think that link will be rationalized by "new light" lol.
hi guys, i saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/de-conversion-where-are-you.
i've experienced them all and now i'm at 7).
when i was at a 6) i didn't care and figured my dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but i asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth.
@Billy the Ex-Bethelite While it was more of a debate, really, since we were making some progress but eventually running in circles. I realize that I have to move on with my own life, thanks. I've been with my parents basically 24 hours since 7th grade when they decided to homeschool me since the schools up here are bad. So I really don't like being alone. But I realize they will die someday anyway.
My Dad will probably want more logical contradictions rather than child abuse issues (he knows the people aren't perfect), Malawi, etc. I'll check out this link thanks!
hi guys, i saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/de-conversion-where-are-you.
i've experienced them all and now i'm at 7).
when i was at a 6) i didn't care and figured my dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but i asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth.
Hi guys, I saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/De-Conversion-Where-are-you
I've experienced them all and now I'm at 7). When I was at a 6) I didn't care and figured my Dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but I asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth. (Of course) My Dad has been through 4 marriages. The 4th he is currently in but kind of seperated, but he is not seperated, lol. He is living here with my Mom who cheated on him and since she has Bi-Polar he can't trust her, so he is in a Catch 22. He doesn't want to get back with her for her to do it again, but he doesn't want to be alone the rest of his life either, also I am in the picture. I'm 17. The brothers aren't letting him have any privleges in the congregation until the divorce is through or they get back together, and he is is kinda bummed about that, and illnesses, etc. He is 62, and has High Blood Pressure, Asthma, Groin pain, Back Pain, Prostate problems, you name it.
He hasn't been going to the meetings for about 2 months or so now, but he listens in ruthlessly and everyday talks to me about Jehovah this, Jeovah that. I'm sick of it to be honest, I'm sure you know how it feels, because I know it's so wrong, but it's not something easy to get him out of, you know? It's like a child dealing drugs, but you don't know how to help him.
He has never been active his life as a JW. I probably know more about the redligion than him. He was pioneer for like 2 years, then off, for 5 years, then on for 2 years, then disfellowshipped (his 2nd wife), then re-instated (he told me the story about how his good friend he hadn't seen in awhile approached him and reached his hand out to shake in a supermarket and when he told him he couldn't, and that he was disfellowshipped, he saw the hurt in his face and couldnt get it out of his head, then he told me he thought about how Jehovah would feel, etc.), then on the 3rd wife, he quit going again, and then probably pioneered again, got to MS, then got married to 4th wife, got to elder, and when he went on a 6 month vacation for medical care in Canada, she cheated on him, he went back down and was VERY inactive then. He told me he was having real doubts about the religion then because of some fiasco with the Elders when he moved, etc. then he got removed as an Elder for missing meetings or disagreeing with Elders or something (he wanted a Saturday Bookstudy, because that's what the CO said, but they wouldn't have it. Real curropt Elders, but they got disfellowshipped after) so he stopped going for like 2 or 3 years and he got a paper job and that took all his time, even when he wanted to go back again. We caught some meetings then. Then we moved back up where we are now and he has been active ever since now basically.
If I had known he was having doubts and knew the real truth about JWs now, I could have gotten him out then. =( But when you are 10 you believe everything your parents tell you. I had no idea he was even having doubts. His doubts were stupid, though, and not anything a strong JW would have. So that's why when he started going back he got stronger and saw the JWs ways of explaining things and it "all made sense to him" lol. So he rationalized everything that happens and he really believes now. He is always looking at world events and saying, "See! That's how the world is going to become one world government and UN is going to take down religion!" etc.
I figure now is a good time to hit him with doubts, since he isn't going to meetings, but I have no idea what to do without him seeing what I'm doing.
I have tested the waters a few times. One time I went too far and got fed up and stupidly told him how everything was wrong and there is evidence that it's wrong etc. and he rationalized it by me talking to atheists or apostates online. In fact, everytime I question anything to my relatives (my aunt, my mom, etc.), even though it's legitamate and I didn't even learn it online, they say, "You are acting like an Apostate! Don't nit-pick", etc. lol.
This week I pointed out the contradiction on Jepthah (see my posts) and he was struggling to come up with anything solid, so he kept saying stuff that didn't make sense logically. Like a half-truth. I argued with him for like an hour altogether, and we kept going around in circles, until he said to just forget it, and I said whoever says to forget it is that one that is losing, and of course he said no. The Jepthah thing wasn't really anything solid, but it was a small contradiction in writing, and he didn't even want to admit THAT! Because God-Forbid the JWs make a mistake! LOL! But he did say at the end MAYBE they made a mistake, lol. I wonder if he really knows what I'm talking about and just trying to act smart or if he actually believes his rationalizing.
He came from Trinidad and doesn't even have a High School education, although he did get some in Canada. He is very smart logically (in some things but not others, maybe it's when he doesnt get enough sleep. Because he used to explain conspiracy movies to me, and now I am explaining it to him, not sure if it's age or what). I think he could have been a scientist, etc. Many agree.
My Mom is the same way, great potential, but I think she has Arrested Development or something because she acts like a child and doesn't retain things. Like how many continents there are, etc. Simple things like that, lol. She does have Bi-Polar. She cheated on my Dad 2 times (or I guess she claims only 1, but the other guy admitted it, so I dunno) before we moved, but I don't think she has since. She was emailing a guy, but that stopped. She hasn't been going or listening in at all. She claims her Elders don't listen to her or doesn't pay her mind or something. She has gone to every convention, Memorial, Assembly, etc. That's it. She is going to my Aunt's Convention this year (she visits her sister a lot, as they both rely on each because they both have the disorder and they understand each other), she isn't taking me like she usually does, so I guess she is trying to look for someone, because when we asked, she just smiled instead of being defensive like she usually does.
I don't need help with her, since she isn't going to the meetings anyway, and if my Dad doesn't believe, I think she will be easily swayed, anyway. Plus she is alot more unstable, so I'm not sure how she would take it.
So I hinted around and asked why he knows JWs is the right religion, why didn't he research religion, the Bible, etc.
He told me Muslims are crazy. I told him those are probably just radicals and he said there are whole muslim contries that believe in honor killings, degrading women, etc. Mormans believed in polygamy at first, the Church of God believes in eating unclean meats, which doesn't make sense to him, etc. and he believes a religion should have 1 unified religion. He explained how 1 church of God he went to in Trinidad didn't believe in wearing Jewelry, but when he came to USA they did, so he didn't think that was good unity. Also he believes that JWs are the only ones that are preaching the good news, going door to door, etc. I told him someone told me that there is a scripture in the Bible that says NOT to go door to door, and hoe said, show me, he has never seen such a scripture and that it was probably taken out of context. Maybe I will begin that way? Or should I go an even more stealthier way? I'm sure you guys have experience in this.
He won't even consider atheisim, yet, because he holds to the fact that the evidence is all around us. I can't blame him, I used to think that way, too. Probably got it from him. Until I realized the Bible and all other religious texts are wrong, anyway, so it doesn't really matter what I think.
Anyway, I don't think evidence toward not believing in the Bible is the way to go right now, because he will automatically block it out.
I think to just plant doubts about the society into his mind.
What tips do you guys have? Sorry for the lengthy backstory, I felt it neccesary to explain. Thanks!
the prophecy clearly states that the destruction of jerusuelem will be 70 years before the cast to rebuild.
yet we know the destruction of jerusuelem was not 70 years before, it was at 586 bce, not 607 bce.
so this here is a clear contradiction between secular evidence and the bible.. atheists = win..
The prophecy clearly states that the destruction of Jerusuelem will be 70 years before the cast to rebuild. Yet we know the destruction of Jerusuelem was not 70 years before, it was at 586 BCE, not 607 BCE. So this here is a clear contradiction between secular evidence and the Bible.
Atheists = Win.
paragraph 15: "he vowed that if god gave ammon into jephthah's hand, the first one to come out of the door when he returned home would be jehovah's.
as jephthah returned home from subduing ammon, his daughter came running to meet him.
(judg.
@notjustyet You must not read your Bible, then. =P The Bible clearly says "burnt offering" even in the NWT. JWs say it was figurative, just like a lot of things they do not understand / contradict their teachings / The Bible.
paragraph 15: "he vowed that if god gave ammon into jephthah's hand, the first one to come out of the door when he returned home would be jehovah's.
as jephthah returned home from subduing ammon, his daughter came running to meet him.
(judg.
