Posts by Bella15

1 A shoot will come up from the stump of Jesse;
from his roots a Branch will bear fruit.
2 The Spirit of the LORD will rest on him—
the Spirit of wisdom and of understanding,
the Spirit of counsel and of might,
the Spirit of the knowledge and fear of the LORD—
3 and he will delight in the fear of the LORD. He will not judge by what he sees with his eyes,
or decide by what he hears with his ears;

10

Is it true..

by iamwhoiam in

jw
friends

...that there is a literature invoice the congregation has to pay every month in order to recieve literature?

?.

Bella15

I think this was done in the past ...

34

Looking for advice/thoughts/opinions RE Celebrating Xmas

by stuckinlimbo in

jw
friends

Bella15

Quite a pickle you're in. I don't know if you've ever talked to a professional counselor after leaving the Watchtower cult. I once called myself atheist but years later I learned that it was label I gave MYSELF to cope. When you go deeper into the subject, depending on how your brain handled/processed the cult "trauma," it can be PTSD, and if you don't deal with it and heal you'll find yourself doubting about many things in life. Today it is Christmas, and as your son and future children grow up it will be something else tomorrow... my children are 13 and 14 now by the way, so I have a little experience. With all respect to all atheists, if you turn this way after leaving a cult, it would be beneficial to look in to PTSD and see if you find yourself in there, not for you to believe in God again but so you can live a healthy life and enjoy all the stuff that life is made of, and get the WTC cult out of your life ... the Universe has a way of turning things on our favor sometimes ... as a man thinks he becomes ... perhaps if you hold your ground your family will respect you ... you may be so surprise ... DO NOT SACRIFICE YOUR CHILDREN TO THE WATCHTOWER CORPORATION - if you abstain from doing things for fear of upsetting your JW family I am sorry but then you are still under their control and it is not fair to your children. You want to be 100% in the moment, fully involved and invested in the things you do with your family.

Atheists and Christmas:

There is a debate among atheists about whether they should celebrate Christmas or not. Some do so because they aren’t out as atheists. Some do so in order not to rock the boat among religious family members. Some do so because they always have and don’t want to change — or simply enjoy the holiday. Others argue that it should be replaced by a more rational holiday, and still others argue that all such holidays should be ignored by atheists. Is there a case to be made for this?

Christmas is a Christian Holiday:

Traditionally, Christmas has basically been a Christian holiday — it is, after all, Christ’s Mass where the Nativity of Jesus is celebrated. Many atheists don’t believe that Jesus existed, and those who do don’t regard him as having been anyone special. No atheists are Christians, so why bother participating in such a Christian holiday? It’s arguable that participating makes Christianity seem more popular than it really is, not to mention giving Christians an unjustified ego boost.

Celebrating Christmas Perpetuates Myths About America:

Among the possible harms created by atheists celebrating Christmas is that conservative evangelical Christians are bolstered in their argument that America is essentially a Christian nation. The more popular and important Christian holidays are in America, the easier it is to claim that there is something about Christianity which is fundamental to America’s culture. It’s not a very good argument and this isn’t very good support for it, but why offer them even this little bit of help?

Elements of Christmas are Pagan:

Although Christmas has traditionally been a Christian holiday, most elements of modern Christmas celebrations are really pagan. This isn’t a very good reason for atheists to celebrate Christmas, though, because atheists aren’t pagan any more than they are Christian. Atheists don’t uphold other ancient pagan superstitions, so why do so with those which happen to be popular at Christmas time? There’s nothing about ancient paganism which is any more rational than modern Christianity.

Why Not Celebrate Other Religious Holidays?:

If an atheist is surprised at the possibility of not celebrating Christmas, they should consider why they don’t celebrate other religious holidays. Few atheists do anything for the Muslim holiday of Ramadan or the Christian holiday of Good Friday. Why make an exception for Christmas? The primary reasons seem to be cultural momentum: everyone does and most people have all their lives, so it’s difficult to change. This may be true, but it’s not a very good reason not to change.

Christmas and Lying:

Atheist parents who celebrate Christmas will probably include the Santa Claus myth, but this requires them to lie to their kids. There’s no nicer way of describing what one does when telling small children that Santa Claus really exists and delivers presents to children all over the world. There doesn’t appear to be anything which justifies this deception, especially since there are many ways in which it might prepare kids for belief in Christian doctrines. Is this worth the risk?

Does Ignoring Christmas Help or Hurt Kids?:

Atheist parents are in a very difficult bind when it comes to Christmas because there are strong incentives to do what other parents are doing. Not celebrating Christmas and not telling kids about Santa might cause their children to be ostracized from others. At the same time, though, the numbers of religious minorities who also don’t participate are increasing, thus increasing the numbers of kids who are “different.” Being different isn’t easy, but who wants to be a hypocrite just to fit in?

Should Atheists Celebrate Any Holidays?:

Once the question about celebrating Christmas is introduced, the next logical step is to wonder whether atheists should be celebrating many or any of the holidays traditionally observed. Tom Flynn, for example, argues that “a humane holiday should be global and universal, equally relevant to all humans, regardless of their cultural heritage or where they live.” Leaving aside problems like separating holidays from the rhythm of our experience of time, this is worth thinking about.

Christmas as a Secularized Holiday:

One possible reason for atheists to celebrate Christmas is that it has become increasingly secularized over time and there is little sign of the process stopping soon. Arguments against Christmas remain, but atheist participation in Christmas actually helps serve the cause of removing it from its various Christian and pagan roots. There are good reasons why many Christians are upset over the current state of Christmas, and those may be good reasons for atheists to keep the changes in motion.

Future of Atheists and Christmas:

The relationship between atheists and Christmas today is complicated and there is no reason to think that it will change any time soon. Some atheists will continue to celebrate it fully, some will celebrate only portions, and others will reject it — with some of these creating alternative holidays and the smallest minority not bothering with any holidays at all. I really don’t see the relative positions and numbers changing much because I think that all of this is dependent upon atheists’ relationship with the broader American culture.

So long as atheists seek to be accepted and “normal” in America, they will tend to avoid doing things which will cause them to be singled out as different or strange. Today there is nothing more American than celebrating Christmas, so atheists who want to fit in will also at least do something around Christmas time. The growing numbers of religious minorities who reject Christmas may make being different a little easier, but even they are adopting some of the trappings of Christmas, too. Major shifts in this don’t strike me as very likely.

The fact that Christmas has become so secularized will also likely prevent many atheists from abandoning Christmas. If the day retained a significant Christian element, self-conscious atheists would be more sympathetic to anti-Christmas arguments, but that’s just not the case anymore. A secularized holiday is easy for secular people to celebrate.

So-called “alternative” holidays won’t make much progress because in the end, it’s clear that they aren’t any more “rational” than Christmas. Their primary benefit, such as it is, is their role in identity politics for atheists: having their very own holiday can make atheists feel more secure and comfortable in their social group, giving them something substantive to identify with. It’s hard to see, however, why identity politics is something which atheists really should try to engage in.

26

Occupy Watchtower

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

i stole the idea from a fb friend.

just like occupy wallstreet (and the spread to various cities), imagine people without a single voice picketing wt at brooklyn and having warming barrels loaded with burning watchtower literature.

if you did, what would your sign say?

Bella15

COUNT ME IN ...

"But - as for the followers of the WTS, it will only reinforce the persecution complex. WT Occupiers won't be labeled as dirty, lazy hippies...they'll be labeled as evil, Satan loving apostates. A sure reason to hate them and avoid anything they have to do or say."

We shouldn't want to target the JWs, we want the public, the whole wide world to know what's behind the Watchtower Org - PEDOPHILES, FALSE PROPHECIES ... the works ...

No burning any stuff ... I like Silent Lamb Org's symbol - a lamb with tape over its mouth. So we should dress like that ...

38

I was counselled regarding my prayer-ridiculous,

by iclone in

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Bella15

Amen to your prayer. Try praising God next time ... something along these lines ... LOL!

Almighty, true and incomparable God,
You are present in all things,
yet in no way limited by them.
You remain unaffected by place,
untouched by time,
unperturbed by years,
and undeceived by words.
You are not subject to birth
and in no need of protection.
You are beyond all corruption,
above all change,
immutable by nature.
You live in unapproachable light
and are invisible,
yet You are known to all those
who seek You with hope and love.
You are the God of Israel,
and of all who hope in Christ.

I bet the Holy Spirit will bring more than one to tears ...

13

Songs everyone should hear--at least once in their lives

by WTWizard in

jw
friends

and no, the sxxx that comes out of the kingdumb hell is not among that.. with all the rubbish you hear on the radio these days, one wonders if there are any decent songs out there.

and "rubbish" doesn't mean debased music or music with satanic messages encoded in it.

it means the crap that is thrown together, auto-tune'd for homogenization, and stuffed onto the radio.

Bella15

Vivaldi - 4 Seasons.

20

"Ancient Whale Bones Found Atacama Desert, Chile!" Creation or Evolution

by AvocadoJake in

how did those whale bones get into the atacama desert, if you have been there, it is a barren wasteland.

i belive it might have been caused by the flood, but again i am one who belives in god.

what do you think of this find, jesus or non-intelligence?

Bella15

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
'Who is like Me? Let him proclaim and declare it; Yes, let him recount it to Me in order, From the time that I established the ancient nation. And let them declare to them the things that are coming And the events that are going to take place.

Anyone up for the challenge????

Why every discovery has to be about the flood and whether there is a Creator God or not --- LOL --- it is easy to pick in the past ... how about one tells me the future ...

Anyway ... as far as the whale there ... gosh I don't know, tsunami perhaps ... or a GIANT pterodactyl lose its prey while fighting a jeholopterus (who was looking for an easy prey) ... GOSH (like in Napoleon Dynamite)

53

My guitar was in that wheel barrel.

by Quarterback in

jw
friends

well, i may be overeacting....i may be sensitive.....it may be sad....it may be the silly comments heard at the wt meeting.

however, there it was in the study article ...a picture of some sad looking, unhappy runners (the kind of look that the org inflicts on us) .

for the first time i looked at that guy with the wheel barrel.

Bella15

LOL @ the picture ... seriously?

449

"Feeling sorry for yourself" about being hit by your husband is not Christian 2/15/12 WT Page 25 P 12

by yourmomma in

have anyone of you read, the absolutly jaw dropping paragraph in this article about a women who was hit by her husband?

its in page 25 of the 2/15/12 wt study edition (i read the dumbed down version).. .

if there was any question, that the watchtowers stance is for wives to simply take it when their husbands abuse them, this makes it crystal clear.. who the hell is scanning these things before they go to print?

Bella15

"We should scan this page and forward it to as many Women's Rights groups as possible. Something tells me they wouldn't take too kindly that millions of women in one group are being told that they should stay with an abusive husband because he might convert one day."

I thought the same ...