Nanoprobe

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Posts by Nanoprobe

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  30

  Get your story straight JR & WTBS

  by Nanoprobe in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  what did helen clark mp mean in this statement, did the wtbs spokesman admit to the 23,720 number while jr says, it is false.?

  is this in the bbc panaroma transcript or did wtbs admit the number to the mp in a different letter?

  the spokesman from headquarters (in the united states) said on the .

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  Nanoprobe

  What did Helen Clark MP mean in this statement, did the WTBS spokesman admit to the 23,720 number while JR says, It is false.? Is this in the BBC Panaroma transcript or did WTBS admit the number to the MP in a different letter?

  The spokesman from headquarters (in the United States) said on the

  programme that the Witnesses had their own register of paedophiles --

  with 23,720 names on it (in Europe, Canada and the U. S.). As this is

  an international organisation, their policy stems from the U.S.; they

  are a corporate body whose representatives in England are not

  independent.

  L etter from: Helen Clark Member of Parliament for Peterborough

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=32396&site=3

  In the letter to the BBC JR Brown uses Bill Clinton word tricks to try to deny the 23,720 number.

  You have been told that here in the United States we have compiled a list of 23,720 names of child abusers. That is false. First of all, the total number of names in our records is considerably lower than that. In addition, it is not meaningful to focus on the number of names we have in our records

  JR Browns response to Betsan Powys (bottom paragraph page 2)

  http://www.jw-media.org/releases/default.htm?content=bbc020509.pdf

  Notice how Silentlambs correctly explains JRs comment.

  As you will n ote the 23,720 figure is denied in the USA. I never specifically stated it was a USA ONLY figure. It appears once again misinformation is being used to shade the facts of this matter along with other comments. The 23, 720 figure includes a series of countries that take in about half the total figure of JW's worldwide.

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=32136&site=3

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 18 July 2002 12:22:41

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 18 July 2002 12:24:15

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 18 July 2002 12:32:2

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 18 July 2002 12:34:45
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  29

  Newsweek Letter Writer Silenced

  by silentlambs in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the following email was sent to me today, if anyone would like to send and encouraging comment to loris i will be glad to forward it to her.

  all she did was tell the truth and now she is facing sanction in the congregation.

  so according to wt pr you are not sanctioned if you go to the police but you are sanctioned if you talk about it.

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  Nanoprobe

  Loris,

  I'm the one who emailed you from the first, the one you said, "We may not win the battle, but we can pick the battlefield we die on." I'm sorry it came to this so soon for you. However, I think the society made a mistake when they choose to go to battle with you. Write Newsweek a letter, include a clipping of your published comment in their magazine. I believe dear lady, you personally can gather more press than you have imagined, if not from Newsweek than from other media. The Battle is not over.
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  37

  re: Taking a balanced view of the allegations?

  by Visionary Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  this is my first post on this forum.

  i am by all accounts a witness, if not an ideal one.

  in light of the reaction after the panorama program i have seen a mixed variety of responses.

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  Nanoprobe

  Sunshine;

  He was a teenager and did spend a year in a Juvenile facility and is currently a registered sex offender on probation.

  However, he was welcome in the hall of his victim. A year has passed now and the victim's family have moved on to another hall. Guess the pedophile and his supporters won that battle, my family no longer attends.
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  37

  re: Taking a balanced view of the allegations?

  by Visionary Man in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  this is my first post on this forum.

  i am by all accounts a witness, if not an ideal one.

  in light of the reaction after the panorama program i have seen a mixed variety of responses.

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  Nanoprobe

  Visionary Man:

  I would like to respond to your comments from a slightly different perspective. Time has changed my mind, but only a little over a year ago I would have shared your analysis.

  Finding that a convicted pedophile would be returning to the congregation of his four-year-old victim changed my opinion. The elders had no problem with his choice even though many congregations met in the same hall. The little girl and her family had to stand by and watch as the congregation hugged and welcomed the pedophile and meeting after meeting warmly encouraged him to continue to attend.

  Never mind that the victim did not receive any support.

  We really thought there must be a MISTAKE; maybe the elders didnt know the situation. DNA, the childs testimony and his own confession, had convicted the pedophile but he recanted that confession to the elders and so they viewed him as innocent. Thats right he was innocent of the charges regardless of the findings of the court. They refused to read the court transcript of his confession.

  The body of elders must be making a MISTAKE, we concluded, so we talked to the CO, we wrote letters to the Service Dept, we talked to and wrote letters to each elder.

  No, there was NO MISTAKE, one elder was a personal friend of JR Brown, and the elders told us the matter was handled under the close direction of the Service Dept.

  You encourage:

  Do not look to other humans as an exclusive means to this end and never accept or lay down on man made policies. People, think for yourselves!!! Make the truth *your own*.

  We tried that approach and when we warned the young father that his friend was a pedophile, and that he should not be holding the fathers infant daughter what happened?

  We were counseled against causing divisions in the congregation.

  Never accept or lay down

  I agree but you will find you will encounter a stonewall of opposition to your protests. You will find that the elders who have been your personal friends for 18 years will not do the right or compassionate thing, if the SOCIETY tells them otherwise. Yes, not the individual elders this is a worldwide policy from the Society.

  And you will find that you can and will lose all the friends you spent 30 yrs making in one short day if you insist on protecting children rather than the societys image.

  Been there, Done that.
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  10

  23,720 Pedophiles, How Many Victims?

  by Nanoprobe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how many victims are there of the 23,720 pedophiles in the societies record file?

  284640 individual victims (not repeat acts of abuse).

  this is my fuzzy math but how many would you guess?.

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  Nanoprobe

  Thanks for the comment, LadyLee. Good ol' Watchtower always protects the dirty guys.

  I was just thinking about how many young people leave the organization or are disfellowshipped. How many of those were victims of abuse? What kind of impact does the WTS protecting pedophiles have on society in general? How many ruined lives, how many strippers or prostitutes, drug addicts, how many more abusers?
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  10

  23,720 Pedophiles, How Many Victims?

  by Nanoprobe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how many victims are there of the 23,720 pedophiles in the societies record file?

  284640 individual victims (not repeat acts of abuse).

  this is my fuzzy math but how many would you guess?.

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  Nanoprobe

  How many victims are there of the 23,720 Pedophiles in the societies record file?

  How about 23,720 X 12= 284640 .

  284640 individual victims (not repeat acts of abuse)

  This is my fuzzy math but how many would you guess?

  See statistics below:

  A study conducted at Children's Hospital Medical Center of Cincinnati (Amy Arszman Daso and Robert Shapiro, M.D) indicates that child sexual abuse allegations should be taken seriously and found children's testimony more reliable than physical exams in cases of sexual abuse. The researchers reviewed the records of 31 pedophiles who confessed between 1994 and 1999. The 31 perpetrators confessed to a total of 101 acts of sexual abuse, some of which they committed multiple times. The perpetrators abused 47 children. The 45 old enough to provide a history described 111 acts of sexual abuse. "Physical exams are an unreliable indicator of sexual abuse," says Dr. Shapiro. "We're not saying that children never make things up, but the responsible reaction is to listen carefully to allegations of abuse so that abused children will be identified and false allegations recognized." (May 2000)
  Contact: Jim Feuer, Children's Hospital Medical Center,

  In 1995, a child molestation case in Texas caused a national uproar when the suspect was due to be released from prison after serving a six-year sentence for the rape of a 6year-old boy. He told the police that he got away with abusing over 240 children before getting caught for molesting a single child and if released, would do it again (4) . One long-term study of hundreds of sex offenders found that the pedophile child molester committed an average of 281 acts with 150 partners. These types of offenders wreak havoc upon society far out of proportion to their numbers.

  http://www.crimelibrary.com/serial/pedophiles/2.htm

  THE ABEL AND HARLOW STOP CHILD MOLESTATION STUDY

  Numbers of victims, numbers of acts

  These results pedophiles molesting an average of 12 children and committing an average of 71 acts suggest that many, if not most, child victims are molested repeatedly. http://www.stopchildmolestation.org/pages/study3.html

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 16 July 2002 21:16:23
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  4

  Help -needed re: JW's answers on pedophile issues

  by Cappuccino OC in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my uncle, who is an elder had the veracity to tell me that during his 20 years of being an elder, he has only seen two pedophile issues in the 7 different congregations he's been in.

  the first one was in the salinas valley, ca.

  i met the girl, inamar garza.

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  Nanoprobe

  First of all I would suggest that if you want to know the truth you shouldn't ask an elder. Elders do not discuss accusations of child abuse with each other much less with some female. Their job is to stop the accusations from becoming a conviction and a "mark" on the congregations reputation, so they surely don't reveal the "dirt" to others. He apparently disclosed two cases that he assumed you would find out about anyway. One person was convicted, the other person was in your own family.

  I asked eight people if they had heard of pedophiles, I now know of three convicted and four other accused pedophiles, some who later confessed. Only one sister denied knowing about any cases of child abuse, and became very upset. Later she told me that her own daughter had been raped by a young man in the congregation and she and her (then elder) husband were asked to cover it up. They did, now 10 years later, her daughter is in prison on a drug crime.

  I personally knew of three pedophiles in addition to the ones above.

  So ask the sisters, they are usually the victims or the mother's and the friend's of victims, and their primary responsibilty isn't to protect the congregation from the truth.

  Edited by - nanoprobe on 16 July 2002 11:55:6
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  44

  JARACZ: What Did He Really Mean?

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  bp: tell me about the database.

  how do you justify keeping a list of paedophiles, men in some cases who have confessed to paedophilia but you have not reported them to an authority.

  what justification is there for you to keep that?

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  Nanoprobe

  Sorry for that last messed up comment. Can't edit it

  Ted's wording leads me to believe he was referring to the The EU Directive on Data Protection

  The EU Directive on Data Protection , which came into force in 1998, instructs the EU member states to prevent the transfer of personal data to third countries where laws safeguarding privacy are not deemed "adequate." As the United States lacks uniform privacy laws, protection for personal data transferred from the EU to the U.S. is not considered adequate," and thus, transfers to the U.S. could potentially be suspended by EU authorities.

  Can't transfer EU info to the US, but can transfer US info to the EU, unless some US Privacy law forbids it, too. But it really doesn't make complete sense, does it?
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  44

  JARACZ: What Did He Really Mean?

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  bp: tell me about the database.

  how do you justify keeping a list of paedophiles, men in some cases who have confessed to paedophilia but you have not reported them to an authority.

  what justification is there for you to keep that?

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  Nanoprobe

  I don't see how his statements would apply but I bet there's a clause in there somewhere for the legal experts at WTS to hide behind. Remember Ted said, " You're from Britian aren't you?" first off

  d) Data Transfers: The data transfers policy restricts authorized users of personal information from transferring that information to third parties without the permission of the individual providing the data , or data subject. In the case of data transfers across national boundaries, the Directive prohibits data transfers outright to any country lacking an "adequate level of protection," as determined by the EU.
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  44

  JARACZ: What Did He Really Mean?

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  bp: tell me about the database.

  how do you justify keeping a list of paedophiles, men in some cases who have confessed to paedophilia but you have not reported them to an authority.

  what justification is there for you to keep that?

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  Nanoprobe

  Don't know the answer but bet this is what he was referring to:

  http://www.dss.state.ct.us/digital/eupriv.html

  I use a satellite in a remote area for internet and can not put the url in a window. Will someone do it?