Posts by Phizzy

24

If a JW becomes inactive is he then labeled as an apostate?

by Pallbearer in

i have heard a rumor that if a jw becomes inactive he or she is considered to be an apostate.

is this true?

has anyone here on this forum had such an experience?

Phizzy

w81 9/15 p. 23 par. 16 Disfellowshiping—How to View It ***

16 Persons who make themselves “not of our sort” by deliberately rejecting the faith and beliefs of Jehovah’s Witnesses should appropriately be viewed and treated as are those who have been disfellowshipped for wrongdoing."

They have a problem with this, as regarding those of us who have been out for a good few years, we have never accepted the "faith and beliefs" That Jehovah's Witnesses have today, so cannot "reject" them, unless someone tries to teach them to us !

I have only been out about 14 years, but never learned the Overlapping Generation tripe or anything since that. Despite this argument being sound, I am viewed by family and the Congregation as a dangerous Apostate and Opposer. Why ? because I have been vocal about what is wrong with JW beliefs, and VERY vocal about their Sexual Abuse , and Domestic Abuse scandals. I have NEVER said anything that is untrue, or factually inaccurate, but that matters not to them. They are Cultish Knobheads.

44

The Watchtower's Most Secret Book!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

the watchtower's most secret book!.

the truth that gives you eternal life, bethel edition.

the truth that gives you eternal life was published on watchtower presses, and is not to be confused with the truth that leads to eternal life published by the watchtowerbible and tract society.

Phizzy

As SBF says , it would be god to know who wrote the material, and who got it in to book form, and who they were aiming at. I guess the latter is fairly obvious, as the stuff that debunks JW Doctrine permeates the work. They wanted to alert JW's, probably others in bethel, but something stopped its wider distribution, probably The Purge.

This would have been incendiary stuff had it got to the ears of the Bethel Elders, even if they had simply got wind of its existence, but had they read the contents , they would have exploded ! it debunks their favourite thing of the time , which was bringing in recruits very fast, 1975. It also debunks a number of other favourite Doctrines of the JW's.

A fascinating piece of JW History indeed !

10

Second-Temple Period Messiahs

by Doug Mason in

writing is a lonely discipline that is constantly beset with self-doubt and constant self-criticism.

that is the way it needs to be.. there are times when i need to reach out for help in the form of criticism from others.

this is particularly the situation with this material.. https://jwstudies.com/second-temple_period_messiahs.pdf .

Phizzy

Hi Doug, just a quick note on a date for The Letter to the Hebrews, I read somewhere that there is similar Theology evident in it to that of 1 Clement, so at the earliest it would have been written right at the end of the 1st Century. This is just the view of one guy obviously.

The content of Hebrews itself seems to concentrate on the Salvation that it claims Christians have attained, and the need to hang on to it, not to slip in to Apostasy, and is not overly concerned with Jesus as a messiah.

But obviously it agrees with the 4th Gospel that Jesus was Divine in a sense, and thus able to enter heaven and be a mediator and Saviour. Only someone "anointed" by god in some sense could do that. It certainly seems to be addressed to , if not exclusively a priestly Class, certainly Jewish Christians well versed in the ideas found in the Hebrew Bible, and thus able to appreciate the Theological arguments.

44

The Watchtower's Most Secret Book!

by Atlantis in

jw
friends

the watchtower's most secret book!.

the truth that gives you eternal life, bethel edition.

the truth that gives you eternal life was published on watchtower presses, and is not to be confused with the truth that leads to eternal life published by the watchtowerbible and tract society.

Phizzy

I think Petra gave some really good provenance in the O.P. This is Tom Cabeen's personal Copy. I have no doubt it is genuine, and it is of great Historical interest. Thank you Petra/Atlantis !

32

Sin came into the world - not true?

by menrov in

matt 5:27 “you have heard that it was said, ‘do not commit adultery.’ 28 but i say to you that whoever looks at a woman to desire her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.. this means that even before someone commits an act that is considered a sin or wrong but does think about it, that person actually already committed that sin or trespassing.. now read this:.

rom.

5:12 so then, just as sin entered the world through one man and death through sin, and so death spread to all people because all sinned— 13 for before the law was given, sin was in the world, but there is no accounting for sin when there is no law.. this means that there was already sin in the world before adam and eve actually ate the fruit.

Phizzy

37

Anthony Morris depicts ex-members as ''Despicable Apostates''

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

here is one of the many commandments jesus instructed his twelve apostles to keep, follow, and obey!.

here is anthony morris ( supposedly selected by jehovah to keep, follow and obey the sayings of jesus ) name-calling and condemning enemies!

the pharisees used to label people as well.

Phizzy

There is only a shade of difference between Tony the Turd and Islamic Religious Leaders who rile up their young people to go out and murder. I agree with Punkies assessment of his character.

10

Second-Temple Period Messiahs

by Doug Mason in

writing is a lonely discipline that is constantly beset with self-doubt and constant self-criticism.

that is the way it needs to be.. there are times when i need to reach out for help in the form of criticism from others.

this is particularly the situation with this material.. https://jwstudies.com/second-temple_period_messiahs.pdf .

Phizzy

Hi Doug, I have speed read what you have written, and did not spot one Typo, but I too am getting old so cannot swear that I have not missed one !

The only observation I have is that though you make it plain you are dealing with the development of evolution of the Messiah concept by comparing the views as they appeared chronologically, when dealing with N.T writings you have not always mentioned (again) the time period that the Gospel or whatever was written, for the lay reader it may be helpful to always do this. I think with the letter to the Hebrews, and maybe 1st and 2nd Peter you may not have mentioned their time of writing in the sections. To do so underlines that the evolution of the concepts surrounding the Messiah in Christian thought are very late.

Having read what you have written thus far, the last Gospel to be written, that of " John" now seems to me to have as one major motive the tidying up of the various concepts of " messiah" for the Jesus/Christ movement to use, and take advantage of.

Just an irrelevant aside, I noticed the verses from the Gospel of John where the Jews dispute the Messiahship because Jesus comes from Nazareth, does this show that the writer of the Gospel of John was not aware of the anachronistic Census Story in Luke to get around this anomaly, or is this merely a device to show that "the Jews" were ignorant of this story ? I suppose it depends in one way if Luke was generally distributed, being written around 90 C.E , and "John" more than likely a decade or two later, John may not have read it. Although the many points of agreement between Luke and John, and of course the other Gospels, does look as though he was familiar with all three.

31

What's the Latest re How JW's are Associating and Preaching?

by mikronboy in

jw
friends

i've been out of the loop for a while so some things have passed me by.

so i'm curious how jw's are affected by the covid virus.

are they still preaching or having meetings etc?.

Phizzy

Letter writing, an exercise in futility, designed by a callous and calculating G.B simply to keep the JW R&F busy, and feeling the " urgency of the times".

What a Silly Cult.

37

Anthony Morris depicts ex-members as ''Despicable Apostates''

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

here is one of the many commandments jesus instructed his twelve apostles to keep, follow, and obey!.

here is anthony morris ( supposedly selected by jehovah to keep, follow and obey the sayings of jesus ) name-calling and condemning enemies!

the pharisees used to label people as well.

Phizzy

It is frustrating that there is no way to fight back against this smearing and lies campaign, because it affects so very much the way our families think about US.

The irony is, that WE are not the despicable ones, any who remain as JW's are, we may love them, because they are family or close friends, but really they are to be despised for continuing to support a discredited cultish religion.

45

Rolf Furuli Disfellowshipped Last Week

by Sea Breeze in

well known norway elder and watchtower doctrine apologist, (rolf furuli) was disfellowshipped a few days ago for the crime of expressing opinions contrary to some watchtower dictates.. like wt leadership in the past, they have no problem eating their own..

Phizzy

You are right Vidiot, and they don't seem to believe that they have to work hard at keeping it going, if they did they would really be preparing for the next decade to come, in the sense of adjusting yet again their "teachings", (ramblings).

They have a problem though, it seems they have no one with the intellectual ability to be able to spin things sufficiently so that even the thickest, laziest R&F drone would not say WTF ????

But the further 1914 recedes in to the Mists of Time , the more urgent a major adjustment becomes, as many JW's will begin to think " What is all this talk of The End based on ??.

Rolf Furuli has the same problem, he has spent so many decades defending 1914 he simply cannot adjust on that I guess.