Phizzy

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Posts by Phizzy

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  86

  New light on shunning?

  by Mikejw in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  one theory why tony was booted out was because he was a stickler for not changing the shunning doctrine.

  he actually said the words we will never ever change it.. they are slowly deleting all of tony’s videos and now losing court cases and losing government hand outs in places like norway.. it’s looking very likely they will release new light on shunning policy after losing this latest one in norway.. .

  what are the odds they coincidentally get new light from jehovah and lighten up their shunning policy ?.

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  Phizzy

  Found this on F.B

  
  
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  23

  When will the Watchtower Society be desolated?

  by Hiddenservant in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  did you know that the answer is provided in the scriptures through the 70 weeks prophecy?.

  daniel’s 70 weeks prophecy explained.. the 70 weeks were split into three parts.

  here is the reason why.. the prophecy is not only about the messiah, it is also about god’s people and the holy city, as verse 24 makes clear.

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  Phizzy

  " when the money runs out " Spot on ! that is the only way they will come to an end, and even then a few deluded J.W's will hang on to their beliefs.

  The O.P is the most utter nonsense. The Book of Daniel contains NO prophecies for a later time, the Writer says he expects his predictions to happen shortly after the time he wrote, which was actually in the 2nd century BCE. The Work was completed just before 164 BCE.

  To look for a later fulfillment is just plain silly.
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  32

  Punkofnice

  by jhine in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  does anyone know how punky is ?

  he hasn't posted in a while ?

  jan from tam .

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  Phizzy

  Thanks Jan !

  I am glad he is O.K ! thanks for your efforts to contact him, its like trying to get hold of someone who works for MI6 !
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  5

  The Old Testament TRINITY!

  by BoogerMan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  clearly inferred & proven by scriptures - though not specifically stated - that the 3 were one & the same essence!

  (exodus 2:24) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (exodus 3:16) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (exodus 6:3) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (exodus 6:8) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (exodus 33:1) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (numbers 32:11) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (deuteronomy 1:8) abraham, isaac and jacob.. (deuteronomy 6:10) abraham, isaac and jacob.

  (deuteronomy 9:5) abraham, isaac and jacob.

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  Phizzy

  Are you aware of the other Thread by SBF on the Trinity ? maybe best to join that ?
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  78

  God, one person, or three?

  by slimboyfat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the trinity doctrine says god is three persons in one being.. yet the bible says god is one.. gal 3.20 a mediator, however, implies more than one party; but god is one.

  niv.

  gal 3.20 now a mediator is not for just one person, but god is one.

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  Phizzy

  It strikes me that a lot of the argument about this is based upon the idea that the Bible Writers were inspired and had knowledge from god, therefore we have to argue that because one Scripture says thus and so, another Writer could not have thought differently.

  The Bible is not inspired in any way, so we cannot take what is an Anthology of Writings from very different times in history, and in religious Thought, and try to make sense of it as a whole.

  The Bible Writers had their own concepts of Theology, and later of Christology, often very different and in tension with the thoughts of other Writers.

  The very basis for the Trinity Doctrine can be traced back to the ideas that the Jewish Educated Elite encountered and adopted while in Exile in Babylon, the concept of Hypostasis was not foreign to them, so the three in one, ousia or substance of a deity is not some new 3rd Century C.E idea at all.

  What has complicated matters is anthropomorphising each "substance" or "essence" of the Deity to make them three different individuals within one "Godhead", a concept because of its muddled constituent parts, is difficult for us to process.

  It would have been far easier for Christianity if had stuck to the more understandable concept of god that the Jews had, and if Christians hadn't tried to graft in the Jesus Figure to the person of YHWH.
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  6

  Finger of God

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a myriad (or close) of threads have discussed the depiction of deity in the ot and nt.

  many exjws simply can't seem to wrap their minds around the concept of hypostases of god.

  hypostases as i'm using the term refer to personified conceptualizations of divinity often acting in a particular role.

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  Phizzy

  " however the writings reflect a far more sophisticated and esoteric conception of deity than the WT insists ".

  That is my perception too, it makes me wonder if that sophisticated way of thinking of Deity came from Babylon, it seems not to be there in earlier thought or writings, but unravelling when particular ideas were perhaps written back in to Scripture is a constant struggle.

  In the first century BCE, the Greek historian Diodorus of Sicily praised the Babylonians for their devotion to philosophy. But that thinking may have come from further East, I would imagine these ideas were totally new to the Israelite Elite exiled in Babylon, but they embraced them with alacrity and zeal.

  It is a new thought to me that the so-called "Hellenization" of Jewish Religious thought occurred most likely in Babylon, and they therefore had adopted such ideas before the Greek philosophers like Plato.

  It all adds to the argument that the development and adoption of the Trinity Doctrine is firmly based upon religious thought we find in the whole of the Bible, and is not some upstart doctrine to be rejected out of hand as the W.T, and others do.

  The old canard that the O.T was written by "Bronze Age goat herders" looks even more silly now !
  
  
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  6

  Finger of God

  by peacefulpete in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  a myriad (or close) of threads have discussed the depiction of deity in the ot and nt.

  many exjws simply can't seem to wrap their minds around the concept of hypostases of god.

  hypostases as i'm using the term refer to personified conceptualizations of divinity often acting in a particular role.

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  Phizzy

  I agree, The Evolution from basic anthropomorphising of gods to a more "abstract metaphoric sense" is plain to see as you outline.

  Prof. Francesca Stavrakopoulou , in her excellent, entertaining, and frankly hilarious in places Book, "God an Anatomy" * traces this evolution, and she often quotes what the best Hebrew translation of many Scriptures is, where later Bible Writers obscure the original meaning, and even Translators have tried to obscure what was said.

  She comments on the "Finger of God " engraving upon the tablets that god gave to Moses, as verse Exodus 32 v 16 says, thus " As Yahweh's fingertip crafts the commandments by which his worshippers are to live, he inscribes his physical presence in to the covenant with his people".

  So the simple idea of a god with fingers quickly came to have a deeper meaning.

  * I recommend Prof. Stavrakopoulou's Book, if you haven't read it P.P. and to others on here, it really opens ones eyes to so much that is hidden in Scripture, much of it being the real Sexy bits, sanitised by a number of later hands !
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  12

  What are you wearing for the special talk

  by ExBethelitenowPIMA in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  many are talking on whatsapp about what to wear.

  sisters wearing slacks and brothers wearing all sorts of different tops.

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  Phizzy

  It will be fascinating to see how far the JW's , especially the PIMO ones, are prepared to go with this. Any "Counsel" by old school types can be ignored, as such people now have no mandate.

  How long before we see this ?

  
  
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  23

  New rules for dress & greeting disfellowshipped: It's even worse!

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i know they're panicking and trying to gain favor with governments, former members, prospective converts & those who are teetering, all for financial worries.

  still, the latest update in some ways made things worse, and if there's any jws watching it who are beginning to wake up it should be very disturbing.. starting with dress codes: they say that suits, ties & skirts are no longer required, but in so doing they admit that they were required, something not often appearing as an explicit command in print.

  (similar to how lett referred to the "policy on beards" in his video, even though this direct policy wasn't made available to rank and file.

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  Phizzy

  The "Hounders" now have no basis upon which to do their "hounding", they simply will have to STFU !

  As for the "Stumbling" nonsense, no J.W with any self respect should fall for that`, how can you be "Stumbled" out of the "True religion" over such infantile trivial matters ?

  I remember several instances where people had been "stumbled" over quite serious matters, and no action was taken by the Elders against the offending person, and the offended one was left to stew for a very long time, and then, maybe got a "Shepherding" visit".

  Anybody hounded now can tell the "hounder" to "go forth and multiply" without a qualm.
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  32

  Punkofnice

  by jhine in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  does anyone know how punky is ?

  he hasn't posted in a while ?

  jan from tam .

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  Phizzy

  Just a Bump for this Thread in case anyone who knows Punky ( Paul ? ) hasn't seen it.

  He is from the Peterborough area.