RW
You got me again,Spong is Episcopalian not Catholic, accuracy of statement is important.
As to applying terms like "relativism and Metaphysical naturalism" to modern science or humanism,I have just had this discussion with RWC in the Questions for Atheists and Atheist Myths threads, please read them in their entirety.
I tried in vain to find the quotation you said was from Bertrand Russell's "Why I am Not a Chritian" to put it in context for you.I believe it is possible that such a phrase could have been lifted from one of his works but certainly not carrying the meaning you have attributed to it ,as citing an inescapeable despair resulting from atheism.To quote him from this very book:"I am told that that sort of view is depressing,and people will sometimes tell you that if they believed that they would not be able to go on living.Do not believe it it is all nonsense......Therefore, although it is of course a gloomy view to suppose that life will die out-at least I suppose we may say so,although sometimes when I contemplate the things people do with there lives I think it is almost a consolation-it is not such as to render life miserable.It merely makes you turn your attention to other things. We want to stand upon our own feet and look fair and square at the world-it's good facts, it's bad facts,it's beauties,it' ugliness;see the world as it is,and not be afraid of it....We ought to make the best we can of the world, and if it is not so good as we wish,after all it will still be better than what these others(religionists)have made of it in all these ages.A good world needs knowledge, kindlness and courage,It does not need a regretful hankering after the past,or a fettering of the free intelligence by words uttered long ago by ignorant men.It needs a fearless outlook and free intelligence.It needs hope for the future,not looking back all the time tward a past that is dead,which we trust will be far surpassed by the future that our intelligence can create."
I will not accuse you of quoting creationist literature rather than having read his comments in context.But the thought occurs to me.Any isolated quotes might reflect the author's feelings or may be stating the simple fact that to many theists the position of atheism seems to them to be depressing. As I said earlier despair results from a sense of powerlessness.Every person experiences the emotion at times of diappointment.To charactorize an entire socio/scientific movement as despairing is simply an apeal to emotional consequence.ie:If you don't have God you will be depressed and without hope,so you have to believe in God.
What I have read from Russell and Darwin and others who once held to christian theology before doing the research and reflection that changed their lives,leads me to conclude that the initial feelings of loss resulted from their indoctrination that there must be some "ultimate meaning"for life to be enjoyable. To illustrate if I tell my friend in Guyana that she is a lost princess and that the royal family wants to bring to England and shower her with gifts in the near future, she will no doubt rejoice,but when I tell her 2 yrs later I was lying, her emotional state will be far more gloomy than had I not lied and given her false hope.
So in this case despair comes, if it comes,from disillusionment not reality.This emphasises the need to be supportive if engaged in these debates,recognize the emotional consequences to the person whom I may convince.And try to steer them tward positive and meaningful activity.It also emphasizes the need to teach young people critical thinking skills so they will be spared this turmoil in later life.It is a large step to make this reinventing oneself based upon entirely new realities.But it can be done with help from others who have done it.And lifes "beauties,and good facts"can provide a quality life now and hope for a better tomorrow.
I stand by my statement that Christianity fosters a defeatist personality.Not only am I called a "Good for nothing slave"after working dillegently,but I'm told that human efforts to improve the world are futile and unwittingly Satanic.I noticed that when ever scripture describes God's love for us it is to emphasize His great mercy and our undeservedness of it.Not to elevate our self worth.No doubt you interpret the scriptures differently.
"The only good is happiness and the only way to be happy is to make others so."To paraphrase Robert Ingersoll
It has been fun discussing these things over the past weeks and I would like to thank everyone for commenting in response to my ramblings.I'm back to work Mon and have to say Good-bye.