Well since we are being blunt. I was addressing that to SBF and illustrating the logos concept. I was not describing the Trinity. You also seem to just wish to argue, as I made very clear the theological point that God was not diminished by his emanations. Maybe that is how you can type 970 words in less than 9 minutes. You don't read the comment you are responding to.
peacefulpete
JoinedPosts by peacefulpete
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407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
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colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
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colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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peacefulpete
Think of the fully developed Logos concept this way. If I break off a piece of my Kit-Kat bar, for the action of sharing,
1. That piece is not the whole bar. The bar is greater than the piece. That piece is not THE Kit-Kat bar, but it is at the same time, Kit-Kat bar.
2. It is also true that, the piece exists because of the bar. Before the piece was broken free, it did not exist.
The biggest difference between the Logos concept and my Kit-Kat bar, is that the bar is finite while God (Most High) was conceived of as infinite. The breaking off a piece diminishes my bar but the Most High was not thought of as diminished through his emanations.
Think deeply about this and you will understand 2000 years of theology.
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407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
.
colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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peacefulpete
He rejects the idea that the Logos is “God most high” in the sense of being the Father but affirms the Logos’ full divinity
Yes, that is correct. That is the very definition of the Logos concept. Logos was God in action/at work in the material world. It/He was not the sum of all of the Most High.
SBF...you are also correct that coeternity/coequality with the Father is not found in the NT or most pre-Nicaean Christianity. Before time, the Most High was without emanations. Most early writers held something much closer to the Logos conception of deity.
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Jesus the Maintenance Man
by peacefulpete ini posted on another thread what i thought was an interesting angle, seldom discussed regarding the role of god/logos in holding creation together and its maintenance.
most moderns think of the universe as a self-perpetuating machine, but ancients looked to the god/s to ensure order continued and fertility returned year after year.
we read, throughout the ot, of jews performing prescribed ritual and festivals to ensure god's blessing and providence.
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peacefulpete
If trying to recreate the past, it's important to recognize a tendency to retroject modern perspectives upon the ancient. The elements in the Lord's Prayer (in all its versions) are perfectly consistent with the Kadish and Amidah. The Jewish community for whom Matthew was produced did not wish to make a break from the faith they knew. Kaleb's comments represent a welcomed humanist Reformed Judaism. While his/her overlay on the ancient texts is an admirable interpretation, it would be anachronistic to imagine the OT prayers or the ancient Rabbinic prayers for sun,rain,food, security and good health were psychological tools for self-help. It may well be it has that effect on some, while for others it brings feelings of abandonment and disappointment.
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Jesus the Maintenance Man
by peacefulpete ini posted on another thread what i thought was an interesting angle, seldom discussed regarding the role of god/logos in holding creation together and its maintenance.
most moderns think of the universe as a self-perpetuating machine, but ancients looked to the god/s to ensure order continued and fertility returned year after year.
we read, throughout the ot, of jews performing prescribed ritual and festivals to ensure god's blessing and providence.
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peacefulpete
Shulchan_Arukh%2C_Orach_Chayim.119.1-2 with Connections
If one wanted to add in any of the middle blessings, something similar the blessing, one may add. How so? If one had a sick person, one asks for mercy for [that person] in the blessing of "Refa'einu" ["Heal us"]. If one needs a livelihood, one may ask for it in the "Blessing of the Years". And in [the blessing] of "Shomeya Tefilla" ["Who hears prayers"], one may ask for any of one's needs, for it includes all the requests. Gloss: And when one adds, one should begin the blessing and, after that, add, but one should not add and then begin the blessing (Tur 567). And according to Rabbeinu Yona, when one adds to the blessing something similar to that blessing, if one is adding it on behalf of all of Israel, one says it in plural language and not singular language, and one should only add at the end of the blessing and not the middle. And if one is asking specifically for one's own needs, for example: there is a sick person in one's home or one needs a livelihood, one can ask even in the middle of the blessing, as long as one does so in singular language and not plural language. And in the blessing of "Shomeya Tefilla" and similarly at the end of prayer, either right before "Yihyu l'ratzon" ["May it be acceptable before You"] or after it, one may ask in either singular language or plural language, whether it is specifically for one own needs or for of the public. יש מי שאומר שכשמוסיף בברכה לצורך יחיד לא יאריך: There is one [authority] who says that when one adds to a blessing for one's individual needs, one should not make it lengthy. -
407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
.
colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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peacefulpete
Or aqwsed is God.
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Jesus the Maintenance Man
by peacefulpete ini posted on another thread what i thought was an interesting angle, seldom discussed regarding the role of god/logos in holding creation together and its maintenance.
most moderns think of the universe as a self-perpetuating machine, but ancients looked to the god/s to ensure order continued and fertility returned year after year.
we read, throughout the ot, of jews performing prescribed ritual and festivals to ensure god's blessing and providence.
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peacefulpete
Another interesting parallel is the Jesuine line:
"And when you are praying, do not use meaningless repetition as the Gentiles do, for they suppose that they will be heard for their many words. And in praying use not vain repetitions, as the Gentiles do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking."
And : "One that makes his prayer a fixed task, his prayer is no supplication." (Mishnah Brachot 4:4).
"Be heedful in reciting of the Shema and when you pray make not your prayer a fixed form but plea for mercy." (Pirke Avot 2:13).
Interestingly, the Jesuine caution seems to parallel the intentionality if the Mishna.
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Jesus the Maintenance Man
by peacefulpete ini posted on another thread what i thought was an interesting angle, seldom discussed regarding the role of god/logos in holding creation together and its maintenance.
most moderns think of the universe as a self-perpetuating machine, but ancients looked to the god/s to ensure order continued and fertility returned year after year.
we read, throughout the ot, of jews performing prescribed ritual and festivals to ensure god's blessing and providence.
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407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
.
colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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peacefulpete
Is it possible to program a bot to regurgitate from a fixed collection of arguments? 970 words 9 minutes after my comment.
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407
Is Jesus the Creator?
by Sea Breeze inthat's what the word says.
.
colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..
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peacefulpete
You have to be a bot.
I'll throw back that the Platonists themselves had a monotheistic concept of One. The ancient gods (much like Yahweh) were reinterpreted as essentially aspects of a single divine Principle, (Monism). There was no conflict with monotheism.
But seriously is it even humanly possible to read my comment and respond with 1000 words in less than 9 minutes?