Posts by perspicacia2

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

To TheContagion

Hey! Do you have any problem ?!

Why did you call me in another thread for the same matter?

I've explained the reason of my late answer? I've finished yesterday to translate your message and now i've write the 30% of answer in Italian language!

Are you able to read Italian Language? Do you want i post my answer now? Or do you prefer i finish it and translate it in English ?

I do not live for this NewsGroup, boy! Give me the time please and consider also i've the problem of translation.

Is there anyone in this forum that can help me with the translation? Maybe i could answer in Italian and somebody else could translate it in English!

Frank

14

To perspicacia2 - Continued

by ItsJustlittleoldme in

i appreciate you still wanting to converse on the new 'side' topic that we seem to have started from your original 607 thread.

so, continuing on, you stated please note that all the men are imperfect.

(rom.

Hallo, ItsJustlittleoldme
Yesterday I had a car accident so i could not leave for Austria.
I've read your message wherein you wrote that a lot of Jw run
away in the middle of conversation.
Please consider (as you know) that all Jw are really busy.
Job...Family...Congregation...Field service...personal study
...ect..ect.., we really have not a lot of free-time to converse
in newsgroups.
Anyway, now I'm really sick. I've problems with my neck and
for some days i can not move the head. (i 've a lace around the
neck...i don not know the English name) BUT i'm here to answer
your last messagge.
I don't want you could say i escaped the conversation, but please
consider i will need a little bit of time for every message
for the above reason.

I WROTE:
Please note that all the men are imperfect. (Rom. 5:12)
God knows that. Since the Churchs are composed by men...
all the Churches are imperfect. Even the Churchs of God.
But,once again, God knows that his Church is composed by
imperfect men. So, or you accept the imperfection inside
Church of God, or you will not believe that God has a Church.
But do not confound the imperfections with voluntary sins.

YOU ANSWERED:
I have a couple of questions for this one:
1.) If god knows that all churches are run by imperfect men,
why would god pick just one group of imperfect men above
all others and state "These imperfect men are going to be my
mouthpiece" whereas all the other imperfect men are tools
of Satan?

ME:
You should ask it to God, not to me!
Why God pick one group of persons (Israel) and state
<<this is my people>> ?
and more important:
Why God guided his ancient people through imperfect men like
Moses or the Judges and not through perfect angels?
(Isaiah 55:8-9)

YOU WROTE:
2.) Is it possible that the 'church' Jehovah was talking
about is not a physical entity, but rather the person? So
instead of having a congregation of church goers that all
belong to a single denomination (JW's, Catholics, Protestants
etc) anyone who professes and believes in Christ Jesus and
what he did for us belongs to a world-wide brotherhood of
Christian? If, as the bible says, you should have a personal
relationship with God through Jesus, why do we even need a
man-made imperfect church in the middle of that relationship?

ME:
I do not think so. The bible is clear. In the first century
there was a real Church of God composed by Apostoles, Elders, ect..
They had meetings and they used to go in field service.
Acts 15:6
Acts 15:4
Acts 15:2
Ebrew 10:25
Acts 20:20

YOU WROTE:
3.) Are you stating that the Roman Catholic Church, or any
other church except the JW's are committing voluntary sin?
How so? How do you know that it is just the imperfections
of the men that misinterpreted what the bible states?

ME:
Do you remember what Jesus stated in Matthew 7: 16-20 ?
and Matthew 7: 21-24 ?
and Matthew 15:3 ?
and Matthew 15:9 ?
and Matthew 15:19-20a ?

The volountary sins I was talking about are the same you
can find in the above scriptures. Nothing more, nothing less.

YOU WROTE:
No, you never stated that you will follow the errors. What
you did state was that you would continue to be loyal.
Loyalty implies that you will follow, and following someone
you believe to have errored is forgoeing your conscience
and is the same as committing the error itself?

ME:
I don't think so!
I repeat my previous question:
could you please explain me 1 SAMUEL 26:11 ?
Was David loyal to the Visible Organization or was he loyal
to Jehovah?

YOU WROTE:
I'll give you an example: Let's say that new light comes out
from the GB (doctrine x).. You disagree with doctrine x,
and even contact the GB about it.. They say, that is the
correct interpretation, sorry you do not agree with us, but
doctrine x stands.
Now, to be 'pleasing to god' you are taught to go in field
service.. So, you go out in field service, and you meet
someone who asks about doctrine x. You now have a choice,
you can be loyal to the organization, and teach them doctrine
x all the while believing it to be in error, or you can tell
them that you do not believe in doctrine x in which case you
would become an apostate, right? So, out of loyalty to the
organization, you now teach or at least support a doctrine
that you do not believe in. To me, that is going against
your conscience, and when the day of judgement comes, and
you have to personally account to Jehovah, what will you
tell him?

ME:
Sorry, but i've never teached things that i do not believe
in! So all the above statements are nonsense.
I don't agree some points of WTB but i never teached them
in Field service or in Congregation. I always discussed them
directly with GB and Elders of my congregation. And MY decision
was to wait until God will clarify that points.
**********************************************************
remember, it is the attitude that makes the apostates
**********************************************************

I WROTE:
I can understand your point of view.
Do you remember king Saul?
Note that i do not want to compare GB with Saul, it's just
an EXAMPLE.
He represented the human organization of God, in the past.
You know that he made a lot of mistakes.
He also tried to kill David. So could you please explain me
1 SAMUEL 26:11 ?
Was David loyal to the Visible Organization or was he loyal
to Jehovah?

YOU WROTE:
Huh? How have you proven to me that the GB is indeed to
lord's annointed? That is your claim, not mine..
How come you apply that to the GB, but not to any other
church (Cathlolic, Protestant, etc)? What is the difference;
all of these you mentioned are mere mortal imperfect men,
doing the best that they can to try to 'reason' from the
scriptures, right? After all, does the GB have any direct
revelation from Jehovah, or just a self-made claim
(via imperfect men) that they indeed are God's mouthpiece?

ME:
....wait, wait, wait a minute!!
I was not talking about GB.
I was talking about Saul that represented the ancient
organization of God. And i'm still waiting for the answer:
Was David loyal to the visible Organization or was he
loyal to Jehovah ?

YOU WROTE:
....Explain to me how you are not:
1.) Shunning ex-members
2.) teaching stuff that you may not believe in (going
against your conscience)
3.) stayed seperate from the 'world'
All of the above is based on a man made claim that they are
god's mouthpiece.

ME:
1- Why did you said i'm not shunning ex-members ?
2- Why did you said i'm teaching stuff i do not believe in ?
3- Why did you said i'm not seperate from the 'world'?

(I hope to have understood in the correct way! If not,
please explain me again with simple words.)

YOU WROTE:
...
What if they are wrong, and they are NOT the lord's
annointed ones? What do you think Jehovah will do when that
judgement day comes, and you tell him that you followed
these men, and he asks you why you followed imperfect men,
went against your personal conscience, shunned your loved
ones, and stayed seperate from the world, and rejecting
people I sent to you because you thought they were of the
world, when in-fact they were from me?

ME:
I will answer...
<<Because ,after Jesus, you did not provide any perfect man
to follow.
Because i've passed 18 years of my life in another religion
and i used other years to study other religions again...but
i found the Fruits of the Spirits only through JW's.
I know they are imperfect (as per myself) but i made this
choice in armony with my studies and my conscience.
So, now, if you want to reject me, i'm ready to die with the
absolutely conviction that i made the right thing.>>

But obviously, I'm sure this conversation will never happen.

YOU WROTE:
...
Please show me divine proof that the claim they make of
being god's mouthpieice (the lord's annointed) is accurate.
Otherwise, it is just their word, and they could be wrong,
as we all know they are imperfect men.

ME:
Maybe you do not remember that your above statements are
exactly the same Jesus was talking about in Matthew 12:38-39.
see also:
Luke 23:8
2 Cor 5:7

John 13:35.... I found this kind of love inside the JW
organization. If you found it in some other organization, ok!
Stay there. But when that day will came, remember that
somebody knocked at your door.

Regards.
Frank
P.S.
please do not consider my late answers as a try to escape.
I've also the other thread with a long message to translate
again!

14

To perspicacia2 - Continued

by ItsJustlittleoldme in

i appreciate you still wanting to converse on the new 'side' topic that we seem to have started from your original 607 thread.

so, continuing on, you stated please note that all the men are imperfect.

(rom.

perspicacia2

To tsJustlittleoldme

Sorry, i must leave for Austria country (Job reasons).

I'll be back in one week. Please wait.

Thanks.

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

To TheContagion.

Please give me some time to translate your message.

Frank.

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

YOU WROTE:
Doesn't the bible state that everyone should make up their
own mind, test what is true for themselves, and hold on to
truth..?? By saying such a statement, are you not disregarding scripture?
1 Thessalonians 5:21 - but test everything; hold fast what is good (RSV)
So, does that mean that truth means less to you than loyalty
to an organization? ...

ME:
Hallo.
Please note that all the men are imperfect. (Rom. 5:12)
God knows that. Since the Churchs are composed by men...
all the Churches are imperfect. Even the Churchs of God.
But,once again, God knows that his Church is composed by
imperfect men. So, or you accept the imperfection inside
Church of God, or you will not believe that God has a Church.
But do not confound the imperfections with voluntary sins.

YOU WROTE;
This very statement would scare the bejeebers out of me, since
you have just admitted that you KNOW it is wrong, and yet you
(as with all people) will give a personal account to Jehovah
on his day.. You cannot 'hide' under the organization with this
statement.. You are not blindly following an error, you know an
error (or at least you feel conscieniously an error is being
made) and yet YOU CHOOSE TO FOLLOW THE ERROR...

ME:
This is your statement, not mine! I never said that i will
follow the errors.

I wrote:
<<You can even find something correct in some apostate's book,
as i did. But the correct thing to do is to discuss it directly
with governing body (as I did) and if the information is correct
they will confirm it (as per my cases).>>

I wrote also:
<<You will never be disfellowshipped to have read
a book, but you could in the moment you WILL TEACH something
you have read in that book.>>

I wrote:
<<If I will not agree
with new statements of WT, i will let them know my position
and i will confirm them my loyalty>>

Jesus said we must be one.

I never said that i will <<follow the errors>>.
Please do not misunderstand my words. (maybe it's a my problem
with English language, you know it's not my native language).

YOU WROTE:....
Help me to understand how this is not so, as I cannot see it
any other way..

ME:
I can understand your point of view.
Do you remember king Saul?
Note that i do not want to compare GB with Saul, it's just
an EXAMPLE.
He represented the human organization of God, in the past.
You know that he made a lot of mistakes.
He also tried to kill David. So could you please explain me
1 SAMUEL 26:11 ?
Was David loyal to the Visible Organization or was he loyal
to Jehovah?

***********************************************************
it is the attitude that makes the apostates.
***********************************************************

It's a pleasure for me to discuss with you, but this was not
the subject of the thread.
Please open a new thread, if you want to go on.

In my previous message i wrote:
.....
So, for a while, let's forget the Jerusalemm fall.

- 539 is a sure date. (they say it is... or not?)
- 537 is the year of hebrews return. (if not please explain)
- back of 70 years we arrive to 607. (if not please explain)
- 70 years are a symbol of Satan's rule (I've different secular
books that makes this statement)
- also the seven times are the symbol of Satan's rule

If the 70 years started from 607 (537+70 ; without talking about
Jerusalemm fall) also the 7 times should start from the
same point. (if not please explain)

Could you please tell me what's wrong in the above statements

Regards
Frank.

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

Hello Step,

YOU WROTE:
Can we presume that you have read Carl Jonnson's 'Gentile Times Revisited'?
If so, can you explain why you feel that the numerous lines of evidence
that he presents in this book, one of the most well researched on the
subject that I have ever read, are incorrect.

Sorry, I didn't. All the informationas I have came from WTB ,
APOSTATE's web-sites and some Italian books.
Could you please give me details to order it ?

YOU WROTE:
We are all aware that the Biblie is not a book of chronology
and that it contains very few dates, inclusing 607BCE or 587BCE,
so dates need to be resolved on body of evidence.

<<the Biblie is not a book of chronology>>
Isn't it??!
Could you explain me Daniel 9:2, please ?

YOU WROTE:
The WTS have never seriously attempted to challenge Carl Jonnson's
research. The closest they come to challenging him, is to forbid,
upon risk of disfellowshipping, persons like yourself from reading his
findings.

HA HA HA! I've read a lot of apostate's books and i'm stronger
than ever. Maybe you are making a mistake or you think that
i'm a new one. You will never disfellowshipped to have read
a book, but you could in the moment you will teach something
you have read in that book.
You can even find something correct in some apostate's book,
as i did. But the correct thing to do is to discuss it directly
with governing body (as I did) and if the information is correct
they will confirm it (as per my cases).
So:
***********************************************************
it is the attitude and not the information that make the apostates.
***********************************************************
But this was not the subject of the thread.

So, for a while, let's forget the Jerusalemm fall.

- 539 is a sure date. (they say it is... or not?)
- 537 is the year of hebrews return. (if not please explain)
- back of 70 years we arrive to 607. (if not please explain)
- 70 years are a symbol of Satan's rule (I've different secular
books that makes this statement)
- also the seven times are the symbol of Satan's rule

If the 70 years started from 607 (537+70 ; without talking about
Jerusalemm fall) also the 7 times should start from the
same point. (if not please explain)

Could you please tell me what's wrong in the above statements?

Please take note that i will continue this discussion with you
only, because your words sounds good (sorry i'm not able to
explain what i mean in English language but you can check what
the others told me : <<i'm suffering of some syndrome>>, <<I'm hypocrite>>,
<<I elevated myself to a position of Judge>>, ect ect)

Regards
Frank.

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

I will not leave the BORG because i know they are imperfect men
and they can make mistakes.
DO NOT CONFOUND LOYALTY WITH PERFECTION.

YOU WROTE:

My guess is that you will not state the above, because you
know in your heart that if the organization came out tomorrow
and said, "upon reexamination of the scriptures, we conclude
that Jerusalem was destroyed in 539 BCE" you would suddenly
look back at the scriptures they used to arrive at the new
date, and say, yup, I see that... Thank Jehovah for giving
us new light...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

If the WTBTS will say that, they will have to explain it.
At today, i've examined the documents (VAT 4956 included)
and i do belive in 607.
If in the next future other documents will be found, then i
will re-examine the situation and the new WT statements.
If i will agree, than i will say: Sorry ..we made a mistake.
(I've no problems about humility). If I will not agree
with new statements of WT, i will let them know my position
and i will confirm them my loyalty. I'm sure in the New
World God will let us know a lot of new informations.

About the Pharisees, the oral traditions was more important of
bible. That's why i do not think it's a good compare.
Anyway, as you can check in my previous message, the subject
was: why I do believe in 607. I have not the pretension to force to
convince others.

Frank.
p.s.

Sorry for my Engilish. It's not my native language.

68

why i do believe in 607

by perspicacia2 in

the bible reports that the babylonians under nebuchadnezzar destroyed .

chronology, the desolation of jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6 .

babylon (in his accession year, 605 b.c.e.

perspicacia2

Historians hold that Babylon fell to Cyrus army in October 539 B.C.E.
Nabonidus was then king, but his son Belshazzar was coruler of Babylon. Some
scholars have worked out a list of the Neo-Babylonian kings and the length of
their reigns, from the last year of Nabonidus back to Nebuchadnezzars father
Nabopolassar.
According to that Neo-Babylonian chronology, Crown-prince Nebuchadnezzar
defeated the Egyptians at the battle of Carchemish in 605 B.C.E. (Jeremiah
46:1, 2) After Nabopolassar died Nebuchadnezzar returned to Babylon to assume
the throne. His first regnal year began the following spring (604 B.C.E.).
The Bible reports that the Babylonians under Nebuchadnezzar destroyed
Jerusalem in his 18th regnal year (19th when accession year is included).
(Jeremiah 52:5, 12, 13, 29) Thus if one accepted the above Neo-Babylonian
chronology, the desolation of Jerusalem would have been in the year 587/6
B.C.E. But on what is this secular chronology based and how does it compare
with the chronology of the Bible?
Some major lines of evidence for this secular chronology are:
Ptolemys Canon: Claudius Ptolemy was a Greek astronomer who lived in the
second century C.E. His Canon, or list of kings, was connected with a work on
astronomy that he produced. Most modern historians accept Ptolemys
information about the Neo-Babylonian kings and the length of their reigns
(though Ptolemy does omit the reign of Labashi-Marduk). Evidently Ptolemy
based his historical information on sources dating from the Seleucid period,
which began more than 250 years after Cyrus captured Babylon. It thus is not
surprising that Ptolemys figures agree with those of Berossus, a Babylonian
priest of the Seleucid period.
Nabonidus Harran Stele (NABON H 1, B): This contemporary stele, or pillar
with an inscription, was discovered in 1956. It mentions the reigns of the
Neo-Babylonian kings Nebuchadnezzar, Evil-Merodach, Neriglissar. The figures
given for these three agree with those from Ptolemys Canon.
VAT 4956: This is a cuneiform tablet that provides astronomical information
datable to 568 B.C.E. It says that the observations were from Nebuchadnezzar
s 37th year. This would correspond to the chronology that places his 18th
regnal year in 587/6 B.C.E. However, this tablet is admittedly a copy made in
the third century B.C.E. so it is possible that its historical information is
simply that which was accepted in the Seleucid period.
Business tablets: Thousands of contemporary Neo-Babylonian cuneiform tablets
have been found that record simple business transactions, stating the year of
the Babylonian king when the transaction occurred. Tablets of this sort have
been found for all the years of reign for the known Neo-Babylonian kings in
the accepted chronology of the period.
From a secular viewpoint, such lines of evidence might seem to establish the
Neo-Babylonian chronology with Nebuchadnezzars 18th year (and the
destruction of Jerusalem) in 587/6 B.C.E. However, no historian can deny the
possibility that the present picture of Babylonian history might be
misleading or in error. It is known, for example, that ancient priests and
kings sometimes altered records for their own purposes. Or, even if the
discovered evidence is accurate, it might be misinterpreted by modern
scholars or be incomplete so that yet undiscovered material could drastically
alter the chronology of the period.
Evidently realizing such facts, Professor Edward F. Campbell, Jr., introduced
a chart, which included Neo-Babylonian chronology, with the caution: "It goes
without saying that these lists are provisional. The more one studies the
intricacies of the chronological problems in the ancient Near East, the less
he is inclined to think of any presentation as final. For this reason, the
term circa [about] could be used even more liberally than it is."The Bible
and the Ancient Near East (1965 ed.), p. 281.
Christians who believe the Bible have time and again found that its words
stand the test of much criticism and have been proved accurate and reliable.
They recognize that as the inspired Word of God it can be used as a measuring
rod in evaluating secular history and views. (2 Timothy 3:16, 17) For
instance, though the Bible spoke of Belshazzar as ruler of Babylon, for
centuries scholars were confused about him because no secular documents were
available as to his existence, identity or position. Finally, however,
archaeologists discovered secular records that confirmed the Bible. Yes, the
Bibles internal harmony and the care exercised by its writers, even in
matters of chronology, recommends it so strongly to the Christian that he
places its authority above that of the ever-changing opinions of secular
historians.
But how does the Bible help us to determine when Jerusalem was destroyed, and
how does this compare to secular chronology?
The prophet Jeremiah predicted that the Babylonians would destroy Jerusalem
and make the city and land a desolation. (Jeremiah 25:8, 9) He added: "And
all this land must become a devastated place, an object of astonishment, and
these nations will have to serve the king of Babylon seventy years."
(Jeremiah 25:11) The 70 years expired when Cyrus the Great, in his first
year, released the Jews and they returned to their homeland. (2 Chronicles
36:17-23) We believe that the most direct reading of Jeremiah 25:11 and other
texts is that the 70 years would date from when the Babylonians destroyed
Jerusalem and left the land of Judah desolate.Jeremiah 52:12-15, 24-27;
36:29-31.
Yet those who rely primarily on secular information for the chronology of
that period realize that if Jerusalem were destroyed in 587/6 B.C.E.
certainly it was not 70 years until Babylon was conquered and Cyrus let the
Jews return to their homeland. In an attempt to harmonize matters, they claim
that Jeremiahs prophecy began to be fulfilled in 605 B.C.E. Later writers
quote Berossus as saying that after the battle of Carchemish Nebuchadnezzar
extended Babylonian influence into all Syria-Palestine and, when returning to
Babylon (in his accession year, 605 B.C.E.), he took Jewish captives into
exile. Thus they figure the 70 years as a period of servitude to Babylon
beginning in 605 B.C.E. That would mean that the 70-year period would expire
in 535 B.C.E.
But there are a number of major problems with this interpretation:
Though Berossus claims that Nebuchadnezzar took Jewish captives in his
accession year, there are no cuneiform documents supporting this. More
significantly, Jeremiah 52:28-30 carefully reports that Nebuchadnezzar took
Jews captive in his seventh year, his 18th year and his 23rd year, not his
accession year. Also, Jewish historian Josephus states that in the year of
the battle of Carchemish Nebuchadnezzar conquered all of Syria-Palestine
"excepting Judea," thus contradicting Berossus and conflicting with the claim
that 70 years of Jewish servitude began in Nebuchadnezzars accession year.
Antiquities of the Jews X, vi, 1.
Furthermore, Josephus elsewhere describes the destruction of Jerusalem by the
Babylonians and then says that "all Judea and Jerusalem, and the temple,
continued to be a desert for seventy years." (Antiquities of the Jews X, ix,
7) He pointedly states that "our city was desolate during the interval of
seventy years, until the days of Cyrus." (Against Apion I, 19) This agrees
with 2 Chronicles 36:21 and Daniel 9:2 that the foretold 70 years were 70
years of full desolation for the land. Second-century (C.E.) writer
Theophilus of Antioch also shows that the 70 years commenced with the
destruction of the temple after Zedekiah had reigned 11 years.See also 2
Kings 24:1825:21.
But the Bible itself provides even more telling evidence against the claim
that the 70 years began in 605 B.C.E. and that Jerusalem was destroyed in
587/6 B.C.E. As mentioned, if we were to count from 605 B.C.E., the 70 years
would reach down to 535 B.C.E. However, the inspired Bible writer Ezra
reported that the 70 years ran until "the first year of Cyrus the king of
Persia," who issued a decree allowing the Jews to return to their homeland.
(Ezra 1:1-4; 2 Chronicles 36:21-23) Historians accept that Cyrus conquered
Babylon in October 539 B.C.E. and that Cyrus first regnal year began in the
spring of 538 B.C.E. If Cyrus decree came late in his first regnal year, the
Jews could easily be back in their homeland by the seventh month (Tishri) as
Ezra 3:1 says; this would be October 537 B.C.E.
However, there is no reasonable way of stretching Cyrus first year from 538
down to 535 B.C.E. Some who have tried to explain away the problem have in a
strained manner claimed that in speaking of "the first year of Cyrus" Ezra
and Daniel were using some peculiar Jewish viewpoint that differed from the
official count of Cyrus reign. But that cannot be sustained, for both a
non-Jewish governor and a document from the Persian archives agree that the
decree occurred in Cyrus first year, even as the Bible writers carefully and
specifically reported.Ezra 5:6, 13; 6:1-3; Daniel 1:21; 9:1-3.
Jehovahs "good word" is bound up with the foretold 70-year period, for God
said:
"This is what Jehovah has said, In accord with the fulfilling of seventy
years at Babylon I shall turn my attention to you people, and I will
establish toward you my good word in bringing you back to this place."
(Jeremiah 29:10)
Daniel relied on that word, trusting that the 70 years were not a round
number but an exact figure that could be counted on. (Daniel 9:1, 2) And
that proved to be so.
Similarly, we are willing to be guided primarily by Gods Word rather than by
a chronology that is based principally on secular evidence or that disagrees
with the Scriptures. It seems evident that the easiest and most direct
understanding of the various Biblical statements is that the 70 years began
with the complete desolation of Judah after Jerusalem was destroyed.
(Jeremiah 25:8-11; 2 Chronicles 36:20-23; Daniel 9:2) Hence, counting back 70
years from when the Jews returned to their homeland in 537 B.C.E., we arrive
at 607 B.C.E. for the date when Nebuchadnezzar, in his 18th regnal year,
destroyed Jerusalem, removed Zedekiah from the throne and brought to an end
the Judean line of kings on a throne in earthly Jerusalem.Ezekiel 21:19-27.

Frank.

13

Noah's Flood & Other Bible Stories

by Sentinel in

did anyone catch the east coast tlc (the learning channel) programs last night?

the first one was about noah's flood.

the program after that was about sodom & gammorah, the ancient apocalypse.. the programs were trying to establish that events have happened, and have been recorded, but the facts have been distorted within the structures of various existing societies inside the bounds of "religious dogma".

perspicacia2

www.noahsark.it

59

JEHOVAH JUDGES ABUSIVE ELDERS

by You Know in

repeatedly, the scriptures admonish jehovahs people to stay in wakeful anticipation of gods judgments.

the not so obvious reason being that we don't know exactly how jehovah's judgments are going to go down.

however, the ordering of events once the judgment commences should not be in question.

perspicacia2

Please ,YouKnow, contact me at [email protected]
I would like to ask you something.

Thanks.

Your brother
Frank (active & loyal JW as U R)