another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.
is this not "terror" in itself?
at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?
am not talking about enlightening the "foreigners".I am talking about enlightening Americans.
So was I Focus. With all the wealth of knowledge available to us, with all the examples in recent history, with all the knowledge of recent history - we still seemed to have not learned a thing.
another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.
is this not "terror" in itself?
at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?
I couldn't agree more with you Focus that it is our "foreign" and domestic policies that gets us into so much hot water. I don't think that many were interested enough in our "political" process or how we interact with the world in general to understand the choices that we have the responsibility to understand and make living in a "free" society. I believe a majority of Americans are getting a crash coure in foreign policy. Up until 9/11, i doubt very few could have cared less about it as long as they could drive their SUV's, go to their secure jobs & live the "high" life that fewer than 8% of this earth live.
But I would disagree that "enlightening" and knowledge is going to do the trick, at least in the near future. Perhaps as a couple of generations pass, perhaps. But, we've had a couple of generations & a few wars from which to become "enlightened", and all that is happening is things like 9/11, the threat of biological & chemical agents, "suitcase" nucelor weapons & suicide bombers. Its not getting better, its getting worse.
I will say again, I'm sure that this article made front headlines because of the fact that they were muslims. Had it been any other ethnic group, it might have made page 28 in the lower left corner & 3 sentences. No one would have even noticed or cared. Most would have been happy to see us taking "steps" towards the illegal alien situation existing in our country. Does it make this situation right? It depends on how our immigration department usually handles these types of things. I mean, who here knows whether or not this happens, say in Miami from time to time & never makes the headline news?
On a final note, I'm not sure who was "painting" all Arabs with the same brush. There are millions of Arabs living and working amongst us. I'm sure most of us have friends who are of middle eastern descent. I personally wouldn't want to see any of them harassed or "scrutinized" because of their ethnic background. As the article stated, the ones rounded up were either illegally living in this country, expired visa's or had warrants out for them. While it obviously is "ethnically" motivated, I don't know enough about our immigration department to know whether or not "sweeps" of this nature do occur in other places with other ethnic groups. I just know they have their hands full at the moment trying to figure out who is & who isn't in this country by itself, not including trying to figure out which ones are "terrorist cells" awaiting orders from their leaders.
another fine example of the violation of civil liberties perpetrated by the bush administration / ashcroft-led justice department under the guise of fighting "terror.
is this not "terror" in itself?
at what point is it acceptable for the american people to allow such actions to be committed against fellow american citizens simply because these people are of arab descent?
The 2 snipers although black were converted muslims.
And Francois, I can't remember the name, but wasn't there an American (white) man that hijacked not 1 but 2 planes after commiting bank robberies?
Anyways, regardless, I think the government is really between a rock & a hard place. If they don't go to these extremes & something happens again, they'll be ridiculed for not having "done enough" in rounding of "suspected" terrorists. Look at how much heat they're taking for 9/11 as it is. Then, when they do this type of thing, it makes alot of Americans feel uneasy as they can slowly see the government stripping us of our "freedoms". Wasn't it just a few weeks ago Bush was wanting to "revise" the Miranda rights to allow for questioning of suspects before their rights are known?
I don't like these people being "rounded" up anymore than any of the "nay-sayers" here. It is wrong when done on such a "biased" way. But, given the constraints of "personnel", and the sham of an immigration department as it stands, I don't see how they can realistically do anything else.
And for those that keep bringing up "Timothy McVeigh" - I'm sure since that terrorist act the government has been keeping a MUCH closer eye on the type of groups that caused him to exist in the first place. We don't hear about it in the paper, but if you read any of their controversial websites they feel like they're getting screwed all over the place!
I think as Americans we should be questioning ALOT of the basic rights that this particular government in their "war" stage are slowly eroding. This is just another example. And, the fact that these people were "Muslims" is what made it hit the news. I don't think this necessarily means it ISNT happening to other "illegal" immigrants.
Rhonda (of the torn between our rights & our safety class)
forgiveness is something that god asks of us.
if we forgive others, we shall also be forgiven.
since it is so important to forgive, i wonder if the congregation forgives our faults, or if they mark down in a file all our wrong doings that they can find.
Only if you're popular. If you're not - you're SOL
been here awhile now, mostly as a lurker, but while reading alot of posts, i feel justified in formulating an opinion on who the coolest person on this board is.
so my vote goes to ....drum roll.... .
valis .
Yes Valis - we can do battle in the plastic bubble to see who gains the title of coolest
been here awhile now, mostly as a lurker, but while reading alot of posts, i feel justified in formulating an opinion on who the coolest person on this board is.
so my vote goes to ....drum roll.... .
valis .
RT said
I got a plastic bubble for sale. Anyone want to buy it, climb in and get in the fetal position?If I can come up with something better to do in the plastic bubble, can I be coolest?!
what gets to me is when i hear a story that gets embellished .
it's worse when someone relates the story and i was the original teller of it....what about you?
neo-nazis - I hate um!
i would love some support since i am scared and confused, but i don't know where to turn.
my husband and i are both having our eyes opened wide after years of doubts.
we have finally read the "apostate literature" over the past few weeks and have checked and rechecked their sources.
First, take a step back and take a deep breath. Relax, this is the beginning of although bumpy, a valuable journey.
You and your husband are stepping back together - and thats a real real wonderful thing. So many here have left w/out their mates & lost their entire families.
You are already taking step #1 - to learn about the organization you & hubby have been raised in. Continue to learn. You don't have to all of the sudden make some "announcement" to those you know & love. You can slowly fade if that's easier.
Step #2 - try to be kind to each other through this process. It could get rough at times for both of you. Love each other & use patience, its hard when your entire belief structure falls around your feet & you have to pick up the pieces.
Just keep posting here, ask questions - trust me, you'll learn what to do.....no one can answer that question for you - its too individualistic & personal.
There are ex-JW meet-ups around the country - take a look at the link at the bottom of this page.
And welcome to the board!
during your lifetime or after you pass away, what do you want your legacy to be?
what do you want people to remember about you?
That I cared....that I tried in every way to be a good person, and that I was a good mother to my children, and hopefully some day my grandchildren. And that I knew real love, both giving and taking.
i heard judy garland sing, have yourself a merry little christmas today and it brought back probably the best memory of my early childhood.
it was christmas morning 1966 and i was 4 years old.
we were moving in a week and leaving for texas.
((BigTex))
that was beautiful, although it makes me mourn for a small boy that could not have seen more of the beauty in the world, instead of so much unhappiness. Thank goodness we all eventually become adults and can find our own way!
