Posts by Drearyweather

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Drearyweather

things referred to in Mathew 7:21-23 are absolute which can mean one and the same thing in any context

True. In fact, for a Christian what Jesus told in all the four Gospels are absolute and in harmony with each other. That's my point.

6

If JWs are living "The Best Life Ever," then why preach?

by JW_Rogue in

shouldn't the unhappy and unfulfilled worldly people see what jws have and be drawn to them?

shouldn't they be showing up at khs asking for bible studies?

at work shouldn't they be asking how jws families are so happy?

Drearyweather

The "Best Life Ever" is the one defined by Jesus:“If anyone wants to come after me, let him disown himself and pick up his torture stake and keep following me.

Do you think anyone would want this life? That's what makes missionary activity a heck of a job.

I mean everyone wants true happiness, so why work so hard for new members?

There are different charities everywhere in the world. The volunteers working there say that it gives them true happiness and purpose in life. If they claim that they are truly happy, then why do you think they work hard to have all these fundraising programs to attract more volunteers and raise funds?

A cause that makes me happy may not necessarily ring with you. If you want a following for your cause then it takes insane levels of promotional activities, no matter how noble the cause is.

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Drearyweather

Drearyweather, Jesus himself says in Mathew 7:21-23 that he would not make such statements.

That's a bit absurd. The rock mentioned in Matt 16:18 is Jesus and not Peter. Eph 2:20 says that Jesus was the cornerstone of the true Christian faith. Peter and other apostles did take the lead but formed a part of the foundation, not the cornerstone itself. No way does it contradict with Matt 7:21-23.

Matt 7:21-23 says that those who do the will of God will be acknowledged by Jesus. The will of God was explained by Jesus and the other apostles who came after him and wrote the other books of the Bible.

If a scripture somewhere looks out of context then that means that it is necessary to dig deeper to understand the events when they were told. Matt 7 was a part of the Sermon on the mount told to a group of thousands of believers and unbelievers, whereas Matt 16:11-28 was a part of a private conversation between Jesus and his apostles. Jesus was preparing his apostles for his upcoming death and thus the conversation dealt with uncomfortable subjects leading to Peters admonition to Jesus and Jesus' resulting rebuke.

In the Sermon on the mount, Jesus told that blessed are the peacemakers. (Matt 5:9) But later, while sending his disciples for preaching, Jesus told that he has come not to make peace but with a sword. (Matt 10:34). Two different occasions, with different people addressed and in different contexts. Not contradictory.

Discrediting a scripture as not spoken by Jesus because we cannot reconcile it with the context is like me telling that Einstein did not invent the theory of relativity because I can't understand it.

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Drearyweather

Church required a verse that says it is appointed by God, hence they added such portion in Mathew 16:18.

Interesting. How do you know that the verse was added? Do you have evidence that the early manuscripts did not have this verse?

How do you come to a conclusion that one verse is inspired and one is not?

19

Diminishing glory of JWs, confusions are at the root

by Ireneus in

when the world shuns jws because of difference of opinion, it is described as the action of satan.. when jws shun others because of difference of opinion, it is described as theocratic action.. such confused mind is at the root of getting wrong teachings.

jws shun anything what anyone would rate as the best of the bible or christian traditions:.

1)cross (with a longer descending arm) is the symbol of controlling the less powerful (“acts of the flesh”) with the more powerful (“spirit” within)—galatians 5:17, 19, 25.

Drearyweather

On an individual level, people can believe any story that they want whether historical or not. You can even make up stories to further your point. But a story cannot be attributed to Jesus because it is moral and fits the narrative.

However, if you are tasked to prepare an edition of the Holy Bible, then you are bound to include only stories that are accepted as historical and appeared in the earliest canons. If such unverified stories are included, then the book should be entitled: "Ethical stories of the past", and not the Holy Bible.

It's like preparing a corporate presentation for your client about your services. You can't include a case study of a project just because it looks good and is appealing. It needs to be verified, authentic, true and a project handled by you.

46

What is the most troubling or disturbing biblical passage you ever had to rationalise when a Jw?

by stuckinarut2 in

now that we have stepped away from the jw faith, how do you feel about the bible itself?.

what about those awkward sections of scripture?

how did you rationalise or justify those sections?.

Drearyweather

For me, the genocide mentioned in the Bible is less disturbing than the Holocaust, WW1 and WW2

7

Isaiah 45:7 I make peace, and create evil

by pleaseresearch in

what is your thought on this particular scripture?.

how do you think a jw would respond to this if shown?.

king james biblei form the light, and create darkness: i make peace, and create evil: i the lord do all these things..

Drearyweather

How do you think a JW would respond to this if shown?

Here's the official answer from the WT:

Why does Isaiah 45:7 state that Jehovah God creates evil, when we know him to be good and righteous in all his ways?—C. S., Ontario, Canada.

Isaiah 45:7 states: “I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create evil; I am Jehovah, that doeth all these things.” (AS) Jehovah God sows light for righteously disposed ones, and through his Word the Bible enlightens their minds, but he brings mental darkness upon those who willfully continue in a wrong course. (Ps. 82:5-7; 97:11; 2 Pet. 2:4; Jude 13) Peace of mind, even now, is the lot of those devoted to God and his service, and in the new world under the reign of his Prince of Peace all then living will rejoice in that blessed state forever. (Ps. 72:1, 4, 7, 8; Isa. 9:6, 7) As for the statement that God creates evil, it does not mean anything or any practice that is morally wrong. “Evil” as here used does not mean moral evil, of which God could never be guilty, but it refers to a calamity or disaster or destruction, such as he brings upon his unrepentant foes, and that particularly at the battle of Armageddon. From rebellious Adam’s time onward punishment has come from God upon the willfully wicked, and this has been wholly just on God’s part, but it has been as an evil to the ones meriting it. This matter is discussed at great length in the two-part article entitled “Peace and Evil”, appearing in the May 1 and 15, 1930, issues of The Watchtower.

https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1951290

7

To big to fail

by pepperheart in

some people think the watchtower is to big to fail.

i dont because a lot of the branch offices around the world (about 70 i think) are in the third world they are not paying the full cost of running them and so the american branch is having to find the money,so if they got $1 billion dollars betwwen 70 branches that is only$ 25 million a year.per branch.if each branch has 500 people working there and they spend just $1 a day for food each person that works out at £35,000 just for the food alone .

Drearyweather

It is difficult to compare the JW's with other corporations which have failed because people don't rely on the WT for their financial sustenance. In fact, it is the JW's who have kept the WT financially fed. With 8 million volunteers who spend all their own money for the WT, it is difficult to see it collapse the way other corporations have.

If the WT was to fail financially, JW's will still cling on to it and adapt themselves to whatever is remaining. Or maybe they will consider it as the beginning of the great tribulation and may dig deeper in.

9

Family members return to the cult years after not being assoicated.

by blownaway in

i have a couple of family members who not so much went back but never were associated and joined.

one is a cousin, he is about 60 now.

maybe a bit older.

Drearyweather

Not all people who are awake leave the JW's. (PIMO)

Not all people who leave the JW's are awake. (POMI)

18

"This Good news Of The Kingdom Will Be Preached In All The Inhabited Earth" ........

by smiddy3 in

..".for a witness to all the nations and then the end will come" .matt.24:14.. the religion of jehovah`s witnesses kid themselves into thinking they are filling or have fulfilled this prophecy/scripture .. given that you take the jehovah`s witnesses and the international bible students association as one and the same religion , then they have been preaching their message primarily within lands that are predominantly christian based.....and certainly do not cover "all the inhabited earth " as their are many populous non christian nations nations that do not allow, even forbid any proselytizing in their lands.

i would estimate about one third of the current world population.. but that is not all .. given that you take the jehovah`s witnesses and the international bible students association as one and the same religion ,then they have about 140 years of preaching their beliefs to the public specifically to preach "this good news of the kingdom " as they claim to do in obedience to j.c.commands at matt.24:14.. take a survey no matter where you live on this planet earth of the people in your locality and if you asked them "what was the message jehovah`s witnesses left you and no one would be able to say "they told me about and explained to me the good news of the kingdom" and what it would mean to me.. no one would be able to say that .after 140 years of preaching and witnessing by what is now 8 million plus jehovah`s witnesses .. what a waste of time and energy and lives .. after 140 years of preaching what do the public know about jehovah`s witnesses ?.

they don`t take blood transfusions .

Drearyweather

then they have been preaching their message primarily within lands that are predominantly Christian based..

Yes. But JW's are present with branch offices in the most populous Muslim country in the world (Indonesia) and the most populous Hindu country in the world (India). I should say JW's were present in countries like China, North Korea, Afganistan till the time they are persecuted. When persecuted JW's are not obligated by Jesus to remain in that country since Jesus said in Matthew 10:23: When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another."

as their are many populous non Christian nations nations that do not allow, even forbid any proselytizing in their lands.

There are 2 lines of reasoning given for these countries which don't have much witnessing work going on:

1. Not all territories will be preached before the end.

*** w97 8/15 p. 14 par. 11 Living for Today or for an Eternal Future?***

True, untouched territories still exist, and perhaps in Jehovah’s due time, a door of opportunity will open. (1 Corinthians 16:9) Still, Jesus’ words recorded at Matthew 10:23 are sobering: “You will by no means complete the circuit of the cities of Israel until the Son of man arrives.” While the good news will surely be announced throughout the earth, we will not in person reach all parts of the earth with the Kingdom message before Jesus “arrives” as Executioner.

2. Countries that don't allow preaching activity bear community responsibility for their actions - the way Egyptians suffered the 10 plagues because of Pharoah's hard-heartedness.

No one would be able to say "They told me about and explained to me the Good news of the Kingdom" and what it would mean to me.

Jw's have been conditioned to reason that they are not responsible for how people react to their message. They need to get going with the work no matter what people say about them. 2 Thess 1:8 is a favorite scripture that says Jesus will take vengeance on those who do not obey the good news. So if people don't remember the good news then it's the people's mistake. Same as if you forget your medicines then it is your mistake, not the doctors.